NC CLXVIII: Boudica of the Celts

[pp07]

@wongfu

Spoiler :

pp02:
I don't see the rationale behind your city#2 placement. Sure, it can share the pig with the capitol when growth is needed, but it is surrounded by jungle. It is certainly an useful city... but after Iron Working.

I used city #2 as a worker/settler pump at size 2 working the elephants and the mine for quite some time.

 

[wongfu]

I am confused. Is pandamancer and pp07 the same person?

 

[pandamancer]

^ nope, i was just too eager to reply last time

 

[Seraiel]

Under what circumstance you will consider Shwedagon Paya + free religion?

I had games in which AP owner asks everybody to fight me. How do you minimize the occurrence of such incident?

I never consider Paya and only very seldomly use FR, but mainly because of happiness reasons.

To minimize bad AP-events, you simply must become the resident of the AP or simply defy the resolution when it comes up. When somebody asks you to fight someone, it's even easier, then you simply beg 10g from that person and you get a 10T peace-treaty, which makes the AP-vote invalid.

 

[wongfu]

Immortal, no huts, 1740AD:

Spoiler :

- Bribed Ottoman into a war against Wang. After a while, I accepted his request to join.
- Capitulated Wang @1740AD.
- Not sure if it is wise to develop my oversea colonies. In the initial development stage, they drag my economy and delay my war effort against Wang.
- Romans and Indians are getting too big and advanced. I doubt if I am going to win.
- Plan to build more cannons and a couple of infantries before declaring war on Ragnar.
- Return all captured cities back to Koreans. I don't want to waste my troops suppressing revolt.

 

[pandamancer]

@wongfu

Spoiler :

I understand that it is your first time playing on IMM. So I would like to point out the things that went wrong in your game:

a) Custom Houses - really bad building even the Portuguese counterpart. Cost 180 and gives on average +4 . If the AIs went to Mercantilism (like Monty), your profits are gone.
b) No plan - are you going for conquest? Why the Global Theater is not up yet? are you going for culture? why are there three temples in the capital ? are you going for space?
c) wrong priorities in national wonders - oxford and wall street on the same building. You are also building the pentagon and west point without strategic resources which further slows your army production.
d) military science is a mistake, you should went straight for rifles and take advantage of the one pop draft. Going military science for the sake of the UB is not going to win your game...
e) too many useless buildings [Banks, Custom House, Temples, Cathedrals, Dun, Lighthouse (with no seafood resource), Jail]
f) facism is a mistake, you have the pyramids. Spending 3900 for a great general and mt rushmore is not worth it.

The game is still winnable so don't give up.

 

[wongfu]

Thank you for the reply!

Spoiler :

(b) I am shooting for domination / diplomatic. With Romans that advanced I am pessimistic about space race. Three temples in capital to get a few extra happiness - I worry about war unhappiness / AI stop supplying happiness resources... any tile in my capital is too important to lose.
(e) I build temples in those bleeding cities due to excessive whipping; I was hoping to extend the whipping- capabilities of those cities. Banks were built for the wall street. Cathedrals in Vienne was for happiness, it reached its cap.
(f) well yeah actually I regret

As for the global theater... where do you place it? The way I think of using it is, build it in a place with plenty of food, then abuse it through excessive whipping.

 

[Pangaea]

If you whip enough during war, happiness cap isn't an issue. Whip the cities down to 2. Then 5->3 and 4->2 whip them, or even 1-pop whip if needed.

 

[pandamancer]

@Wongfu

Spoiler :

The global theater can be placed at Tolosa but seeing that it has national epic on it... I really don't know if you want to do that.

global theater is very powerful for drafting armies... whipping is secondary. However, your basic draft is now infantry so one draft cost 2 pop which is slightly inefficient.

I don't know how to win diplo here as I am not very good at it yet. If you build the UN in the far future, I think Asoka will be your biggest contender and Monty will surely vote for his master. Quite messed up for diplo also (i think?)

