Multiplayer...not worth it?

[Lord Zambia]

Just wanting your thoughts on multiplayer. It's generally more buggy (for me) and without the opportunity to save games, and with no animation of movement or battles, its really not worth it - you'd rather play the AI in single player!

Anyone else think the same? (or work a way around the problems?)

 

[Smote]

I disagree.

I am frequently dissatisfied at beating the AI, because of its terribly predictable tactics, which makes counter-strategies fairly easy. Once you get on equal terms with the AI, you are sure to win.
Also, having an unfair game where my opponent does better than me because of a massive handicap bothers me.

Therefore, the only satisfying option is to play against humans. The frustrating part of this is that Civ 5's multiplayer is clunky, with about 50% of games having failed starts and requiring remakes. However, a good multiplayer game is very fun, with all kinds of clever tactics available. I laughed maniacally while i was playing 2 days ago, when i trapped an opponent's army between my army, my city, and the coast. I had oligarchy+himeji, and he was promptly slaughtered, while I was accused of cheating. It was hilarious!

The other satisfying option is competing against humans by playing against the AI, via game of the month or something. This can be satisfying as well, but it is not immersive because of the number of different exploits that must be done in order to compete. Many of these take some form of luck, which makes them frustrating to commit to.


For multiplayer, the workaround to the failed start problem is to find a group of players that just want to play together, and remake the game until it works. This can take several remakes in quick succession, once you find the players.

In order to insure a multiplayer game works, make sure to give it extra time in the lobby. Wait 30 seconds after everyone is readied before starting, to ensure a good connection. Kick any player that takes longer than about 30 seconds to connect and change their civilization. Don't do anything when the game starts, wait like 10 seconds before trying to move your warrior or build your city, just to let the game catch up a little. I always suspect that user actions can interrupt the game startup and synchronization, though I do not have proof.

 

[swordspider]

Just wanting your thoughts on multiplayer. It's generally more buggy (for me) and without the opportunity to save games, and with no animation of movement or battles, its really not worth it - you'd rather play the AI in single player!

Anyone else think the same? (or work a way around the problems?)

Completely disagree. The AI is NOT a real opponent. It is just a machine you play to have fun. The only real challenge when you play an AI is to simply beat YOURSELF by getting better at the 'laws' of the game. There is no other dynamic there than 'figuring out' how it works and how to beat the system. An AI simply doesn't THINK like a human. It follows a program, it has zero emotion, zero initiative, and zero desire to win.

War in CiV provides the perfect example. When you attack an AI, you are basically guaranteed to win if you can just outnumber them and keep the flow going. Not true with a human. Humans are smart, dynamic, and deceitful. They'll sacrifice units to get other units to safety to form a counterattack. They can SEE when they are outnumbered or outmatched and make adjustments. Likewise they can see when your attack is futile and exploit your weaknesses and potentially counter-attack and take you out instead. No matter how much programming you give an AI, at the end of the day it is still limited by rules and code. A human opponent will challenge you on levels an AI will never be able to.

Like already noted, if you want to have a good Multiplayer experience, you need to find players you mesh with and who are reliable in both sticking the game out and not having their machines crash. When they are your 'friends' you can always get them (or you) back into a game if a crash does happen.

 

[Lord Zambia]

I think i got the wrong message across. I know that humans are much better opponents than AI, and that intelligent opponents will actually challenge you in the areas of tactics and long term strategies. However, civ5 multiplayer cannot save games - which for me is a killer. I would've thought that was the first thing they put in. Some of us cannot play civ5 for 12 hours straight to try and finish a multiplayer game, in the other civs we'd save and keep chipping away at eachother for weeks. The fact that there's no save game in multi makes single player stand out to me more - which is sad because it is an extremely good game.

Is there some way to "turn on" saved games in multiplayer or something that i've missed?

 

[Smote]

i bet you can save games. it autosaves, so you can probably just take the autosaves out of the folder, and store them in a different folder, then put it back when you want it.

 

[swordspider]

I think i got the wrong message across. I know that humans are much better opponents than AI, and that intelligent opponents will actually challenge you in the areas of tactics and long term strategies. However, civ5 multiplayer cannot save games - which for me is a killer. I would've thought that was the first thing they put in. Some of us cannot play civ5 for 12 hours straight to try and finish a multiplayer game, in the other civs we'd save and keep chipping away at eachother for weeks. The fact that there's no save game in multi makes single player stand out to me more - which is sad because it is an extremely good game.

Is there some way to "turn on" saved games in multiplayer or something that i've missed?

You can absolutely save games and load them back up. You just have to load an autosave. The hard part is you need to invite the human players back in, which if they are your friends is no big deal, but if you don't have them in steam then yeah, that slot will likely be an AI.

 

[cool3a2]

Is there some way to "turn on" saved games in multiplayer or something that i've missed?

Press CTRL-S... However, they made it as hard as it can be. If you try to load it, you won't find it as the game searches in the wrong directory. Search for the savegames in My Games/civ5/... I think you'll be able to load the game if you move the savegame file to where your autosaves are.

The other error you guys mention is probably that one that doesn't allow you to finish the first turn, right? I suffered it, too, when playing against my brother through a LAN. One of us had to leave the game and then to rejoin and everything worked fine. Don't know if a specific player needs to leave, but I don't think so. Also, you can play multiplayer without logging in into steam if you prefer. Just let your firewall block it and remain offline when you started it. If you are on a LAN, you can then just start a multiplayer game. If you are planning to play through internet, you should be able to play it similar ways if you just install and start hamachi before. Haven't tested this way of multiplayer game though, but I'd wonder if it wouldn't work.

 

[Smote]

Sometimes when civ fails to synchronize, it just gives up. It seems to be one of the major programming flaws. Manually having someone rejoin like that is a good way to force it to re-synchronize.

Sometimes, a person joining can even cause the game to break. Someone could join, it attempts to synchronize, fails, and gives up ;P

 

[Lord Zambia]

Ah ok, i'll try Contol-S (dunno why i didnt think of the shortcut ) and move the games to the autosaves folder (so i dont have to remember which autosave file it was )

Thanks for all the help

 

[Deussu]

Remember though that the manual saves don't show in the load game section just be moving them there. I tried this once, but you need to rename the file to start as "Autosave_".

 

[TheMeInTeam]

This game completely shattered any MP playability with simultaneous turns by making it so you can't move after end turn. Before anything else, that breaks MP by design; now everyone has to wait until the end of the timer, and after you've FINALLY done that each turn, faster player (or connection) wins! That sure is FUN in a STRATEGY game.

 

[lightgiver]

Multiplayer is shattered for me.

The load times are TERRIBLE and the lag is horrendous.

Worst of all is the load screens, there is no indication whatsoever of how far into the loading process you are or if you froze up. You just wait for a few minutes hoping you are not waiting for nothing. My latest game the game finally loaded, i even got to build my first city, but before i could move my warrior the music stopped and the game froze and i was forced to shut the game down.

 

[swordspider]

Multiplayer is shattered for me.

The load times are TERRIBLE and the lag is horrendous.

Worst of all is the load screens, there is no indication whatsoever of how far into the loading process you are or if you froze up. You just wait for a few minutes hoping you are not waiting for nothing. My latest game the game finally loaded, i even got to build my first city, but before i could move my warrior the music stopped and the game froze and i was forced to shut the game down.

Maybe it is time for a new PC/Connection because I do not share these same problems.

A progress bar would be nice though, yes.

 

[UFDelt]

This is so frustrating to hear. How can they design a game so badly for multiplayer nowadays?