Amenhotep7
Spartiate
I really like your next tech tree. We'll find some way to elaborate when Kryten releases those units.
Peloponnesian War Scenario -- Phase Two
- Thread starter Amenhotep7
- Start date
The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
All those were separate satrapies? Never heard of a satrap of Pisidia or Isauria, but oh well. Being satrap of the later must've been a rather junior post compared to, say, Egypt!
Personally, I see no pressing need to split up the Persians. Just keep their navy sucky, and they won't be able to play the superpower outside of Asia Minor. Tissaphernian scheming won't be really implementable anyway. Let's just hope the player pays good money for a Persian alliance resulting in little more than the King reannexing Ionia!
Kristoff
Chieftain
So, how long to beta? As for me, this is the most awaited C3C scenario. And probably will be the best
LouLong
In love with Rei Ayanami
List of satrapies (20) in 518 :
1. Media
2. Susiana (around Susa)
3. Babylonia
4. Arabia
5. Assyria
6. Egypt
7. Armenia
8. Cappadocia
9. Lydia
10. Ionia
11. Sea countries (places of the "Sea people" mostly around Cilicia)
12. Sargatia (East of Persia)
13. Parthia (Merv)
14. Aria (between (south of) Parthia and the great lake)
15. Bactriana (Bactra)
16. Sogdian
17. Arachosia (south of Aria)
18. India (along Indus)
19. Gandhara (north of India)
20. Maka (facing Oman).
Then you have areas such as Gedrosia, etc... that are not satrapies as such.
1. Media
2. Susiana (around Susa)
3. Babylonia
4. Arabia
5. Assyria
6. Egypt
7. Armenia
8. Cappadocia
9. Lydia
10. Ionia
11. Sea countries (places of the "Sea people" mostly around Cilicia)
12. Sargatia (East of Persia)
13. Parthia (Merv)
14. Aria (between (south of) Parthia and the great lake)
15. Bactriana (Bactra)
16. Sogdian
17. Arachosia (south of Aria)
18. India (along Indus)
19. Gandhara (north of India)
20. Maka (facing Oman).
Then you have areas such as Gedrosia, etc... that are not satrapies as such.
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
Originally posted by Kristoff
So, how long to beta? As for me, this is the most awaited C3C scenario. And probably will be the best
Thank you very much!
The first post will give you a run-down on what we need.
Unexisted has dropped off the face of the earth, so we'll need a new graphics maker. Any takers?
Thanks, Loulong!
But exactly which ones are in Western Turkey?
I'm starting to have second thoughts about splitting up Persia. It would just be a distraction from the tech tree and units.
Maybe we should take a survey.
LouLong
In love with Rei Ayanami
Depends how far East Western Turkey goes
Definitely Ionia (capital Milet) and Lydia (capital Sardis). Lydia was actually very large a satrapy (including Asian Thracia, Phrygia,...).
If you go nearly as East as Cyprus then you might have Sea countries (Cilicia south of Taurus) but definitely not fully I believe.
Cappadocia is not where we would put it otherwise (as in under the Romans). It is more like Pontus and going Eastwards (modern Georgia) so it should not be in I think.
Definitely Ionia (capital Milet) and Lydia (capital Sardis). Lydia was actually very large a satrapy (including Asian Thracia, Phrygia,...).
If you go nearly as East as Cyprus then you might have Sea countries (Cilicia south of Taurus) but definitely not fully I believe.
Cappadocia is not where we would put it otherwise (as in under the Romans). It is more like Pontus and going Eastwards (modern Georgia) so it should not be in I think.
Louis XXIV
Le Roi Soleil
I don't think the Satrapies are necessary. I thought of it as a way to balance power, why representing the fact that most negotiations took place between individual Satraps (until the Great King fired you and replaced you with someone better 
)
More importantly, here's basically what the Persian military would be:
Horse Archers (I think I saw Kryten making a Horse Archer with Persian clothing, but you could also use the Scythian one made by Kryten): They were the elite of the Persian army. In the Spartan campaigns in the Hellespoint, the Persian Satrap used his army of Greek Mercenaries and Persian Cavalry to help.
