Making money early on?

[Steve from Dk]

Seems impossible to me. I just started to play the game against yesterday and I started easy out on the King level, as I had won the SS race several times on Diety - a thing that I've did in Alpha Centauri too.

But in my third game (the best so far) I just can't make money. My pop is over 4 millions and I'm in the year 510 AD. I'm corruntly using Monarchy. I just found myself making 17 bucks a month, but I had to pay 30 for upkeep. Then I had to move the tax, so I get 50% in tax and 50% for science.

Does anyone have any advice on how to make money early on?

------------------
Livin' on a prayer by Bon Jovi - Numeró uno on VH1's top 40 of the 80's.

 

[goodbye_mr_bond]

Welcome to Civfanatics!

THere are all kinds of way to make cash, but the best is to grow your cities, and develop a solid economy. Marketplaces are a must--in a monarchy on king, you should be able to build them before you need temples. THey not only make you cash, they aid in making your citizens happy if your lux rate is higher than 0.

Also, what kinds of city improvements are you building? Are you sure you need them at this stage? (For instance, in monarchy you can use units in your cities for martial law, so you don't usually need temples) Can you build Adam Smith's yet? It makes all city improvements that cost 1 gold, cost nothing. This includes temples, marketplaces, barracks, and most things you're likely to build in the beginning.

Build some trade routes. They are fundamental to developing your economy. Bully the AI civs around a bit. Don't be shy to ask for tributes.

Also, if you play raging horde, you can get 150 gold from capturing a barbarian leader. If you're well-defended in a city, let them attack, then chase down the leader. (If you attak a leader stacked with another barb unit, they both die and you get no bonus.)

Finally, when you capture an enemy city, don't forget to sell off unneeded improvements. If you've got the pyramids, for example, you can sell off all granaries.

 

[Thunderfall]

Don't forget to demand tributes often... I usually demand tributes every 5 turns. Sometimes the AIs give me 200 Golds each time I ask!

 

[Cunobelin Of Hippo]

And if you want Tribute, build a LOT of units. The AI will 'fear' you according to the number of units you have, not according to how good they are

Keep those warriors around

Esp. if you have Marco Polo's.

Stack three deep in a city and they should be forking it ($$$$) over eagerly.

 

[Mindfields]

Did anyone say "traderoute" ???

 

[Mindfields]

oh yes, goodbye_mr_bond did. traderoutes are important, it gives you 100 lights for science + money + trade each time you make a traderoute. So it also speeds up your science.

 

[Aristonico]

BTW, don't build marketplaces too early... They generate more expenses than benefits. I think that the best moment is when your city is producing or is going to produce soon, 3 gold pieces

 

[drake]

If you're producing tons of shields, the cities are growing, the army is healthy and the science is adequate, don't worry so much about money. Sure it's great to have, but it's not as important as the other factors.

 

[Kev]

At King level you should be able to become a republic (and hopefully later a democracy) without too much dissent. Especially if you have either/or the Hanging Gardens/Mich's Chapel. While you may have to bump your luxury rate up a bit, I think that with some decent cities and trade arrows you will find that your financial situation will improve. Bump the luxuries up enough to grow some cities, and then you can really get cookin'.

I'll reiterate as well about the trade routes. Over the past few months I've really been able to see how important they are for so many aspects of the game. There are some good threads on the site, and you can check out the War Academy to get some theories on trade. I wish I knew how to include a hyperlink.



[This message has been edited by Kev (edited August 27, 2001).]

 

[Supernaut]

I used to have the same problem with money running out, but have now cracked it, thanks to the good people on this site (and yes Thundefall, you can use that quote in adverts <IMG SRC="http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/smile.gif" border=0> ). In my experience, what I found worked was:

Using units to keep happiness - so I don't need as many temples and I can more easily demand tribute (this was a spin-off I hadn't anticipated, but I've had up to 450 gold from one civ!!)

Build more settlers - rather than building one settler and then letting a city get to the stage of needing a colosseum, I now build 2 or 3 settlers from a city in its early stages. This keeps population down, so I don't need to pay for happiness improvements; means I can build lots of roads quickly, which boosts trade; and means I am founding more cities, which is always a good thing.

Caravans - can't be emphasised too much. Did you know that when you deliver a caravan it gives you a one-of research bonus as well as the big slug of money? I used to build every available improvement in my cities because I couldn't think what else to do, and you have to be building something. Now, if I don't need anything in that city at the mo, I just churn out caravans - even if I only take them a short distance to one of my own cities, they still give me a bit of cash. Or I can save them to rushbuild wonders.

