Palestinian Crisis: More than meets the eye?

[skadistic]

Lets see.....

http://english.people.com.cn/200607/20/eng20060720_284985.html
In here you get to see Israel kill civilians not engage in warfareWere they deliberately targeted? NO.
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/0E74274D-C6AC-4586-B6AA-56F86AF2B764.htm
Here, you get to see the another one of their rocket attacksAnd were the civilians dilberately targeted? No. "Israeli strikes have killed four Palestinians in the northern Gaza Strip after Palestinian fighters launched rockets into Israel," "An armed rocket launcher was targeted with two militants standing beside it ready to launch rockets in northern Gaza Strip," "
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1607450,00.html
In here, they are using sonic booms to cause health problems in succesion several times That deadly sonic boom. How do people who live on air bases survive!!
http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/hrrpt/2003/27929.htm
Here, you see the human rights in Israel. This line from it might helpYou mean discrimination like allowing them to run and hold public office? Vote? Own businesses? Here from the same link

Since the Intifada began in September 2000, and during the year, Palestinians from the West Bank and Gaza continued to perpetrate terrorist attacks against Israeli targets. Terrorist organizations such as the Islamic Resistance Movement (Hamas), Hizballah, Islamic Jihad in Palestine, and the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PLFP), among others, committed numerous acts of terrorism in Israel and the occupied territories. Between January and November, approximately 130 terrorist attacks occurred within Israel and Jerusalem, killing more than 145 Israelis and injuring more than 720. Israeli security forces prevented numerous terrorist attacks against citizens on a daily basis.

http://www.mediamonitors.net/francis7.htmlThe good old genocide BS. The Israelis most be the most inept genociders ever. Its been how many decades? The population has declined by how many millions? For a genocide its a utter failure.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4580139.stm
and a few things on their war crimes....From the link

The report lists "reckless shooting, shelling and air strikes in civilian areas... and excessive use of force"

So the Israelis should just let terrorist attack from behind human shields with out fighting back? When a terrorist uses a human shield it is their violation not the Israelis for fighting back.

"The deliberate targeting of civilians by Palestinian armed groups constituted crimes against humanity," it adds.

It sure is.

Enough?

Yeah I think I've had enough of you.

 

[skadistic]

i'm laughing up a circus side-show here. the idf tries its best to avoid casualites! ha! bs, the idf arose out of what it does best--terrorism.

So you are saying the IDF doesn't hold back? If that were true there would lots more dead pallies.

And you link to a story about 30-40-50 years ago.

 

[skadistic]

Skaddy, staged videos are not irrelevant, but that doesn't make them representative. Some seem to think because some events are staged all are. It's just a propaganda tool.

So, be carefull when you say : you people eat it up hook, line, sinker. because I haven't seen anyone claim that those events were not staged. (could have missed a few posts) At least most don't.

edit: in fact, I see it as stereocrap, where you seem to think it's monocrap. So, who's crap are you willing to swallow hook, line and sinker?

So when I see video of a kasam attack its staged? The staged pallie videos are what the world sees. When you hear about the evil jews shotting kids in the street its from these staged videos. Its not real. Just like in Lebanon when blue hat guy carried the same dead boy from building to building to trump up the death toll. That wasn't real. It was staged. Most of what the pallies release is staged BS.

 

[brennan]

Staged videos are not irrelevant. They are lies shown to the world about how evil the Israelis are. But again its not real. And people like you eat it up hook line and sinker.

I'm sure you'd love to believe that. But you're wrong. Take off the Black and White glasses and look at the world in Technicolor for a change.

The staged pallie videos are what the world sees.

Um, no, we see mobs of Palestinians throwing rocks at the IDF. We see masked gunmen by the truckload shooting AK47s into into the air at unbelievably over-attended funerals for 'martyrs'. We see the shattered remains of suicide-bombed cafes and buses, with bloodstained survivors wondering where their friends are.

And then we see the IDF simply returning the favour, like that'll solve anything. At least one half of the conflict aught to know better, and that's the half that gets criticised. It's like having a go at parent that hits their kids for misbehaving, you're not blaming them for the bad behaviour of their kids, see what i'm saying?

