None Australian civ?

UU: Anzacs*, infantry, higher strength or
Leader: Governor Lauchlan Macquarie**

*Australian and New Zealand troops in WWI & WWII had the highest comparative success rate of all allied forces but also the highest mortality rate; this reflects some form of dedicated morale - i.e. getting the job done at all costs. I wonder how that would translate into game terms.

**Governor Macquarie (arrived 1810) was a strong early leader known for completing immense civic works in the new settlement, and for his emancipation of convicts and good leadership. While a pre federation leader, historically he was significant. For more information: http://www.hawkesburyhistory.org.au/articles/macquarie.html
 
CorruptAssassin said:
Yeah, I belive the SAS would be a better UU for Australia, ANZAC's weren't uniquely Australian

The SAS isn't uniquely Australian at all.. all we have is an Australian Regiment of the SAS, which is British.

I vote for the Australian Light Horse, as it was something we as aussies tried out on our own in WW1, and to some success.

Great Leaders:- Umm... do we have any? Gough Whitlam is the ONLY Australian PM to be purged from the top job..

Bob Hawke, Paul Keating - Can we actually look back and identify just what they did that was great? The same goes for John Howard too.

Scientific Great People
William Henry Bragg
William Lawrence Bragg
Frank Macfarlane Burnet
John Eccles
Fred Hollows
Garth Illingworth
Bernard Katz

City list, the long one I saw looked good, however Newcastle must be removed as it's an English City Civ name.

Perhaps for a leader, Governor Macquarie
 
I'm amazed no-one has mentioned John Curtin, our first leader to stand for Australias interests over those of the British, and the first to independantly declare war on a nation (Japan; after Pearl Harbor).
 
Ultramyth said:
Leader: Governor Lauchlan Macquarie**

**Governor Macquarie (arrived 1810) was a strong early leader
problem being... he's only a governor. 'Australia' didnt really form until Federation in 1901.

Although light horse gets my first preference, i still think sas is valid too. although it is only a section of the british sas, aus one is much better and really is unique. And i don't think the sas should be like american marines. they are completely different (that is, better trained, and more disciplined, with better success ratios).

Great_Scott said:
Gough Whitlam is the ONLY Australian PM to be purged from the top job..
but the reasons behind the purging are a bit... sus to say the least. remember 'god save the queen, but NO ONE WILL SAVE THE GOVERNOR GENERAL'

and he was right. the guy was practically exiled.

after that the gg has always been to scared to risk sacking the pm.

Whitlam was still australia's greatest leader. i still think he should be the leader of an Australian nation.


So to sum up my votes:
UU first choice: light horse
UU scd choice: Aus SAS

LH first choice: Whitlam
LH scd choice: Menzies




PS: how about we get a poll going to vote on UU and Leaders?
 
I think this mod is a good idea. Australia is a reasonably big player in current world events, and we have a ton of bartering power. We also have one of the finest (if smallest) militaries on Earth. Also, Australians have done a lot for the world - Howard Florey (for the most part) discovered penicillin, some other Aussie invented the Inertia Belt (which is the thing that makes up seatbelts, +1 health for that!), and as I've been informed by VB commercials, it was also an Australian that invented the modern Refridgerator. I should also point out that Australia tends to follow trends from the U.S., whereas New Zealand sticks to England's trends. We may not be the most populous peoples on Earth but we've made a large impact on the world today.

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/as.html

"Australia has an enviable Western-style capitalist economy, with a per capita GDP on par with the four dominant West European economies."

I also vote for the SAS (trooper) being the unique unit- they train Special Forces-types from all over the world. Our SAS also happens to be one of the best, if not the best organizations of its type in the world today.

Aussie Aussie Aussie!
 
Oi Oi Oi

Well, I can see the arguements with Governor Macquarie, and that's fair enough. The light horse is perhaps a good option for a special unit.

Newcastle can be in the city list. It just has to have a different tag. Using this should function correctly. The same goes for any other cities in Australia that mirror English cities.

<Text>
<Tag>TXT_KEY_CITY_NAME_AUSSIE_NEWCASTLE</Tag>
<English>Newcastle</English>
</Text>
 
AUSSIE!

Love the work so far. Two issues with the city list tho:
1. Put Canberra first. There's a reason Sydney and Melbourne never got the capital :p At least make it second on the list, or else there's no point in having it on there at all (it's just a really big office complex, if you ask me :D)
2. Where's Woop-Woop? That famous town's gotta be on the list somewhere :p

Anyway, here's my contribution to the cause:

My ideas on possible leaders:

Governor MacQuarie*:
Traits:
Aggressive: He brought in a new regiment who were better disciplined than the "Rum" corps. The free promotion would represent the better training troops had under him than before.
Expansive: He also brought across some of the first merino sheep; sheep in cIV bring in health, so... expansive it is. :eek: MacQuarie becomes a warmonger!
Favourite Civic:
Mercantilism: British influence here. Makes sense as such. Most trade going through Australia was for a very long time going straight to Britain.

