Mind 3 lv + Meta magic 3 lv // Command 4 Lv

[yualian]

You can capture even enemy's heroes with this abilities, command or domination magic. I don't know this is 'intended'. But, it seems like some kind of bugs. Isn't it?

Religious heroes would abandon your civs at next turn after capturing. ( If you don't have proper religion. ) However, you can still use civ-specific heroes.

While playing Illians with Deity + all difficulty enhancing switch on + No reloading, I had been tortured by AI again and again and again......

But, after finding this trick....... now they are doomed.

 

[heisenberg]

To me domination simply means to take mental control of someone else's unit, so I don't see why heroes cannot/shouldn't be dominated. There are of course "counters" to this--iirc stuff like spell resistance, loyalty should work. Unfortunately the AI doesn't recognize the dangers of a domination archmage for example and doesnt bother with these.

So actually, religious heroes "leaving" the next turn I believe is just a game mechanic--personally I do not really mind them stay the whole time (after all you did take over his mind), but that of course brings about game balance issues when you play against the AI who doesn't invest in counters against archmages.

On a whole I wouldn't really call this a "bug", I'd just say its an exploit over the inadequacy of the AI. After all against a human player who scatters some spell resistance units around, a domination archmage which you might have taken quite long to build up would possibly lose its spell after a few dominations. And of course seeing a domination archmage running around would be a neon "kill me" target painted on his back in MP, and here again the AI doesnt give enough priority to killing them.

 

[zup]

And why does he lose the spell if he fails? Archmagi are national units, a powerful spell for 4 units out of 200 can't be that overpowering? And archmagi are supposed to be powerful. "Archmages have reached the point where their magical prowess is so great the mere threat of their magic is enough to keep possible competitors and enemies in line." From archmage pedia. As I see it, archmagi should wreak havoc on entire armies if they are not dealt with swiftly. If AI cannot understand they are a high priority target, make them understand.

 

[BugReportage]

Look at perpentach and where mind magic got him. If the most powerful mind manipulator drove himself insane because of mind magic what hope does a feeble arch mage have at controlling others without falling into insanity?
I think it's important to have a limit on how many times it can be casted based on probability. So eventually the arch mage is driven to the limit of how many individuals he can control.

How arrogant it would be for an arch mage to think he can control hundreds of minds only limited by how many turns are in the game.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

BugReportage has a good point here, but I still dislike losing a hard gained promotion.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

Would you prefer if he kept Mind III, but gained Crazed?

 

[BugReportage]

That's more flavoury, but are people willing to even bother casting the spell if there's a chance in a chance that their arch mage will turn into a barbarian unit.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

is there a way to get rid of crazed or neutralize it? if so, my answer to MC's question is "yes"

 

[MagisterCultuum]

There is not currently a way to remove Crazed. All crazed does is randomly give out Enraged. Enraged makes the unit faster, stronger, and have a chance of turning barbarain, but it is removed by combat. Archmages don't usually fight directly, but they can if they have to.



I was thinking that I'd add a Spirit and/or Elohim-only spell to counter crazed/enraged.



I was also thinking ti could be appropriate for the dominated unit to become Crazed too, at least some of the time.

 

[BugReportage]

Psst (Loyalty works)

 

[MagisterCultuum]

Well, if you consider killing your archmage to be working, sure, but why would you want that?

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

I was thinking that I'd add a Spirit and/or Elohim-only spell to counter crazed/enraged.



I was also thinking ti could be appropriate for the dominated unit to become Crazed too, at least some of the time.

good ideas, I agree. the dominated unit should reflect the archmage status ( i.e. if the mage becomes crazed/enraged, all the units he dominated should become crazed/enraged )

you could also add a cap to the number of units that an archamage can keep dominated simultaneously, and tie it to some ability so that you can improve it.

 

[BugReportage]

... I just ran a little test. I had 10 arch mages with crazed and loyalty and over 30 turns none died or went barb. I may have been really lucky but you can try it if you want.

 

[Amerigo Arturo]

Loyalty works, they never go crazy and die.

 

[BugReportage]

You mean it doesn't work. They're supposed to die. As magister said. Read the loyalty description.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

does it not work only with archmages, or in general?

 

[BugReportage]

whats so special about arch mages? I gave Kael a heads up.

 

[orangelex44]

does it not work only with archmages, or in general?

In general. It's never worked as stated, since I've never heard of anyone losing a man from Loyalty.

 

[Keeper_GFA]

I think that Loyalty killing a unit is meant to prevent capture. In the case of simply turning barbarian, it has always seemed to completely prevent it.

 

[MaxAstro]

Easier test: In the world builder, give a unit Loyalty and Burning Blood. Better yet, give yourself a Moroi so it can keep casting Burning Blood when it runs out. See if the unit dies. Haven't tried it myself, but if Loyalty really does keep the unit yours without killing it, then Moroi with Loyalty are SCARY overpowered. XD