 

[holy king]

oh skadistic, the fact that your opponents are terrorists doesnt make your cause and means right no matter what they are...
count in the fact that they are terrorists because they have no other chance to fight you, and there are a lot of shades of grey to digest for you for now...

and let me guess your answer: "its not israels fault that pallies are terrorists" and "but the terrorists deliberately kill civilians, show me when the israeli have done that!"
am i close?

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

So when I see video of a kasam attack its staged? The staged pallie videos are what the world sees. When you hear about the evil jews shotting kids in the street its from these staged videos. Its not real. Just like in Lebanon when blue hat guy carried the same dead boy from building to building to trump up the death toll. That wasn't real. It was staged. Most of what the pallies release is staged BS.

Is it a sport not to read posts and just continue to rant in this part of the woods?

*Notices topic* *facepalm*

Nevermind. I think I allready know the answer

 

[GarretSidzaka]

Noam Chomsky the Marxist, no thanks.

It's rather disturbing how lefties cooperate with islamists, like they were their ideological allies or what. They somehow fail to understand that the islamists have a completely different agenda. They must be excited to see that there are so many useful idiots in the West...

Don't speak to me unless i speak to you, and trust me, beyond this, I wont

 

[GarretSidzaka]

@ all those who with their heads in the sand

Staged videos my ass!! is this the way you take any evidence contrary to your un-original views and bury it!?! Like those who say there was no holocaust. You are guilty of the same crime

@ all those who believe violence is okay

Palestinian missiles drop onto Israeli cities and suicide bombers bomb people. but to ignore (or worse, approve of) the fact that israel bombs palestinians in a militaristic fashion, is just as inhumane as saying "I support Suicide bombers". "Collateral Damage" is a term that is utterly neo-fascist, and gives governments the RIGHT to bomb civilians and simply mark it off as such.

 

[skadistic]

Who keeps making up words like neo-con, neo-liberal and neo-fascist?And the people who use really know what they mean? What exactly do they mean?

 

[Warman17]

oh skadistic, the fact that your opponents are terrorists doesnt make your cause and means right no matter what they are...
count in the fact that they are terrorists because they have no other chance to fight you, and there are a lot of shades of grey to digest for you for now...

and let me guess your answer: "its not israels fault that pallies are terrorists" and "but the terrorists deliberately kill civilians, show me when the israeli have done that!"
am i close?

They can do so much more than fight. They can accept the Oslo Accord, or accept a two-state system. They can stop infighting, and stop militantism. They can stop corruption and end a system of hate. They can try to rebuild and work with the Israelis, they can allow moderates into the system and do as Jordon and Egypt have in recognizing the Israeli state. It is the Palestinians fault because they have had many chances to do something besides whine that their homeland has been stolen, call death to all Israelis, and then blow up cafes in the name of ending oppression. Israel has, since Rabin, shown its willingness to work with the Palestinian Authority, but is always shunned using whatever useful pretext is at hand.

 

[mrgenius]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuvscDkrs3U

 

[GarretSidzaka]

i use the term neo-fascism to mean a new version of fascism. as opposed to hitlers fascism all other previous. neo-fascism is more insidious and wide-spread, IMO. it is something that relies on misinformation, from both sides.

fascism is an idea that is based on hate or bias. but what makes it fascism is that it is instituted at government or media levels. and this causes it to have a wide support, and views of supports that it is not fascism, but the "right" way

 

[Warman17]

i use the term neo-fascism to mean a new version of fascism. as opposed to hitlers fascism all other previous. neo-fascism is more insidious and wide-spread, IMO. it is something that relies on misinformation, from both sides.

fascism is an idea that is based on hate or bias. but what makes it fascism is that it is instituted at government or media levels. and this causes it to have a wide support, and views of supports that it is not fascism, but the "right" way

We have different meanings for fascism. Fascism isn't just an idea based on hate or bias, that would encompass probably any ideology. Republicanism has an inherent hatred of monarchies, democracy has a bias toward individual opinion and voting. Your definition is too simplistic and simply allows you to label anyone who doesn't have the same views as you as a fascist.

Fascism is an ideology based on ultra-nationalism where the State and its rulers must have overbearing power because the individual and the at-large population is too stupid an inept to govern themselves. The State must be supported because it will lead the Nation to success and glory, and the individual/at-large population will benefit from their rule. It is totalitarian in nature because the State must have a say, not necessarily complete control, in everything.