It's worth investing a bit of cash to get a wonder that saves you money - e.g. sell all your granaries in order to get the cash to build the pyramids before a rival does. Then you'll save loads of upkeep every turn.

And build lots of exploring units to find those goody huts (and the other civs if you haven't got Marco Polo's). Even if they're off on the other side of the world, they still count as your army for intimidation purposes!

Other have mentioned the barbarian trick, but I find raging hordes so annoying that it's not worth the extra cash - but that's just my opinion. See how it works with your gaming style.

I now find that I can keep my taxes at 30% and my science at 70% almost the whole way up to Republic. And once I'm there, money almost becomes no object!

[This message has been edited by Supernaut (edited August 28, 2001).]

 

[thedirk]

There's some good advice here! I started out thinking I might have something to contribute, but it's all been said, and I learned some new things to boot. I have never been much of a tribute demander, but then I have been operating with a small strategically deployed army. Perhaps I will have to build more units and start banging some AI heads for cash.

Thanks guys!

 

[henmike_sigo]

****Disclaimer****
You need a little luck with this, even on raging hordes. Barbarians don't always do the expected and hopefully you will be close enough to take advantage.
****Disclaimer****

One last little trick you might try. Remember the saying that a penny saved is a penny earned? I like using barbarians to create a low cost, no maitenance defense force. IF you're lucky, very early in the game the barbarians destroy a rival civ close to you. Not so lucky, they take over one of your cities. Either works. Continue to build warriors for city order, build higher attack (2 attack or higher) and isolate the barb city.
Kill all barb units that are produced until diplomacy is discovered. Determine if gold production can absorb bribing a barbarian unit however many turns they are created. Two benefits: Cheaper units and more stream-lined city production. Remember that getting a NONE unit means you have to bribe a unit closer to a city not your own. Everyone knows that barb units are dirt cheap, but this gives the EXTRA benefit of having an army with NO maintenance cost for your civ. One game I played had 5 NONE units in every city I controlled. This was helped with having 2 barb cities that I could tap for lots of extra fire power over time. The other benefit of a more stream-line city production comes with you being able to concentrate more on producing units such as caravans or ships and building improvements and wonders.
You would be amazed at how quickly your civ matures (in terms of gold, science & population) when you can concentrate resources and production. Just remember that a little luck is needed for this. Also, it's probably best in the early game to only allow barbarians with a 1 movement to take cities (cities always produce the same type that takes over). It gets to be either difficult (therefore a drain) or unmanageable (you die or kill it) when you aren't prepared for a city that will produce a 2 movement unit every 5 or 6 turns, especially when you're small and just beginning to build killer units.
Hope this works for you, there are some other dynamics like unit placement, timing for bribing to begin, etc that you'll need to work out but the times that I've been lucky its worked wonders for me!!!

 

[starlifter]

Assuming you don't want the Republic/Democracy route (lots of gold that way), I'll make a few comments about making money in a sprawling Monarchy.

First, the forte of monarchy is cheap settler upkeep and good shield (and food) generation. What you need to do is convert food into gold. It just so happens that at Deity (where I enjoy playing most of the time), 50 or 60 cities tends to cause happiness issues. Since I almost always refuse to "waste" resources in Luxuries in monarchy, I irrigate the land and add taxmen until the happiness issue is solved. This typically results in one, two, or three taxmen in a size 7 or 8 city, particularly in the outlying cities. The cities will "stagnate" at that point due to lack of food, but no worries because Democracy (or Fundy or Commie) shall arrive soon anyway.

The mathematics of the different governments are such that you'll find Monarchy is producing a huge amount of gold (mainly at the expense of excess food). I often take taxes to 70%, too... and build caravans to pump up the science (and gold). For me (in a more warlike game such as this), gold is quite important because I take many cities (and all the barbs I can get to) by bribes. And bribes need gold... the 150 gold from barb leaders is very important to me personally, since I lay elaborate traps to get those guys in the open field. I usually wind up with a decent (former barb) army too, once Leos eventually upgrades them.

BTW, the real way to solve monetary problems is to get into Democracy (or even Republic) and pump up some cities to medium (or bigger) sizes, and let the caravans/freight rip. Build the SoL and slide into Fundy if you really gotta have gold, and can't get other methods to work yet.

Oh, BTW.... if you have Colloseums in you situation... sell them. I doubt your cities are large enough to justify their cost, or pay their expenses, and they will kill your budget in most Monarchy cities. Just irrigate and use Taxmen to control happiness (or even an Elvis if you have to).