PM John Curtin:
Traits:
Organised: He managed to get Australia through WW2. 'Nuff said!
Philosophical: Seems kind of in keeping with his personality. I've read that he was a pacifist at heart and a "bleeding-heart lefty" of the socialist kind; halved production costs on Universities just fit in here.
Favourite Civic: Not quite sure here, so I leave two options for others to judge on:
1. Nationhood: As a wartime leader, and the first Australian PM to introduce overseas conscription, it makes sense for Curtin to get the draft. On the other hand...
2. Pacifism: His personal biography makes it clear that Curtin was a pacifist at heart. The war did kill him, after all, and the Labor party has frequently been anti-war. Also, gameplay-wise, the +200% Great person rate is just too much to resist :D

PM Gough Whitlam:
Traits:
Creative: Whitlam definitely had imagination, I'll grant that. This trait also covers the general culture boom that took place in the 70s, IMHO.
Philosophical: While I think this combo is pretty broken, none of the other traits seem to fit. Aggressive, Financial and Organised (HAH!) really don't fit Whitlam, Spiritual getting rid of anarchy is another HAH!, and Expansive and Industrious just seem like non-sequiturs. The best excuse I can give is that the Whitlam govt. was big into universities :p
Favourite Civic:
Free Religion: This isn't so much about religion as about multiculturalism. Free Religion represents here more the diversifying in immigration which took place in the late 60s through mid-70s, much of which was done by Whitlam Labor. This also picks up on the Australian religious apathy. :D

PM Robert Menzies AKA "Pig Iron Bob" AKA "Ming the Merciless": :D
Traits:
Financial: See Below.
Organised: I figure this combo because it's the most flattering one I can give to a PM I'm not particularly fond of :p That aside, I think this also sums him and the early Liberal party up very well. Very pro-business, it makes sense for Menzies to get a substantial fiscal bonus in his starting traits. The 50s and 60s were, after all, the "Golden Years".
Favourite Civic:
Universal Suffrage: While technically Australian Aborigines didn't get the vote until the year after Menzies' retirement, the production bonuses this Civic gets fit very well into the Menzies persona. (Looking back he becomes a Washington clone but meh, what're you gonna do? :p)

And now for the Unique units: (Although less thorough because I don't quite understand units yet :p)

Anzac Infantry ('cuz it was always my first thought :p)
Strength: 20
Special Abilities: Guerilla 2 or Amphibious, maybe Amphibious + Guerilla 1
Replaces Infantry

Light Horse: (Not very knowledgeable here :( )
Strength: 15
Special Abilities: No defensive bonus, 50% Withdraw Chance, +50% attacking vs. cannon, 2 first stike chances :confused:
Replaces Cavalry... Or something like the Immortals, as Arkazius said

Australian SAS:
Strength: 24
Special Abilities: Starts with Mobility, Commando, +50% vs. Machine Gun, +50% vs. Artillery, 1-2 first strikes

Aborigine Tracker: (Tho when I used to play Australia as the Mayans in Civ3 I'd always rename the Javelin Throwers as "Koori Hunters"... Just 'cuz it sounded cool and was vaguely correct!)
Strength: 2
Movement: 2
Special Abilities: Better results from tribal villages, +100% vs. animals, CAN attack.
Replaces Scout (maybe warrior as well?)

Great People who could work for Australia: (Tho' I was under the impression that they weren't Civ-specific... Yay!)
- John Batman, Great Merchant (Helped settle Melbourne)
- Quong Tart, Great Merchant (Tea salesman and famous chinaman... don't ask!) (Half-joking)
- Peter Lalor, Great Artist (Odd choice of specialist, I know, but the Ballarat Reform League was more of a cultural thing than anything else, so the culture boost makes a lot of sense. Just look how many Eureka flags are running around today.)
- Howard Florey, Great Scientist (Major contributor to discovery of Penicillin, whatever Bell may claim :p)
- Grollo :p, Great Engineer (Only half-joking; their work has been not insignificant)

No clues for prophets, though... We aren't the most religious of peoples out there, after all. Maybe a great Entertainer might fit the bill instead... Barry Humphries/Dame Edna founding the Church of the Nativity, anyone? :p

Well, that's the ideas list for tonight. Keep up the good work lads! I'm glad to see someone has taken interest in an Aussie Civ.

