New Gameplay Mechanics in 1.29f?

Catt

Catt

Emperor
Joined
May 8, 2002
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Location
California - SF Bay Area
Just finished my latest game under the new 1.29f patch, and noticed 2 new (unannounced) tweaks in the in-game mechanics. [If I am misremembering the old version, please let me know].

1. Making peace while in an MPP now terminates the MPP. I'm not sure I even tested this under 1.21, but I seem to recall (pretty clearly) that once an MPP was signed, it would run for 20 turns - the only way to end it early was to go to war with your MPP partner. I remember this because of the frustrating frequency of making peace with a civ (breaking my MPP treaty) but being thrown right back into war on the next turn as my former enemy attacked my (still) MPP partner. Thus 2 "treaty incidents" - (i) breaking an MPP, and (ii) breaking a peace treaty. In my latest game, my MPP ally made peace and our MPP went away only 8 -10 turns into the MPP.

2. You can now demand strategic or luxury resources in peace negotiations. One frustrating aspect of 1.21f was the inability to demand a luxury trade deal as a condition to peace (even when the enemy was willing to give away cities / techs / gold etc.) In my latest game, in negotiations with an enemy, once "peace treaty" was on the table, so were all the other possible trades (including luxuries) -- they were not greyed out as they had been under 1.21f.

Confirmations or contradictions?
 
I don't know about #1 since I never sign a MPP, but #2 has always been like that for me(at least since 1.21). The reason you couldn't trade before might be because they don't have any extra. If the number in the parenthesis is 0, that means they only have 1 and nobody is allowed to trade away the sole source of a resource purposely.

that's how I remembered it anyways.. hm
 
#2: never seen that, always grey :( even when i had 6 lux extra and they had 4 - nocando :(

#1 - never noticed, but now it is as you describe it.
 
I posted the identical thread over at Apolyton, and the "peace with resources" point got a lot more discussion going earlier in the day. The long and short of the discussion is: (1) half the posters said it had already worked that way before 1.29f; and (2) the other half said it still doesn't work that way in 1.29f.

It never worked that way for me before 1.29f (even if they had no extra and I confirmed a trade route existed, the resource would always show up "greyed out" as for example "Incense (0 extra)"). It still wasn't working that way for one poster in the same 1.29f game (although it's possible that there was no viable trade route in his game). And, finally, I posted a series of screenshots showing how it worked for me under 1.29f at Poly.

I don't provide links to Apolyton from CivFanatics (nor vice-versa), but after you've had your fill / responded to all the posts here and spent some time in the War Academy / Info Center, etc., feel free to check out the 'Poly thread - I just don't want to go through the process of posting 6 screenshots again. :)
 
Catt: i believe you - and I jsut checked: it doesn't work for me. Trade route is line of sight, so to speak, 4 tiles from capital to capital (tiny map), road on each, no units- doesn't work.... :(
 
I'm pretty sure it doesn't work for me either, though this is a change I've been agitating for since I bought the game. *sigh*
 
In reference to the trading of luxuries or resources during peace treaty, it can be done. However, it won't be available most of the time as the other Civ who is at war with you will usually sign a trade embargo against you with another Civ. ;) Eventhough the war has ended between you and him, the embargo has not. :p
 
Originally posted by Dark Sheer
In reference to the trading of luxuries or resources during peace treaty, it can be done. However, it won't be available most of the time as the other Civ who is at war with you will usually sign a trade embargo against you with another Civ. ;) Eventhough the war has ended between you and him, the embargo has not. :p
Click to expand...

Is this something that is new with 1.29? If so I won't argue, though I haven't noticed the change. If you're saying you've been able to do this before the latest patch, would you be interested in changing computers ;) ? I know for a fact that I, at least, could never do it before 1.29 - it was ALWAYS greyed out even if an embargo was not signed against me.

And, Firaxis even told me in a chat some time ago (I think it was right after 1.17 at Apolyton) that negotiating for goods during the peace process was not even on the wish-list, so this comes as a huge surprise if it's possible.
 
I found the place where my question was answered. To my knowledge, this hasn't been changed. This is the kind of thing that would be on the readme, I would think.

http://apolyton.net/misc/chat/civ3/2c3p-chat-4.shtml

Search for "kilroy" and you'll find it. I ask the question three times before Soren finally answers it. You can demand resources while renegotiating peace, but not initially.
 
I can't post the game until late tonight (California, USA time) since the save is on my laptop at home. However, I will post the series of six screen shots detailing the negotiation process that occured step by step.

I had never seen the ability to offer / demand resources before either, and many others are now chiming in to confirm that they can't do it now, even under 1.29f.

I am beginning to believe that I just had a buggy game for some reason.

The game at issue is a "shared" game with a theme - several of us play the same game and then compare notes. It is modded, but only slightly and in superficial ways: (1) the map was edited to produce some interesting features coinsistent with the game theme; (2) playing as the English, our fearless leader's name has been changed from Elizabeth to Tina the Tourist (our citizens celebrate "We Love the Tourist Day"); and (3) I use graphics mods - mostly snoopy's terrain, some from womok (mountains and irrigation IIRC), and the indispensible "easy resource locator" mod by SkankyBurns. No mods to gameplay or game mechanics.

BTW - Killer, I would be grateful if you would PM when you have a moment to explain to me how to post multiple screenshots in one post (instead of the six posts I am now about to do :))

*********************************************
WARNING -- Spoiler to the Apolyton AU 103 Game Below
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Wow, Catt! I want that save!!!! :D

Jsut to see if I can also do that with that save. I will then save it and send it to you again so you can try again. Maybe it is system depended (freaky)....

as for the pics:

do not use the attachment feature, intead type (without the *s):

[img*]http://yourpicsURL[/img*]

then the next......

let's say the pic is named screenshot.jpg and you uploaded it via the easy upload featuree to CFC. Then you need to type:

[img*]http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/screenshot.jpg[/img*]

;)
 
Hmm... AFAIK, in 1.29 MPPs will auto-terminate if and only if you sign peace while your common enemy has troops in your friends' borders.

In my recent game, I was in MPPs with France and England, united against Germany. Germany was at the end of long and narrow landmass next to England, with Joan and I on the other end. Via railroads, we were sharing the brunt of the battle and about to begin winning (by my estimation, not by troop strength -- Germany was still very strong), when Joan lost her nerv and backed out of our rightious crusade for democracy. Her MPP treaty with england was canceled immeadeately, but not her MPP treaty with me.

*shrugs* Two turns later I captured Cologne, and the Germans tried to counter-attack... welcome back to the battlefield, dearest Joan d'Arc!
 
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