Amenhotep7
Spartiate
This sounds good, LC, but most people won't have C3C till the holidays.
:santa: Good ideas, though.
:santa: Good ideas, though.
Peloponnesian War Scenario Development Thread
- Thread starter Amenhotep7
- Start date
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
Welllllllllllllllll, Xen....It's been a few more days...I itch to see the map for myself....You don't want a poor man itching, do ya?
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
Kryten-
How go those units? Your big cataphract project is out of the way...XEN- how goes the map??? Couldja post a screenie? Thnx.
The Pharaoh
How go those units? Your big cataphract project is out of the way...XEN- how goes the map??? Couldja post a screenie? Thnx.
The Pharaoh
The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
You can get the Editor minimap to show cultural influence. Just select 'View' and chose 'Territory'.
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
alright, Xen...Sorry I haven't done text, I just think I'll work on that last, considering the civpedia isn't as important...
I see the smilie, but, anyway, I think that the civilopedia is important. Maybe not the text "The first Hoplites were used in Greece bla bla bla", but the facts are important. Special abilities, blitz, all as road, which civs can build which unit, which tech gives radar towers, and so on.Originally posted by Amenhotep7
alright, Xen...Sorry I haven't done text, I just think I'll work on that last, considering the civpedia isn't as important...
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
Alright...I can see ur point...I already have all the units...just need to work on civs...Ur right, mrtn...Thnx!
Kryten
Smeee heeeeed
Under construction as we speak.
(Every time I post a date, it always ends up taking twice as long.
Sooo, as a very rough estimate, and this is subject to unforseen changes, and only a guideline, lets say.....soonish.
)Originally posted by Kryten
Under construction as we speak.
(Every time I post a date, it always ends up taking twice as long.
Sooo, as a very rough estimate, and this is subject to unforseen changes, and only a guideline, lets say.....soonish.
hmmmmm.... if it takes you twice as long as when you say it will be ready...then how about tomorrow
Mongoloid Cow
Great Khan
How about one hour
Greek Stud
Prince
Hello everyone! I am very honored that so many people have taken interest in my herittage. I would like to clear up a lot of the confusion that has been printed here. I am very familiar with these events, and am actually, for fun, trying to put together a Conquest scenario that features the Peloponessian War on it.
Some Facts:
The Sicilians are not a Civilization. Almost all City-States has a colony on the island and when the colonies asked Sparta and Athens for protection from the Phoenicians (Carthage & Utica), they planned to make the island a battleground. Villagers were annoyed at the Athenian fleet that they locked their ships into the lake by blockading the river out into the Mediterranean. They Destroyed the whole fleet thus humiliating and severly weakening them to the Spartans. I might get some facts wrong here but I have dozens of books here on it. One thing is for sure, is that you cannot put the Sicilians as a Civ until at least after this war.
I have Civilizations and their baby cities on a list here at home. Here are the most influencial Greek Civilizations:
Athenians
Corinthians
Magaran (Byzantion & other Sea of Marmara cities)
Argonauts (Nuetral Argos was bullied between Sparta & Athens to join alliances)
Spartans
Milesians (Southern Anatollia)
Anchaians (Central Italy)
Macedonians (Greek Macedonia covered both sides of the mountain, today's F.Y.R.Macedonia in the Balkans is actually a Serbian ethnic State)
Mycanaeans (watch your back with these guys...)
Akragas (the founders of their ethnic Rhodesian group)
Chalkian (Capital on island north of Athens, they founded cities in Graecia and Lybia)
Phokaia (colonated Corseca and founded Massalia or Massielles, later on they expanded to Nikaia or Nice)
Trojan (not much known, just Troy and strong possibility that Rome is to Troy like Carthage is to Tyre)
Ionian Islands (I'd group these together, although they often did things separatly, they also worked together closely. fought the same wars and were strong trading points between Graecia and Mainland Greece)
Cypriots (mostly isolationists, the island was a nice vacation place for the other Greeks to get away. It wasn't long after that Persia and then the Turks decided to end that peace.)
I have much information on the Greek involvement in the other wars occuring in the world. i.e. Israel & Judea against Egyptian province Canaan. Hittites and Egypt fought a little before this, but it can go for a nice mix so that you can have Ethiopia and Nubia included. This is what I am almost ready to complete, I just need and extended map of Eurasia to include the Horn of Africa. In my scenario instead of Persia I put Babylon and Sumeria fighting. Philistine is of course not indepent as it was a settlement of Mycenae. I also had the Slovs, Serbs and Rus to the Northeast and Etruscans to the Northwest. Etruscan invasions would make sense. In my scenario I also had the civilization (Minoans) survive owning their strong commercial islands of Crete and Thera. If you do not want Serbs/Slovs/Rus I would suggest the Dorians who are known for severly weakening the Mycenaeans, who had just betrayed the Minoans killing them and later led the war to Troy because of Helen being kidnapped from Sparta.