EDIT *I'm sure I've spelled the name wrong -_-
 
Jebus, what was I thinking? MacQuarie needs either organised or industrious as his second trait, rather than expansive... Need more sleep and less forum-trawling. Ugh. :sad:
 
The Only PM that really stands out to me is Menzies.
I would say though, that the greatest Leader we ever had was a guy names Peter Lalor. For a flag you could use the Eureka stockade flag and the UU I would use the Light Horseman as a replacement for Cavalry maybe.
Here's some attachments in case someone wants to follow up with it.
 

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chowchewchee said:
I think this mod is a good idea. Australia is a reasonably big player in current world events, and we have a ton of bartering power. We also have one of the finest (if smallest) militaries on Earth. Also, Australians have done a lot for the world - Howard Florey (for the most part) discovered penicillin, some other Aussie invented the Inertia Belt (which is the thing that makes up seatbelts, +1 health for that!), and as I've been informed by VB commercials, it was also an Australian that invented the modern Refridgerator.
oh the many things we have learnt from beer ads here down under!:goodjob:

then we have that aussie guy that just got a nobel prize by swallowing bacteria to prove that they cuase stomach ulchers.... cant think of the name... its too late at nite/morning
we also invented the hills hoist.
and australia is one of the worlds leaders in biotech. (or sumthin along those lines)

actually, australias invented a whole lotta things... just cant recall... there was this website that listed it all....

edit combined havester, permaculture,catamarans, the ute, blackbox flight recorder, cement trucks, the notepad, the latex glove, electric drill, xerox copying, bionic ear, X-ray crystallography just to name a few...

australia definately deserves mention.

EvilFuzzyDoom said:
Two issues with the city list tho:
1. Put Canberra first. There's a reason Sydney and Melbourne never got the capital <snip>

shouldn't the cities be listed in order of establishment? or population. although i guess canberra is the capital....

actually, fuzzydooms ideas are quite good.

as for prophets, what about those idiots who don't understand christianity that started hillsong (*sudders at the thought of hillsong*). thats as close as australias come to doing anything the least bit religiously prominent (and thats pretty sad).

what about some aboriginal spirits from the dreaming? that would fit the bill right?
 
I think i know why there isnt an Australian civ yet. No Aussie can be bothered to make it. Fortunately someone can be bothered, and knows how.
:goodjob: CivArmy s. 1994
 
for flag decals, i say:
1) southern cross (white on blue field)
2) eureka stockade flag (pretty much southern cross with an actual cross)
3) boxing kangaroo!! (green field, gold kangaroo, ?red boxing gloves?)

any other suggestions/opinions?
 
Prophet ... what about Fred Nile, he and his misguided flock pray every year for rain to fall on Mardi Gras ... it never does and has actually stopped raining for the parade :lol:

Norman Gunston ... would also be a good prophet :p ... He also has a connection to The Dismissal

Finally what about some of our environmentalists ... Bob Brown, Peter Garrett, etc
 
Dude if you have an aussie civ, don't go ANZAC, they are technically british controlled australian infantry, same with the Light Cavalry. If you want an independent Australian Civ has the Australian SAS, the most elite troops in the world, and make them to replace marines though technically they are airborne troops (Special Air Services). Shame there isnt Paratroopers in this game. I'd give them, Commando, Accuracy, Shock and Flanking Abilities to make it accurate, but have them incredibly expensive to show they take almost half a decade to train. As for leaders i'd have the leaders for Australia someone significant that has led us. Not famous people. If you want famous people in the civ have them as great people. Menzies is a good choice, but i'd also have Whitlam. He made history.
 
Very , very nice!
 
chowchewchee said:
Australia is a reasonably big player in current world events, and we have a ton of bartering power.

Even the Crocodile Hunter isn't daft enough to make a claim like this.

"Australia has an enviable Western-style capitalist economy, with a per capita GDP on par with the four dominant West European economies."

Nice way of not actually describing the true economic power of your nation. To put it in perspective, the GDP of all of Australia is just over $611 billion dollars; the comparative GDP of Japan is $3.75 TRILLION dollars, or more than six times that of Australia. China has a GDP twelve times that of Australia. Taiwan, a tiny little island, has a GDP only slightly less than the entire continent of Australia. The state of California, one of fifty in my country, produces almost as much as two Autralias put together.

Hell, Indonesia has a more powerful economy than Australia does.

If it weren't for Steve Irwin and Crocodile Dundee hardly anyone would know Australia exists, except for the Australians. Big player on the world stage? Hardly. A "ton of bartering power"? Only if you compare yourself to Third World backwaters like Malaysia, or Burma.

Max
 
@ Maxpublic ... please refrain from spamming this and other threads :nono:

Your comments added nothing to the discussion ... and only showed your ignorance
 
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