OVERLORD (1941 Start) - Second World War In Europe, North Africa, and the Soviet Union

[Moff Jerjerrod]

Hello Civinator! Thank you so much for your labels.txt file you shared with us. That helped me fix the distortion I saw in my game.

Hello Meteor Man! I spent about an hour and a half over the weekend playing as the USSR. Only played one turn to completion. There is a lot to take in with this mod. I was totally blown away at your work. You really created a masterpiece here. C3C is a totally different game now with this scenario. Big thumbs up!

 

[Moff Jerjerrod]

Quick question.

What is the purpose of the 'flag' units? There does not seem to be an explanation in-game.

 

[Meteor Man]

Quick question.

What is the purpose of the 'flag' units? There does not seem to be an explanation in-game.

Flavor. I think it's cool to see the flags on the map. Not everything needs a utility!

 

[Moff Jerjerrod]

Flavor. I think it's cool to see the flags on the map. Not everything needs a utility!

Haha! I see what you mean. Somehow I have been treating them in the way you intended. I like to plant a flag on a named terrain tile.

 

[Chalito]

Do you have a cheat sheet for what the symbols, that are overlaid on top of the unit graphics mean? The symbols are actually part of the units themselves.

 

[Moff Jerjerrod]

Do you have a cheat sheet for what the symbols, that are overlaid on top of the unit graphics mean? The symbols are actually part of the units themselves.

Do you mean the little dots over the box with the x or dot in it? Or are you talking about the little wagon wheel looking symbol at the top of the unit counter?

 

[Meteor Man]

Do you have a cheat sheet for what the symbols, that are overlaid on top of the unit graphics mean? The symbols are actually part of the units themselves.

You mean the NATO symbols? It should be relatively easy to figure out what unit is what by right-clicking a stack and scrolling to the bottom.

I don't have a cheat sheet; there are many unit types. In general, though:

- boxes with a large X in them are infantry units
- single dots are light artillery
- double dots are medium artillery
- dot within a circle is heavy arty
- a triangle indicates anti-tank units. One dot under the triangle for medium, two dots for heavy.
- a blue-grey box with an oval indicates Armor
- grey with an oval and a dot with a line through it indicates Assault guns
- armored cars have an oval like armor but with 3 little wheels underneath and a diagonal line through it
- tank destroyers lack the oval but have the three little wheels under a triangle
- prime movers (trucks) are orange with a wheel in the box
- mechanized infantry has an X like normal infantry but also with an oval

 

[Chalito]

Yes, thank you!!

 

[Meteor Man]

Yes, thank you!!

I made this quick-and-dirty guide to the symbols. But this is probably non-comprehensive and labels don't match the unit type name exactly. The gaps are caused by deleting unused symbols from the units32 file.

also, the very bottom row are for new units I'm adding in the coming version

 

[Moff Jerjerrod]

Thank you Meteor Man! Nice chart. Prime mover, that's what that wagon wheel unit thing is.

 

[Kyriakos]

Can I be in the credits too? Mod has a number of my city sets (though all beyond old works).

 

[Meteor Man]

Can I be in the credits too? Mod has a number of my city sets (though all beyond old works).

Of course, I'm sorry I missed you, friend. Thanks for letting me know, you've been added!

 

[Chalito]

Thank you Meteor Man!!!!

 

[Moff Jerjerrod]

Ok so I spent a couple of hours with the USSR scenario over the weekend. I couldn't stop playing! This mod feels so much like a wargame.

The first few turns were so nerve wracking as the German war machine crashed into the USSR with the launch of Barbarossa. The ai is very smart in executing it's attacks. I swear it even new to withdraw a lone unit that was too far away from it's buddies when it saw I was coming after it.

I've managed to hold off the Finns but German, Rumanian, and now Hungarian units are getting dangerously close to Moscow.

I love how you can't make any unit in every city. The infrastructure must be there to build certain types of units. Well thought out planning on making this scenario.

I lost a lot of planes during the first few turns, not only to my lack of experience but also the ai going after my airfields which were full of planes. Very historically accurate as this is what happened in real life.

 

[Meteor Man]

I lost a lot of planes during the first few turns, not only to my lack of experience but also the ai going after my airfields which were full of planes. Very historically accurate as this is what happened in real life.

Good to see that working. There's a strange bug where the human player can't bomb airfields (on the first turn only?); trying to do so just wastes the unit's turn without doing anything. But at least that doesn't seem to affect the AI.

 

[Meteor Man]

So I've been working on an update and it's taking a little longer than expected. The reason is: unique city graphics!