Your only choice is a late game war with nukes.

 

[Seraiel]

Temples for are quite useless, as they only give 1 . If one whips them, it's even +1 , so doesn't change anything.

1 Custom House in the capital btw. is good, when going for Space. Instead of all the other things though Wongfu: If you want a military victory, you should only build Granaries, Barracks and Forges. Oxford, WS, Cathedrals, all not needed. Keep your cities small and produce 100+ units, then almost nobody can stop you.

 

[yyeah]

This start look interesting lets i decide to give it a shoot on diety.

Spoiler :

Here i am 1ad

I started AH-wheel-agc-pottery-writing-mining-bw-asthetics-fishing-currency.
Reason was , i never do that but in this case i wanted to grow my capitol to happy cap ( size 8) befor i release settler witch allows me to work 5 of theese floodplains cottage, i did it becouse i was sure that there no any ai around and i can build cities around my capitol and had some space to the north.
what u think about it was it effition ?, imo it was i could bulid libary in 6 turns settler in 6 turns 9 turns after i start running great scientist and reserch per turn was nice xD.
anyway here iam 1ad not bad capitol (for boudica) 39-41 base my civil service is getting late becouse i had to selftech monarchy;/ and i dont have music ;/ but give it a try after civil service 6 cities is not too much but i have space for at least 3 more i thinki got space for a lot more but i dont know what fog is hiding in the north. iam going for lib here want to lib military since and conquer this guys

 

[Seraiel]

@yyeah:

Spoiler :

If you got 6 cities and have place for 3 more at 1 AD, the map must have been extremely generous to you, don't rhink that's possible un all Deity games.

Without screens hard to comment on it

.

 

[yyeah]

1500 ad

Spoiler :

here i am

and sad part

i squizzed 10 cities from this spot and i lost lib becouse ... iam dumb xD i didnt run great scienties i should do it in city where i whip libary on ss1 or in capitol but i didnt i just forgot it xD so i decide to skip paper and i went for natio military tradition and go for late cur..sth rush but this game isnt quick in tech lib goes about 1100 ad so v late, ragnar cap and iam on my way for wang he doesnt have RP yet so iam preety sure taht i will get him soon, problem is that iam rly behind AC and Asoka in tech and i think that 1 of them must be my next target, AC is close to rifling that meens i need rifling and steel to get him well i dont know where to go in tech yet, i think that loosing lib is not allways game braking thing even on deity when u have 10 cities but made this map a lot harder for me. I dont have access to marble and stone what dosnt make things easier i was thinking about bulid national epic bulb edu and make oxford witch could help but without resources is not worth it well i dontn know. diplo isnt bad asoka is in war with mahmed and monty, wang is in war with mahmed and monty that help but, like, so waht i need to get AC xD

@Seraiel

Spoiler :

Yes you right but i notice that in fractral or contintnts type of maps usually u can get ~8-12 cities on deity well i did it in i would say 80% of maps
offcourse this is not a case in pangea when u preety pfften get squizzed with like 3-5 cities but anyway what u think about growing capitol to size 8 befor i start to make a settler was it worth it , is it worth it when u are sure that u have room for at least 6 cities to grow capitol if u have good tiles to work i noticed that i had rly good reserch per turn there wat i usually do is size 3 settler size 6 whip settler u know standard thing now iam thinking about growing this capitol if theres a reason

 

[Seraiel]

@ yyeah: I saw the question, but I refuse to answer on every post that is without commas, without full stops, without paragraphs and completly written without any capitals. The spelling errors I can excuse, but those other things give me the suspection, that you don't care 1 bit for your readers, because your posts are really not readable without major effort.

 

[Pangaea]

I've heard rumours of a wonderful new invention as well.

Spoiler :

Seriously, though, it's difficult to read posts like that, and often on serious forums txt-speak is not even allowed.

