MrB4...Beyond the PC Problems

[Mr. Blonde]

IW should be here before we place city no.3. It would be ugly if we discover iron in the 3 unused tiles. So Edrine builds a lib after the 2 warriors then and our cap 2 workers before we build the 3rd settler. Techwise I would go IW and then hunting so we can hook on the ivory rather quickly for more pop. Especially our cap will grow very fast to its happiness limits.

Good luck for your turns; I would suggest you stop after IW is researched and we can discuss the 3rd city spot and coming worker actions for batteryacids turns.

 

[Belisar]

@ acid
This is true and it is one of the reasons we need workers quickly, to improve the capital (pasture, mines) and connect horses.
The future settlers will come in faster.

I thought we already had hunting, my bad, I will sneak that one in.

 

[Mr. Blonde]

Any time to play, Belisar? Please give a short report on your status. Afaik batt could have time today early afternoon and tomorrow. I know we don´t want to put time pressure on us, but I want to see some progress. I thnike the things are clear enough at the moment, batt would just have to control the tile working when a city grows.

 

[Belisar]

I'm at work now but my report will be up so that batt can play tomorrow.
I have additional things regarding our strategy too

 

[Belisar]

Our situation looks quite good but we need to be careful about the barbs, so no farmer's gambit here.

Preturn:
With our 2nd workboat out we need a workforce badly.
We have 2 additional ressources outside the capital, not to mention all those forest for a few chops,
so I change production (nothing invested yet which made the desicion easy for me).
We got our first settler out quickly, but now it's worker first, then settler.

2350BC (66)
Our workboat gets the second seafood.

2325BC (67)
Warrior finished in Edrine, ordered another unil we have real units.

2300BC (68)
Writing comes in, I will go with Hunting (we need it for the ivory, just 5 turns)
and then IW, we really need to know where the "heavy metals" are.

2275BC (69)
Ghandi comes for Open Boarders which will not happen during our initial expansion phase Hmm, NO.

2175BC (73)
Istanbul will be 1! shield (or food) short building the worker in 2 turns and there is absolutely
nothing I can do about that
Our warrior finds copper but it is not very close.

2125BC (75)
Begin a chop to help with the next settler.
we find Ghandi's boarders in the east on the coast, really close to the copper source.
He has no 2nd city so this must be his capital.

2025BC (79)
The cop gives us 45 hammers (instead of the 30 for a non-imperialistic civ)
and we now get the settler in 4 turns.

1975BC (81)
An additional cow in the south but we have a dead-end here
Stone in the far north-east-

1925BC (83)
We get our second settler and need another worker.

1800BC (88)
We found our 3rd city, Ankara.
4 ressources total, 3 first ring (including the important horses)
I considered 1 tile west for the fish but that would lose the floodplain, the single hill
and overall 5 land tiles, not worth it in my book.

1675BC (95)
We got Iron Working, revealing 3 sources of iron on the map.
I set research to pottery cause we really need an economy.

Thoughts (short term tasks):

Workers:
The worker near Edrine should help building the lib with a chop, the one in Ankara has plenty of
tasks (horses, ivory) and Istanbul needs a mix of mined hills and grassland-river cottages

Citties:

Istanbul will finish the settler for our 4th city after which we need to improve commerce until we can
expand further. Therefore I would build a lib and a 4th worker to begin our road-network (horses!)

Ankara: After the warrior we need a workboat and then we should go full speed for commerce,
(cottages on grasland and floodplains)

Edrine: Emphasize (military) production


Good luck batt, try to get the glorious Ottoman empire going

 

[Belisar]

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/30880/MrB4_95.CivBeyondSwordSave

 

[batteryacid]

Whats the next city to build? I guess our Great people factory in the north ? or the one city grabbing the iron?
IStanbul and Edrine tolerate 2-3 chops I guess, best will be grassland hills I guess? or are thos a bit away as we need not too much mines until we hit ~pop6 or so?