American cities
Red: New York City
Green: Industrial American City
Blue: American City

German and Polish cities
Red: Berlin
Green: Industrial German City
Blue: German City
Yellow: Polish City

French and Western European cities
Red: Paris
Green: Industrial French City/French City
Blue: Western European City

Soviet cities
Red: Moscow
Green: Industrial Soviet City
Blue: Soviet City

Italian cities
Red: Rome
Green: Industrial Italian City/Italian City

Mideast cities
Red: Industrial Mideast city
Green: Mideast city
Blue: Turkish city

Spanish and North African cities
Red: Spanish city
Green: North African city

Greek and Central European cities
Red: Greek city
Green: Central European city

British cities
Red: London
Green: Industrial British City
Blue: British city


there are a few more besides. I'm not entirely satisfied with them and certainly want to add more. This has added on a little more work to the update but I think it's worth it.

Lots of other things in this coming update, such as:

1. new units like a German battleship, Landing Ship Rocket launchers, Land Mines, PBY Catalina, and more
2. new buildings like Coastal Fortifications and Synthetic Oil Refineries
3. new techs like Anti-Submarine warfare and Schnellbomber
4. lots of fixes and minor additions
5. new unit animations for some light tanks and an American armored car
6. also, no more capturable artillery, which means all arty will have unit tiles with national flags on them

Stay Tuned For More!

 

[Moff Jerjerrod]

Nice to hear you're working on some goodies to update this mod. Meanwhile I'm totally being consumed by the fighting on the Eastern Front. I can't get over how different C3C is playing this mod.

I do have a question though. I noticed that sometimes a Wehrmacht infantry (9/10/1) walks right into a single unit of T-34 (21/13?/2) and simply blows it away? Granted the infantry is a veteran while my T-34 is a regular but I don't get it. I've also seen the same thing happen to machine guns that are fortified in 10+ population cities without the entrenchment building. A unit with an attack of 9 wipes out my mg with a defense of 13 fortified in a large town.

Are there some Flintlock attributes assigned to these units under the hood that could be working some battle magic here?

 

[Meteor Man]

I do have a question though. I noticed that sometimes a Wehrmacht infantry (9/10/1) walks right into a single unit of T-34 (21/13?/2) and simply blows it away? Granted the infantry is a veteran while my T-34 is a regular but I don't get it.

Balancing the roles of infantry versus armored units is perhaps the core of this mod and it's very hard to get right. In regular Civ3, higher stat units win, basically invariably. This would make infantry rather useless. In historical reality, of course, the vast majority of the composition of armies in the Second World War was infantry. My modding solution here was to increase the HP of infantry units, along with making them maintenance-free and producible by most cities. This reduces the dominance of armor, especially in the early to mid-game.

Hitpoints are basically chances to damage an enemy unit. This is more powerful than first appears, which is the technical essence of why your T-34 lost to an infantry unit with half the attack of your defense.

Why is this not necessarily a bad thing, though?

1. From a historical perspective: lone tank units without infantry or artillery support, especially conscripts or regulars versus veterans, are unlikely to hold their own against infantry attacks. You should have infantry in that stack along with the T-34, and preferably also artillery, AT guns, etc, to take HP off the attackers. T-34s are powerful, but not high-tier armored units. Later in the tech tree you will find armored units that are much more robust against infantry.
2. From a gameplay perspective: such danger to armored units make combined-arms much more important for the player, forcing the production and deployment of multiple unit types and their use in-conjunction. Armored units are now useful primarily as breakthrough units when assaulting defensive lines or cities and less in a static defensive capacity. This feeds back into the historical-realist perspective. In WW2, armor could be useful in the defense but this was never preferred over attack. If your armor was being attacked, that was a bad thing.

I've also seen the same thing happen to machine guns that are fortified in 10+ population cities without the entrenchment building. A unit with an attack of 9 wipes out my mg with a defense of 13 fortified in a large town.

Are there some Flintlock attributes assigned to these units under the hood that could be working some battle magic here?

As for your MG unit, I may have reduced the defensive bonuses for cities a wee bit too much. The new values are +10% for a town, +20% for a city, and +30% for a metropolis.* I had reduced them after earlier playtesting in which cities were annoyingly hard to capture. (*I should note however that all cities are on Urban terrain that also gives a +50% defensive bonus.)

In a way, it does make some historical sense to reduce the defensive bonuses of cities from the Civ3 default. Urban battles in WW2 were notoriously bloody. They were meatgrinders that required a steady flow of men and materiel to hold or to take, from both sides.

 

[Meteor Man]

On another note, I am leaning toward Rome with a Colosseum over Rome with St. Peter's Basilica.

also, added to the changelog:

- changed: increased defensive bonuses for town (now 15%), city (now 25%), and metropolis (now 35%)

 

[Moff Jerjerrod]

I totally agree with the way you designed infantry vs. tank units in this scenario. As a WW2 historian myself I know too well unsupported tanks are vulnerable to infantry. I just wanted to confirm what I suspected. I will try using a more combined arms approach as you suggest.

As for the city defense bonus you might be on to something but don't make any changes yet if I may suggest. I'd like to spend more time with the scenario and see how hard it is for me to take back the cities I've lost. Overall I like the city battles so far. The attacker does indeed pay a price for taking a city. I might be too early, at least for myself, to judge if the defenders are getting a fair amount of victories based on historical results.