Archer (use Bowman): Middle Eastern warfare revolved around the bow (as opposed to Greece or Rome, which preferred heavy infantry clashes). Often, infantry charges wouldn't be ordered until the enemy was completely disorganized by missile attacks.
Persian Spearman (Use True Imortal): Just a generic Spearman that looks Persian.
Greek Mercenary Hoplites (Kryten made a specific unit for this): Comprises of Greek troops under Persian rule. Probably their most effective infantry.
Greek Subjagated Hoplite (Kryten made this as well): Another Hoplite, probably cheaper and available from the start. Has stats to reflect this (It sucks ).
EDIT: I forgot ships. Persia used Phoenician ships, which had a crappy record against Greece. They were promised to help out, though, but that promise was never delivered.
)More importantly, here's basically what the Persian military would be:
Horse Archers (I think I saw Kryten making a Horse Archer with Persian clothing, but you could also use the Scythian one made by Kryten): They were the elite of the Persian army. In the Spartan campaigns in the Hellespoint, the Persian Satrap used his army of Greek Mercenaries and Persian Cavalry to help.
Archer (use Bowman): Middle Eastern warfare revolved around the bow (as opposed to Greece or Rome, which preferred heavy infantry clashes). Often, infantry charges wouldn't be ordered until the enemy was completely disorganized by missile attacks.
Persian Spearman (Use True Imortal): Just a generic Spearman that looks Persian.
Greek Mercenary Hoplites (Kryten made a specific unit for this): Comprises of Greek troops under Persian rule. Probably their most effective infantry.
Greek Subjagated Hoplite (Kryten made this as well): Another Hoplite, probably cheaper and available from the start. Has stats to reflect this (It sucks
).EDIT: I forgot ships. Persia used Phoenician ships, which had a crappy record against Greece. They were promised to help out, though, but that promise was never delivered.
Mongoloid Cow
Great Khan
I don't know if Pisidia or Isauria were satrapies as such, but they were certainly treated autonomously. Both of them were fiercely warlike and independent IIRC and the Persians (and later Alexander the Great) didn't want to war with them at any cost.
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
I don't think it will be necessary to make seperate satrapies. It'll be too much time to research, then put on the map, etc.
While Lou finishes up the tech tree, and Kryten will (hopefully) post those units soon, I have a question: Does anyone know if the Greek Kingdoms had flags? Spincrus is making his woderful flag leaderheads, and I figured the same thing could apply to our Conquest. Anyone? I know one site that has very accurate flags of Sparta and Athens, albeit fictional ones.
So any real ones out there?
While Lou finishes up the tech tree, and Kryten will (hopefully
) post those units soon, I have a question: Does anyone know if the Greek Kingdoms had flags? Spincrus is making his woderful flag leaderheads, and I figured the same thing could apply to our Conquest. Anyone? I know one site that has very accurate flags of Sparta and Athens, albeit fictional ones.So any real ones out there?
The Last Conformist
Irresistibly Attractive
To the best of my knowledge, no form of national or city flags were in use during this period.
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
Curses!
It would've looked so cool, too.
O well.
Edit: Maybe we could have a big "Lambda" for Sparta, a big white one on a red field, and for Athens, we can have an owl, and for Thebes, a black club of Hercules on a goldenrod field.
It would've looked so cool, too. O well.Edit: Maybe we could have a big "Lambda" for Sparta, a big white one on a red field, and for Athens, we can have an owl, and for Thebes, a black club of Hercules on a goldenrod field.
LouLong
In love with Rei Ayanami
Originally posted by Amenhotep7
Curses!
Edit: Maybe we could have a big "Lambda" for Sparta, a big white one on a red field, and for Athens, we can have an owl, and for Thebes, a black club of Hercules on a goldenrod field.