Well email me if you want me to quickly respond. I might not even be able to find this thread so:
thejournal2003@yahoo.com
I am a Corinthian/Athenian in real life if you were wondering
Some Facts:
The Sicilians are not a Civilization. Almost all City-States has a colony on the island and when the colonies asked Sparta and Athens for protection from the Phoenicians (Carthage & Utica), they planned to make the island a battleground. Villagers were annoyed at the Athenian fleet that they locked their ships into the lake by blockading the river out into the Mediterranean. They Destroyed the whole fleet thus humiliating and severly weakening them to the Spartans. I might get some facts wrong here but I have dozens of books here on it. One thing is for sure, is that you cannot put the Sicilians as a Civ until at least after this war.
I have Civilizations and their baby cities on a list here at home. Here are the most influencial Greek Civilizations:
Athenians
Corinthians
Magaran (Byzantion & other Sea of Marmara cities)
Argonauts (Nuetral Argos was bullied between Sparta & Athens to join alliances)
Spartans
Milesians (Southern Anatollia)
Anchaians (Central Italy)
Macedonians (Greek Macedonia covered both sides of the mountain, today's F.Y.R.Macedonia in the Balkans is actually a Serbian ethnic State)
Mycanaeans (watch your back with these guys...)
Akragas (the founders of their ethnic Rhodesian group)
Chalkian (Capital on island north of Athens, they founded cities in Graecia and Lybia)
Phokaia (colonated Corseca and founded Massalia or Massielles, later on they expanded to Nikaia or Nice)
Trojan (not much known, just Troy and strong possibility that Rome is to Troy like Carthage is to Tyre)
Ionian Islands (I'd group these together, although they often did things separatly, they also worked together closely. fought the same wars and were strong trading points between Graecia and Mainland Greece)
Cypriots (mostly isolationists, the island was a nice vacation place for the other Greeks to get away. It wasn't long after that Persia and then the Turks decided to end that peace.)
I have much information on the Greek involvement in the other wars occuring in the world. i.e. Israel & Judea against Egyptian province Canaan. Hittites and Egypt fought a little before this, but it can go for a nice mix so that you can have Ethiopia and Nubia included. This is what I am almost ready to complete, I just need and extended map of Eurasia to include the Horn of Africa. In my scenario instead of Persia I put Babylon and Sumeria fighting. Philistine is of course not indepent as it was a settlement of Mycenae. I also had the Slovs, Serbs and Rus to the Northeast and Etruscans to the Northwest. Etruscan invasions would make sense. In my scenario I also had the civilization (Minoans) survive owning their strong commercial islands of Crete and Thera. If you do not want Serbs/Slovs/Rus I would suggest the Dorians who are known for severly weakening the Mycenaeans, who had just betrayed the Minoans killing them and later led the war to Troy because of Helen being kidnapped from Sparta.
Well email me if you want me to quickly respond. I might not even be able to find this thread so:
thejournal2003@yahoo.com
I am a Corinthian/Athenian in real life if you were wondering
yes we can, this si to represent the fact that greek colonization, while the colony was tied to its founding city, was not a loysubservent city- it was it own political entity, and as such the greek city states on Sicilly, headed up by the greatest of them, Syracuse, are going to be an indipendent civ
by the time of this scenario Mycenae was more or less abandoned, and Troy had benn for centuries...
there is no such nationality as an "Argnaaut"- the Argonauts are the men who saild aboard the ship called the Argo to get the Golden fleece from the Black sea kingdom of Chachis- Jason was not argo either, but rather Iolcos
there was however an ARGIVE- that being a citizen of the city of Argos in the peloponesse
the Turks wouldnt be around for the next several centuries (the turks are a central asiatic migratory people originally, coming to Europe with the huns, though almost all modern "turks" are ethnic europeans)
an dmost of the other greek "sub civs" are actually minor- the major greek groups of influence would be the Anatolian States, Athens,and the Italic colonies.
