Nebuchadnezzar's trait kind of lackluster?

[thefran]

Having a Bowman 20 turns earlier is cool and all but by no means gamechanging, aside from that this trait essentially gives one free Academy early. Is that it? Thoroughly unimpressive.

 

[Seek]

There are two scientist slots on the unique walls. Civs must be looked at with all uniques in mind - in this case the trait is weak, but the UU and UB are very strong.

 

[Txurce]

There are two scientist slots on the unique walls. Civs must be looked at with all uniques in mind - in this case the trait is weak, but the UU and UB are very strong.

So it no longer gives the 50% GS creation buff? Then the idea would be that you get more science (after the now-necessary Walls build) but fewer GS.?

By the way, I think the UU (defense buff, right?) is one of the weakest in the game. Getting an advanced unit early is a different matter.

 

[thefran]

> I think the UU (defense buff, right?) is one of the weakest in the game

it feels like I'm just building two scientist slots. The defense buff is kind of wasted, as I tend not to make my main research city my constantly attacked military outpost.

 

[Txurce]

> I think the UU (defense buff, right?) is one of the weakest in the game

it feels like I'm just building two scientist slots. The defense buff is kind of wasted, as I tend not to make my main research city my constantly attacked military outpost.

I've only played one game with Babylon since the UA was changed, but tend to agree regarding the forced defensive build. It led me to play Babylon more wide, filling out the Liberty tree so all my cities picked up the slots. Even then, it felt like a drop from a pop + GP-based build strategy in the capital. I can't be sure, though, because science has slowed down in general recently.

 

[Thalassicus]

How would you suggest improving the walls? Or should we replace them with a new structure?

 

[Txurce]

I have an irrational attachment to the name Walls of Babylon, and that's probably what I liked most about your adding the GS slots to them. (Now I have to build them!) From a science perspective they are an additional building roughly equivalent to a library - a good thing, early on - with the downside being that it drains workers for 100% of its effect. What if its security boosted the power of every science building within its walls by a certain %? That differentiates it from the Jade Hall.

The alternative would seem to be putting the Walls back where they were - cheaper and stronger? - and buffing the UA. But I assume your intent here was to make it more pro-active... hence my suggestion above. (The French UA is similarly passive, but let's not go there now!)

 

[gunnergoz]

No! Make the Walls of Babylon add 2 science to each village! (ducks and runs.)