mikenine1962 said:
Aabraxan, and Spoonwood, at the risk of more punishment on the ropes I was looking at the contact governor settings for Sid level small world HOF wins and I didn't come across any governor settings with production ticked a lot / most had food ticked I looked at ( domination and diplomacy and cultural wins), one or two games had no governor options ticked.
Unfortuantely, this doesn't come as relevant. Look, first things first:
Your principle of food over production in general works well.
Basically all experienced players agree on that principle . I haven't tried to dispute your principle here, I don't think Aabraxan has, nor has Templar_X, nor VMXA.
We all agree. So, please don't make any mistake here, I haven't tried to "punish" you. I've tried to
clarify the distinction between this principle, and how one can implement well in the game to maximize
both food and production, at least in principle.
In terms of the game,
on a turn-by-turn basis emphasize food, does NOT give one extra food. However, emphasize production does. There exists a very simple way to test this.
1. Fire up a game, preferably with an agricultural tribe.
2. Plant a settler.
3. Click enter until 1 turn before the city grows.
3a. Put emphasize production on.
4a. Note how many shields the city has before it grows in the box #(P_1).
5a. Click next turn.
6a. Note how many shields the city has in the box after it grows #(P_2).
7a. Compute the difference #(P_2)-#(P_1).
Then one reloads the game and 3a becomes
3b. Put emphasize food on.
4b. Note how many shields the city has before it grows in the box #(F_1).
5b. Click next turn.
6b. Note how many shields the city has in the box after it grows #(F_2).
7b. Compute the difference #(F_2)-#(F_1).
If you do this experiment, I predict you'll find that #(P_2)-#(P_1) comes out greater than #(F_2)-#(F_1). I predict you also won't find any extra food in the box after growth. Given that happens in your experiment, the simple conclusion here comes as that on
a turn-by-turn basis, emphasize production produces more goods overall.
Now, you may indeed speak correctly that for yourself and for the HoF games referenced, emphasize food works out better. I do not dispute that in the slightest. The problem comes as how do we know how many times you've opened up the city screen when a city grows? If one
never opens up a city screen when it grows, then 'emphasize food' will indeed work better in terms of growth, and almost surely in terms of production also. However, if one
often or
usually opens up a city screen when a city grows, then 'emphasize production' will give one a better overall output in terms of overall food, shields, and commerce, since upon growth one gets
extra production in terms of shields, which as the experiment above hopefully will demonstrate, does NOT happen for food. With respect to what you said here:
mikenine1962 said:
The only way to show undisputed advantage between the 2 emphasis would be to save the same game twice i.e. 4000BC emphasise prod to 3000BC emphasise prod . 4000BC emphasise food to etc.
I find that an interesting thought. However, it still won't show an undisputed advantage in general, because there doesn't exist anything concerning how often the city screen gets opened and toyed with upon growth (or 'micromanagement'.) A player who micromanages
often enough with 'emphasize production' WILL outdo a player who micromanages
on every turn with 'emphasize food' on, in terms of overall food, shields, and production. This will happen due to the fact that on a
turn-by-turn basis 'emphasize production' produces more production, while 'emphasize food' and 'emphasize commerce' NEVER produce more food or commerce under those same conditions. The only thing here comes as that I can't tell exactly what
often enough means, and it no doubt varies from game to game. However, hopefully that doesn't pose a difficulty in understanding that 'emphasize production' DOES give one an extra shield upon growth. I know the city has read that I have '3 turns' left on a warrior, and I get it the next turn due to the 'emphasize production' setting. I know other players around here have also. I predict that nothing similar with 'emphasize food' on will happen.