Mercantile and Scientific City States Mod?

[jaldaen]

Anyone planning on doing a Mercantile/Scientific city state mod? We have city states that give food, culture, and military units... why not gold and beakers? Does anyone see a problem from adding these types of city states (I know that gold is used to increase CS relations... so a Mercantile CS that gives gold might be a bit tricky)? What kind of "missions" should these types of city states request? Any other types of city states I'm missing that might be good additions to the game?

Thanks,
Joseph

PS: Depending how complicated modding city states is... I might be able to do it myself, although I'd need help with all the art-related stuff.

 

[warpstorm]

As you said, gold doesn't really make sense to me since the main way you will get them to be friends is to pay them large piles of cash.

Science would be duplicative of one of the Patronage SPs, IIRC. This may not be a bad thing, but it could lead to a run-away tech game if you doubled it up.

I'm pretty sure this would require access to the C++ code to do.

 

[Korias]

This actually makes sense, and shouldn't be that hard to do with a bit of tinkering and balance.

A Mercantile City State could actually be influenced by trade... I don't see why you couldn't alllow the trading of resources to a city state. Might make the system a bit more interesting if you dont have the cash for normal play.

This will probably have to wait for the SDK to arrive. And it's likely that they might come in an expansion pack too.

 

[Pouakai]

What city-states would you have as being Merchantile and Scientific though?

Merchantile, maybe Venice, but then you'd need a new city state for Maritime, maybe some Moroccan cities, Istanbul...

Scientific is harder to find. I'm thinking a swiss city, maybe Zurich, but beyond that, I wouldn't have a clue.

Past this, though, I would love more options for city-states. If this can be done, the coding used could be used for the basis of religious city-states.

 

[jaldaen]

Thanks for your comments and suggestions.

I like the idea of the Mercantile CS requesting resources, trade routes and even a trade mission (for a huge bonus! triggered only once when you spawn a great Merchant) besides the normal requests. These of course would net you influence with them which may result in gifts of gold and eventual alliance. I don't have time to research now, but I'm sure I can find a few mercantile city states to use.

As for Scientific CS I'll have to think of things you might do for them. You obviously can't trade tech with them, but perhaps you could do something else science-related. Perhaps they would favor the discovery of natural wonders and the revelation of far away lands. They might also desire strategic resources or something similar. Anything else?

Religious CS? Hmmm... interesting idea, though maybe for an expansion.

Thanks,
Joseph

 

[Pouakai]

What if the merchantile city states send out trade caravans to others, like the spaceship parts, and you gain influence if you protect their trade caravans from attack?
eg. 'The City-state of Venice requests your protection of their trade caravan to the city of Washington. Protecting the caravan will add 30 influence.'

 

[Col Mustard]

Mercantile and Scientific City States sounds like an awesome idea. Scientific CSs could give nominal bonuses on techs or types of units but only a couple times a game. Or they could reduce the cost of certain buildings like a university. A better research pact could be made with Scientific CSs. Just a couple suggestions.

Religious CS? Hmmm... interesting idea, though maybe for an expansion.

Thanks,
Joseph

Holy City State have been discussed extensively here. Hopefully we wont have to wait for an expansion to get new city states. Maybe you can get some ideas for this mod from there.

 

[jaldaen]

Pouakai and Col Mustard,

Thanks for the ideas... it's very interesting to see the different approaches we could take toward different CS.

As for this being "my" mod... I can't commit to it yet because I'm not very good at SDK stuff... I can play with the Notepad++ editable stuff, but I don't know if adding CSs would require SDK or could be done in Notepad++. Hopefully, the later and if not, then I'll have to beg a modder better than me to help out.

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

As you said, gold doesn't really make sense to me since the main way you will get them to be friends is to pay them large piles of cash.

Science would be duplicative of one of the Patronage SPs, IIRC. This may not be a bad thing, but it could lead to a run-away tech game if you doubled it up.

I'm pretty sure this would require access to the C++ code to do.

My $0.02 worth. One way around the cash problem is to simply down-play the importance of cash in maintaining relations with City-States, & instead play up the importance of *quests*. Another solution to both the cash & tech problem is to have the bonuses only apply to existing buildings &/or specialists, rather than a flat bonus (so, instead of getting a flat bonus per city, you might only get the bonus to an existing science building or science specialist). If we take this option, then I think it should apply for all City-State bonuses.

On another topic, this is how I would actually classify various City-States & the benefits they give:

Militaristic: Bonus XP to units built in your cities-grant you units on occasion.

Cultural: Bonus Culture to cities with a theater. Culture from trade routes.

Mercantile: Bonus gold to cities with marketplaces. Extra Cash from trade routes.

Maritime: Bonus XP to naval units built in coastal cities. grant you naval units on occasion.

Agricultural: Bonus food to cities with a granary. Food from trade routes.

Scientific: Bonus science from libraries. Science from trade routes.

Industrious:....well, you get the picture.

The only odd one out are Holy City States, which I think should work somewhat differently to the ones I've listed above.

Anyway, just some thoughts.

Aussie.

 

[jaldaen]

Aussie Lurker,

Very interesting ideas. That would definitely be a nice mod. I'll keep it in mind. I also like your idea about Maritime vs. Agricultural CS... it does seem odd for Maritime CS's food focused.

I also had another idea when I woke up today in regards to CS... it might be interesting to have a "caravan" type* unit that you could send to them that would give you gold and increase your influence (Mercantile CS might give you less gold, but more influence). I don't know if in CiV you can have cities turn production into gold (or research or culture) like you could in CivIV, but if you can't then this unit could give you half its production in gold when it gets to a non-enemy CS and "makes a trade". The important part of this would be to make sure that the "caravan" wasn't something spammable (or profitable) to gold purchase, but only to produce through hammers. Any thoughts? Suggestions? We'll probably know more about how to balance this type of thing once the game comes out.

Best Wishes,
Joseph

* I guess this could even be a stand alone mod as long as it was balanced with the rest of the game... and if production can no longer be switched over to create gold, culture, or research.

 

[Schuesseled]

i'd really like to see some more personalitlies:

Paranoid: If you enter thier borders, without achieving allied status, they will immediately declare war on you. Even if your in allied status, units remaining in thier borders for more than two turns will start to decrease your influence.

Dependable: This city-state's influence decreases 50% less than usual.

Favourable: Influence rises 50% faster for the civ with the highest influence.

Stubborn: This city-state isn't quick to like anyone. Influence gains are only 25% effective.

Barbarous: This city-state is nerfarious. It is in a constant state of war with everyone, and has been known to co-ordinate it's attacks with local barbarians. Steer clear.

 

[SalmonSoil]

Great idea, but it seems that in ciV maritime = mercantile.

 

[Ekmek]

yeah I want a labor production one but it needs to be nerfed for balance.

I also want a commercial citystate that possess its own unique luxury good that you can only get by ally-ing wit them.