I would say this is the view supported by its actual definition which wikipedia has:

Fascism is an authoritarian political ideology (generally tied to a mass movement) that considers individual and other societal interests subordinate to the interests of the state. Fascists seek to forge a type of national unity, usually based on (but not limited to) ethnic, cultural, racial, religious attributes. Various scholars attribute different characteristics to fascism, but the following elements are usually seen as its integral parts: nationalism, statism, militarism, totalitarianism, anti-communism, corporatism, populism, collectivism, and opposition to economic liberalism and political liberalism.

and the dictionary:

a governmental system led by a dictator having complete power, forcibly suppressing opposition and criticism, regimenting all industry, commerce, etc., and emphasizing an aggressive nationalism and often racism.

1. A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.
2. A political philosophy or movement based on or advocating such a system of government.

 

[Elponitnatsnoc]

Lets see.....

http://english.people.com.cn/200607/20/eng20060720_284985.html
In here you get to see Israel kill civilians not engage in warfare
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/0E74274D-C6AC-4586-B6AA-56F86AF2B764.htm
Here, you get to see the another one of their rocket attacks
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1607450,00.html
In here, they are using sonic booms to cause health problems in succesion several times
http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/hrrpt/2003/27929.htm
Here, you see the human rights in Israel. This line from it might help


http://www.mediamonitors.net/francis7.html
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4580139.stm
and a few things on their war crimes....

Enough?

This is way too funny to let by, I'm sorry.

The first website is a pro-communist Chinese website, the second is bloody Al-Jazeera, and the fifth tried to install a virus on my computer.

 

[Photi]

Who keeps making up words like neo-con, neo-liberal and neo-fascist?And the people who use really know what they mean? What exactly do they mean?

neo-conservatism is the ideology this group of people gave to themselves. they see themselves as distinct from traditional american conservatism. if they did not actually coin 'neo-conservative' i have never heard of them objecting by being called by this name.

neoliberal probably refers to neoliberalism, and i do not think it is a political ideology, it is more like an economic viewpoint about how society should be structured economically. conservative libertarians like ron paul could probably be described neoliberalism advocates, although 'neo-liberal' may refer to something else. neoliberalism is not an ideology in the sense that neo-conservatism is, whereas 'libertarian' is.

 

[holy king]

is bloody Al-Jazeera

in which way is al-jazzeera a worse source than the bbc...
and what about the us department of state? biased too?

oh, and i dont know what over-sensitive firewall you are using, but the fifth one isnt trying to install anything...

 

[Bast]

Since english is your first language, you should have no problem with this:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=6175346&postcount=43

Three keywords: "Be my guest"

I said I'm only interested in seeing video evidence.

 

[Bast]

Exactly how is it possible to imply that "Jews" control the media and congress (as you and Skad seem convicted i am implying) by saying that anyone with the power and interest in doing so tries to influence the public opinion through the media.



That its wrong to assume that anyone who says something negative about Israel must be an anti-Israel/anti-Semite

Not really. You could say Israelis are bad soccer players. That's not a stereotype. But I wouldn't bother with you because you know you hate but you're just trying to cover up.

 

[Bast]

Since english is your first language, you should have no problem with this:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=6175346&postcount=43

Three keywords: "Be my guest"

Stop beating around the bush... My initial response was to your post below...

Do you think there is a single goverment in the world not staging events?

I said can you stop being vague and show me like evidence or talk about specific things? And then you rambled on about raw sewage and all that. You did not just ask a question. You implied by asking that question that Governments do stage events and that what happened in Pallywood is "normal". Do you take me for a fool?

Little boys with with "big" agenda but not big enough balls to be honest.

 

[Bast]

I'm sure you'd love to believe that. But you're wrong. Take off the Black and White glasses and look at the world in Technicolor for a change.

Why don't YOU look at the world in Technicolor?

Why don't YOU stop looking at Israel as the Demon and Palestinians as innocent Disney characters?

You accuse US of otherwise; but I've not see you looking at the world in Technicolor.

Or is this just a one-way street? One MUST look at the world through our eyes otherwise one is just a "neo-con", "right-winger", etc...?