My suggestion: I will build the next 2 settlers , build our great people farm (GPF) and explore norther territories above the iron so we can decide where exactly we will place our iron city; City places 3 and 5 according to my numberation are not priority until we have grabbed the iron and the GPF to block Ghandi and establish a clean eastern border, I hope to find or floodplains near the iron, but I guess we will settle on the coastal place 1 diagonal of the iron and rice or 1 above.

Let´s hope the best !

 

[Belisar]

If we can connect horses quickly (should be the priority during your turn) we can build chariots (and later horse archers)
That should be enough against the barbs (and fast moving units are always preferable)
Therefore the GP-city (which grabs the important land towards Ghandi) is more important than the iron-city. Note that we need Myst to build a quick monument (a lib is way too slow)
As we have iron, the copper (in the east) is not necessary and I guess Ghandi will settle that spot soon.
Our iron city (which we cann't afford until we have a higher income) should not be placed on the tile diagonal to rice and iron, this would mean ~6 desert tiles, way too much.

PS: After the lib-chop Edrine should not get any more, the few forests are needed for health
The capital on the other side has plenty and future settlers will get 45 hammers (imperialistic)

 

[Mr. Blonde]

I just read through it, and will have no time to post tomorrow. Short comments: commerce is a must-go, here I agree. Research goals need to be fleshed out. Pottery -> mysticism is the suggestion. Unfortunately our GP has nothing to chop so a lib could take too long. Ankara needs the second ring fro ivory and thus commerce as well. I guess monuments can not be avoided at the moment. After that we have plenty to think about. Alphabet may be interesting for spies; metal casting or mathematics are also very benefitial. I guess if Ghandi does not get monotheism we beeline to CoL and see if we can trade for religious techs to get a state religion going. With hamams coming instead of aqueducts we can wait a bit longer for a religion.

 

[Belisar]

We have lots of cities with high food surplus, slavery and some is clearly an option for important buildings.

 

[batteryacid]

Here a short version of my turns:


Chop for lib; still 29! Turns!! We really need the monuments!!
Find crabs and cow in the iron city; we can grab all resources , tile to settle is marked red in my screenie.
Turn 97 Lost Explorer against barbaric warrior (sorry, but movement ended in wrong place in the north) but reveals silver and fish in the tundra
Zzz … nothing exciting happens; roads built , warriors on patrol at our next city places
Turn 106: bursa founded, switched to warrior for the moment, is badly needed in these barb-hostile lands
Turn 108: Warrior defended against barb at the preferred iron city place, horses are connected through river and roads to all cities
Turn 109: Settler ready! I switched Istanbul for the moment to chariot as it needs some turns growth to make use of the village? (have only the german version running at the moment) that should be finished soon; Istanbul can grow to 6 until it hits happiness problems
Turn 110: Mysticism, worker finished chop (1 turn too late for the settler) so I switched to chariot (2 turns), lib would take 27 or so which is waay tooo long for the moment

Screenie:

Suggestions for Mr_B:
Cities:
Ankara:Workboat in 2 turns, then switch to monument
Endrine: Lib takes its time for the moment
Bursa: Warrior-Monument
Istanbul: Chariot, let it grow to 5 and then worker (we need them to improve Basra and finish our road network)

Movements to make:
1 worker between Istanbul and Endrine could make a second village for Istanbul ( so we would have to let it grow to 6) or move north and begin road network to Bursa. We will discuss the city place for our next city but I think the place is clear for now ; the settler is positioned at the moment 1 tile north of Ankara and should move in the next 1-2 turns to its city place

Tech: I pre-switched to Alphabet for the moment; I found spies very handy in exploring foreign lands and cannot be seen by barbarians (finished my first BTS game at 4.45 in the morning with the Netherlanders, which are awesome with their dam and their financial trait); so no harm is done if our discussion comes to another conclusion- we will need spies anyway as we will free our continent from ghandi sooner or later I guess

Save

 

[Belisar]

...we need them to improve Basra...