Sounds nice here.
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
Hmmm. I think I'll make some designs on mspaint, and submitit to spincrus' request thread.
I think I'll make some designs on mspaint, and submitit to spincrus' request thread.
Louis XXIV
Le Roi Soleil
Don't count on that last tech tree.
If you want to know what I have, find Xen's original tech tree, see what I didn't use (I don't think I used Advanced Seafaring, though).
So I'm left with 3 techs. I also have "Spartan Hegemony", "Persian Alliance", and "Spartan Professional Navy" for Sparta.
If you want to know what I have, find Xen's original tech tree, see what I didn't use (I don't think I used Advanced Seafaring, though).
So I'm left with 3 techs. I also have "Spartan Hegemony", "Persian Alliance", and "Spartan Professional Navy" for Sparta.
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
Okay, then...Well, In C3C, u don't need all 4...
IT's getting quiet around here, as we're pretty much waiting on Kryten's units. I also need a scout to find willing graphics makers to make a few buildings. Unless of course this is for c3c, so we wouldn't have an arial view anyways...But we'd still need the Civpedia thingys...
We're almost ready for not a public beta, but a private beta, where people sign up for the beta, and play it to give feedback. To be honest, all we really need is for someone to make the tech tree, and Kryten's units. Kryten seems to have dropped off the face of the earth lately, so we need to find him and pick on him til he gets back over here!
IT's getting quiet around here, as we're pretty much waiting on Kryten's units. I also need a scout to find willing graphics makers to make a few buildings. Unless of course this is for c3c, so we wouldn't have an arial view anyways...But we'd still need the Civpedia thingys...
We're almost ready for not a public beta, but a private beta, where people sign up for the beta, and play it to give feedback. To be honest, all we really need is for someone to make the tech tree, and Kryten's units. Kryten seems to have dropped off the face of the earth lately, so we need to find him and pick on him til he gets back over here!
Louis XXIV
Le Roi Soleil
For the third tree, it will be small (Hopeufully it can get as big as the third era in Mesopotamia)
Louis XXIV
Le Roi Soleil
BUMP
BTW, I was being sarcastic, as the third era in Mesopotamia is pitifully small.
I know the final phase of the Peloponnesian War was dominated by Persia, but I can't reflect that, except in the Spartan tech tree. At this point, Athens temporarily revolted into an Oligarchy, but the loyal Athenians at Samos helped to bring back Democracy. I don't know if this is possible.
Finally, I can't remember what was decided for government stats, but I'd suggest that Democracy and Oligarchy have the same WW. Although there was WW before the Peace of Nicias, Sparta was the one more likely to favor peace. One of the faults of Democracy was that it was seen as too warlike, and, even when the final peace was agreed apon, some in Athens still voted against it.
BTW, I was being sarcastic, as the third era in Mesopotamia is pitifully small.
I know the final phase of the Peloponnesian War was dominated by Persia, but I can't reflect that, except in the Spartan tech tree. At this point, Athens temporarily revolted into an Oligarchy, but the loyal Athenians at Samos helped to bring back Democracy. I don't know if this is possible.
Finally, I can't remember what was decided for government stats, but I'd suggest that Democracy and Oligarchy have the same WW. Although there was WW before the Peace of Nicias, Sparta was the one more likely to favor peace. One of the faults of Democracy was that it was seen as too warlike, and, even when the final peace was agreed apon, some in Athens still voted against it.
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
Those are good ideas, Lou.
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
Bump!
Then again, does anybody remember what the WW for those govts are?
Also, does anybody know where Kryten is? I gotta get him back over here!
Then again, does anybody remember what the WW for those govts are?
Also, does anybody know where Kryten is? I gotta get him back over here!
Amenhotep7
Spartiate
bump!
How goes tech tree #3, Louis?
How goes tech tree #3, Louis?
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