 

[hankinsohl]

Spoiler :

Horses... check.
Iron... check.
Productive land with room to expand... check.
Awesome capital, first to Music, built The Great Library... check, check and check.

This game is over!
=======
Not sure if this is the best strategy but...

Settle in place looked nice, but with all those floodplain tiles to the NE, I decided to risk moving - in my capital I want 3 good production tiles (hills and/or iron/bronze), along with a lot of great commerce tiles (preferably floodplains). So I moved my scout 2 NE and then my settler 2 NE.

My settler wasn't in an ideal spot after moving 2 NE (lack of production - only 2 hills tiles), so at turn 2 I moved my settler 1S and then settled. 1 turn wasted but... access to more floodplains and 3 hills tiles. Perfect!

Meanwhile, my scout discovered some fish to the NE which meant that my second city could: 1) grow on the fish and; 2) support the capital by working capital floodplains whenever the capital was dedicated to production (e.g., building a library, building the Great Library).

So...

I usually start Worker first but in this case, I do not immediately need Agriculture, and, because of the surrounding floodplains, growing isn't all that bad. So I decided to go Warrior first while researching Fishing.

Once Fishing was in, I went Wheel, then Pottery.

At size 3, my capital started on a Worker. As soon as it was out, the Capital switched to Settler. The worker began to cottage all the nearby floodplains.

With numerous cottages in the early game, research was rapid...

I was first to Music and built The Great Library.

It's now 325 AD and I have only 3 cities... but with Iron and Horses nearby and with room to expand to at least 6 cities.... this should be an easy Cuirassier-fueled victory.

 

[Seraiel]

@ hankinsohl:

Spoiler :

You really should expand more and earlier. Having 6 cities in the BCs is much more important than being first to Music or building the GL. On higher levels, the land will be completely taken 'til 1 AD, sometimes earlier. 3 cities is something when going for an early rush, for Cuirrassier war, lacking on expansion is actually really bad as it massively impacts on your research and troop building capacities.

 

[JSS]

Spoiler :

I played this map on Deity until I was ready to attack (libbed Steel in the 900AD's). There was easily room for at least 10 cities, and Ragnar was slow to expand towards us. There is quite a distance between our capitals, and a resource-poor area in-between.

 

[yyeah]

V nice map, definetly winnable on deity. I had fun time to play it and thanks for posting.
Unfortunatly i lost it (retired 1916AD) becouse of several mistakes.

Spoiler :

1. I didnt run Great Scienties becouse of that i lost lib.

2. When i took 7 of 13 Wang cities i stop producing army, and then he trade rifling for steel.
I just didnt had enought Cuirassiers ( i had 30 could have like 50).
Finally i got him with cavalery and cannons, but i wasted about 15 turns. In that time i should attack someone else.

3. I didnt pay attention to reserch of my vassels.
Sometimes when they end reserch what i order them to do, they put 1 turn in to something what i was reserching.
This meens that i have to put more turns to this specific tech to get trade.

So Finally i never catch Augustus in tech, and i couldnt stop him from winning space thats why i retired.
( I stopped Asoka from winning culture but w/e).

@Seraiel

Ok You right i sloppy wrote and it could be unreadable if u connent this with my poor eng, but that wasnt intentional.
It just didn't occur to me that I could someone that offend( i didn want to insult anyone). Well sry for that.

But the draw so far as applications, far-reaching conclusion ( i dont know how to translate it) like ..
You dont care about people, becouse you didnt put any punctuation mark in post ... is ridiculous and rude !
And remember that if you are trying to judge someone "after two sentences".

 

[hankinsohl]

Spoiler :

@ hankinsohl:
You really should expand more and earlier...

Thanks for the tip Seraiel. Generally I do expand much faster - this is a new approach. I think it will work very well on Emperor - in fact I'm cranking out settlers in my non-capital cities ATM in preparation for the Cuirassier rush - but yes, I guess this approach wouldn't work out well on Diety.