We aren't playing as the Iraqis

Looks like everything is ok, the land near the iron is more and more apealing
I have no civ access now so I will look at the save tonight, just 2 things.
I will run the numbers to check if the iron city should be placed on your red dot or if 1 tile north-east (on the hill) has more long term potential.
The other thing is, are there no more cheap techs available?
Alpha takes very long as our economy is currently not very powerfull during the initial expansion phase.

 

[batteryacid]

Techs available: Archery, Horseback riding, Masonry, MEditation, Polytheism

When we go to an early war I guess Horseback would be nice, Med and Poly are a No I would say as we will loose the religion founding gambit, perehaps Archery?
Alphabet is interesting, but I would go for Horseback and then Alphabet

Basra, my fault. I was sure I typed it somwhere but when checking I missed it. Is it the same city BTW?

 

[Belisar]

Here are some thoughts on the iron city:

Apart from the 4 ressources that both spots get
red spot has 4 grasland, 1 desert hill, 3 deserts, 5 coast and 3 ozean tiles,
blue spot has 8 grasland, 1 grasl. hill, 3 deserts, 3 coast and 1 plain tile

so basically blue dot gains a lot of grasland for water tiles (which are only mediocre if you are not financial).
(9 vers. 4 cottages)


As far as tech is concerned: I think we should take cheap, necessary techs like Masonry for now, with the trading limit in the actual version of civ I don't want to use the available tradings for cheap ones.
After our commerce output increases we can go after Alpha and further.

 

[Belisar]

When we go to an early war I guess Horseback would be nice

Phants, give me the big, grey cuddly toy, I want PHANTS

 

[Mr. Blonde]

Just am at home from an excursion. I see that the Iron city is no "loss" but seems to have potential. 1 NE on the hill seems more appealing as we have 2 more water heavy cities left anyhow. Cottages (without river I might add) or farms + workshops (needs some techs to run efficiently) is up for discussion. I have time tomorrow before noon to comment more in detail on the next moves I would take.

2 city spots south and tundra are not of importance at the moment, eco development has to come first, imo. I will play Sat or Sun. Please post when you have time next, Belisar.

@ your last post: are you drunk ?!?

 

[Belisar]

I was refering to our first war, the clearing of the continent (by the time we can afford to expand that far we will have construction and therefore those nice war-elephants). At present, even the iron city is stretching our economy.
I would certainly not analys civ-situations when I'm drunk ...maybe sometimes...

Seriously, take your time, if you manage to play until Sunday it would be fine

 

[batteryacid]

ahhm we cannot settle on desert, or can we?

edit: as I know you rather good, your pre-last post seems to be made after 2 days sleep denial or 4 glasses of Scotch
Well, mine now is not better (5 hours sleep and too much beers in the last 2 days

 

[Mr. Blonde]

Tech Strategy: Masonry is not a must at the moment. We don´t have stone and although pyramids are veeery handy I don´t think we should go for it. My proposed next tech is mathemathics which would give us Hamams and open CoL, Currency and Construction (with Masonry). I guess if Ghandi doesn´t found Judaism until then we could go for CoL. We then research HBR and trade for the religoious techs and then wipe him out with Cats/Swords/Elephants

Any thoughts?

 

[Belisar]

ahhm we cannot settle on desert, or can we?

Desert can not be worked by a worker but you CAN settle on it and get the normal city-tile production. This is in fact a good way to use this otherwise useless tile somehow.
Anyhow, we want iron city on a desert-HILL which can be worked and settled.

edit: as I know you rather good, your pre-last post seems to be made after 2 days sleep denial or 4 glasses of Scotch

Something tells me you "know too much"


Thoughts on the tech: Math would be a good choice, how long does it take? I suspect a considerable amount of turns.
I suggested Masonry cause we need it anyway and it is cheap.
The CoL religion should be ours anyway. I'm surprised that Gandhi didn't get one of the early ones, he must be very weak.