Originally posted by Greek Stud
I have much information on the Greek involvement in the other wars occuring in the world. i.e. Israel & Judea against Egyptian province Canaan. Hittites and Egypt fought a little before this, but it can go for a nice mix so that you can have Ethiopia and Nubia included. This is what I am almost ready to complete, I just need and extended map of Eurasia to include the Horn of Africa. In my scenario instead of Persia I put Babylon and Sumeria fighting. Philistine is of course not indepent as it was a settlement of Mycenae. I also had the Slovs, Serbs and Rus to the Northeast and Etruscans to the Northwest. Etruscan invasions would make sense. In my scenario I also had the civilization (Minoans) survive owning their strong commercial islands of Crete and Thera. If you do not want Serbs/Slovs/Rus I would suggest the Dorians who are known for severly weakening the Mycenaeans, who had just betrayed the Minoans killing them and later led the war to Troy because of Helen being kidnapped from Sparta.
Well email me if you want me to quickly respond. I might not even be able to find this thread so:
thejournal2003@yahoo.com
I am a Corinthian/Athenian in real life if you were wondering
IMHO, your sceanrio is a bronze age 'what if:, and has little to do with the peloponesian war- sorry if i seem a bit pissey, but most of your "corrections" are wrong...
(and I assure you, as a Roman, i to know my classical history, as well as the ever glorious Kryten)
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
No need for strong-ish language, Xen. Yes, Greek Stud. Your information has much info on Greece, but not necessarily any specific war... Welcome to CFC, and don't be discouraged...just try to relate the info to a specific time area...(peloponnesian war era)
Let's see...Soonish times twice as long equals..........
Yes, Greek Stud. Your information has much info on Greece, but not necessarily any specific war... Welcome to CFC, and don't be discouraged...just try to relate the info to a specific time area...(peloponnesian war era)Originally posted by Kryten
Under construction as we speak.
(Every time I post a date, it always ends up taking twice as long.
Sooo, as a very rough estimate, and this is subject to unforseen changes, and only a guideline, lets say.....soonish.
Let's see...Soonish times twice as long equals..........
Kryten
Smeee heeeeed
Welcome to CivFanatics Greek Stud.
And thanks for contributing all your detailed information.
But I must admit that I agree with both Xen and Amenhotep7: this is going to be a scenario covering just the period of 431 to 404 BC, and not a mod about the whole Mediterranean region.
(The difference being that in a mod you still start with just a single settler, and have to build all subsequent cities, while in a scenario all the cities are already pre-placed in their correct historical locations)
But you are quite right about Syracuse & Scilly not really being a 'civilization' as such. Although outside the scope of the scenario as proposed by Amenhotep7, other examples of 'non-civilizations' would be the Celts, the Gauls, the ancient Germanic tribes, and so on.
The game calls all independent power groups a 'civilization', and it is this that is causing the confusion. Perhaps we should really call them 'nations'....although this too is not quite right.
Maybe 'factions' would be a better name (we have to work within the limits of the game when re-creating historical scenarios I'm afraid).
Oh, and other 'factions' that may be neccessary are the Samnites of central Italy, the Illyrians of the eastern Adriatic coastline, and of course the Thracians south of the Danube river.
Please do continue to add your observations, insights and suggestions however.
It is better to thrash them all out now while the scenario is being constructed rather than after it has been finished.
And thanks for contributing all your detailed information.
But I must admit that I agree with both Xen and Amenhotep7: this is going to be a scenario covering just the period of 431 to 404 BC, and not a mod about the whole Mediterranean region.
(The difference being that in a mod you still start with just a single settler, and have to build all subsequent cities, while in a scenario all the cities are already pre-placed in their correct historical locations)
But you are quite right about Syracuse & Scilly not really being a 'civilization' as such. Although outside the scope of the scenario as proposed by Amenhotep7, other examples of 'non-civilizations' would be the Celts, the Gauls, the ancient Germanic tribes, and so on.
The game calls all independent power groups a 'civilization', and it is this that is causing the confusion. Perhaps we should really call them 'nations'....although this too is not quite right.
Maybe 'factions' would be a better name (we have to work within the limits of the game when re-creating historical scenarios I'm afraid).
Oh, and other 'factions' that may be neccessary are the Samnites of central Italy, the Illyrians of the eastern Adriatic coastline, and of course the Thracians south of the Danube river.
Please do continue to add your observations, insights and suggestions however.
It is better to thrash them all out now while the scenario is being constructed rather than after it has been finished.
The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
Xen: Just curious; what do you mean that most Turks today are ethnic Europeans? While the midieval immigration of Turkic nomads appear to've been pretty massive, most of the genetic stock of today's Turks must surely come from Anatolia's indigenous peoples? I can't think of any much immigration from Europe since the Galataeans ...
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
Let's have a little faith in Kryten...He even said that they were "under construction as we speak."
Greek Stud
Prince
Aw Man! I had a thourough response some admittance some defiance and my computer frooze. Well anyways it took me 30mins to write using reference books and I need to go to work. I write back as soon as I get time.
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