Mapuche Strats

[Entroputor]

The Mapuche is starting to become my go-to Civ for all map types. They can generate a lot of culture early in combination with Monuments and Liang's City Parks, and considering Mapuche is quite improvement driven already, having her as a Governor seems like a no brainer.

The +10 Strength against Golden Age Civs is tremendous. If I need science, I get a science city from neighbor Korea or Scotland. If I need to stop Religious Spam, I get Religious city from other neighbors.

If it isn't apparent, I love stealing from my neighbors.

My only head scratcher is Loyalty and the Loyalty Mechanic. At first I thought obvious thing was to spam as many cities until all the space was taken up, build army, and go pillage neighbors for good times and Loyalty farming.

But the problem was that Loyalty was not going down as fast as I thought. Is it smarter to improve your outer cities population and happiness before attacking, or am I missing something else?

 

[Bliss]

I actually think that you should be aiming for less cities (always keep them ecstatic and with governors placed), Amani and her second promotion to drop enemy loyalty is also important, and entertainment complexes to boost amenity and circuses and bread project (+loyalty pressure on nearby cities). And the final tool is spies. Use them to remove enemy governors or drop pressure depending on your strategy.
The loyalty mechanism came into place to nerf civs that overextend their empires. It is possible that you are yourself overextending your own (or overconquesting) by building too many cities.

 

[Leucarum]

I don't know that I've ever been able to use the loyalty mechanic for the Mapuche for much. I guess it lowers the production of a city if there's a lot of fighting going on around it... But if I have the capability to destroy that many units, I probably want to capture their city outright not flip it to rebels...

Their combat bonus vs golden age is their most tasty feature IMO, along with some early culture from Chemamull which can be easily underrated.

I kinda feel like they were designed around their loyalty feature, as it's central to their identity, but it hasn't worked particularly well mechanically and now they are balanced around their other traits... FWIW they are still one of my favourite civs though...

 

[Victoria]

Their combat bonus vs golden age is their most tasty feature

The synergy is not there between the golden age and the loyalty, You attack a civ that is in a golden age which has 0 concerns over loyalty. Malon raiders are fine but scratch built is never that appealing compared to an upgrade UU that comes with the previous units XP.

I played with the loyalty mechanic or the mapuche and it is not that useful because it just occurs at the wrong time. When you attack a civ you kill off the units forst and then pillage t get the loyalty down. It is at this pillaging stage they are most useful because it is about tipping a city faster but as it happens too early when a city can gain +20 loyalty in a single turn it is generally useless. It can be of use speeding up a free city to convert to you though as the free cty generates 2 units even when plummeting in loyalty.

The culture UI and the golden age bonus are alone what this civ lives on and they are both of use.

 

[Leucarum]

It can be of use speeding up a free city to convert to you though as the free cty generates 2 units even when plummeting in loyalty.

I hadn't really thought about whether it worked on free cities... Still a very niche use for their ability though.

It's a shame that the loyalty ability is as weak as it is... Thematically it ties together the civ really neatly... It would be nice to see it replaced with something more synergistic, even just something like reduced loyalty pressure from civs in a golden age would make a difference and still fit their 'standing up to the big guy' theme.

 

[Bliss]

In my opinion, the thing about Mapuche is his versatility. Enemies are going through a Dark Age and have low loyalty? Go raid them and flip cities. Enemies are going through a Golden Age? Raw bonus damage to take cities by brute force! Don't forget you can always consult enemy's current age .
His 25% experience for units trained in a City with governor is free barracks, which is huge.

 

[Victoria]

Thematically it ties together the civ really neatly

-10 loyalty per pillage would be much much better

 

[Leucarum]

-10 loyalty per pillage would be much much better

Yeah - even without flipping cities you'd be burning away tile yields both from the pillage and loyalty hit.

I'd like to see some sort of tweak. It's odd that something so thematic for the Mapuche is so weak at present.

 

[Entroputor]

Yeah - even without flipping cities you'd be burning away tile yields both from the pillage and loyalty hit.

I'd like to see some sort of tweak. It's odd that something so thematic for the Mapuche is so weak at present.

Since repairing tiles doesn't cost builder charges, I'm fine with it as is. It prevents Mapuche from becoming too aggressive. I'm okay with the loyalty modifiers for pillaging and killing enemy units, since I end up pushing past the city I'm trying to flip and pillaging those neighboring city tiles with cavalry and Raiders to lower my enemies loyalty pressure in the 9 tiles region.

 

[Victoria]

To be fair the 25% XP bonus is cool.