Petition for the Maya.

Petition for the Maya.


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Because everyone knows the Maya were really alien-backed Egypto-Babylonians, and Babylon and Egypt are just short journeys from Judah? :mischief:
 
Because everyone knows the Maya were really alien-backed Egypto-Babylonians, and Babylon and Egypt are just short journeys from Judah? :mischief:
Illuminati confirmed...
Illuminati is-real! :p
 
That said, there are some common misconceptions about Jesus, often from Christendom ironically enough, and here's a few of them...1) Turns out that he wasn't executed on a cross, but it was executed on an upright stake/beam. 2) He didn't have long hair, and wasn't clean shaven but had a beard. 3) He wasn't frail and pale, but was fit and brown skinned. 4) And he wasn't born in December in Wintertime, but was born sometime in either September or October in early Autumn...


Well there was probably a guy named Jesus Christ, but just basically this shows you that it's still a myth. Maybe not that he was a myth, but how he's pictured now.
 
That said, there are some common misconceptions about Jesus, often from Christendom ironically enough, and here's a few of them...1) Turns out that he wasn't executed on a cross, but it was executed on an upright stake/beam.

Correct, but misleading. Crucifixion back then had to be efficient due to the sheer number of people that had to be executed. Hence what the Romans did was to permanently install wooden poles at specific execution areas and the convicted would carry the upper part that tied their arms themselves to the area. This is reflected in how Jesus is said to have carried his cross, which in itself also incorrect.

2) He didn't have long hair, and wasn't clean shaven but had a beard.

I don't think anyone has ever claimed Jesus was clean-shaven. That being said, there's no way one could verify how he looked like other than some basics that come with his era and ethnicity.

3) He wasn't frail and pale, but was fit and brown skinned.

He would be considered frail by modern standards due to the poorer living conditions of the time and his own socioeconomic background. What is true is that he probably had very strong forearms due to working as a carpenter, but I wouldn't call that "fit", personally.

As for "brown-skinned", it depends how you define that, I guess. He would be similar in complexion to modern Levantine peoples, which is more or less how Orthodox/Miaphysite iconography portrays him to be. The pale, blonde imagery is mostly Western, more often than not Protestant. This is in itself just a general characteristic of people to always try to portray something in a familiar facade.

4) And he wasn't born in December in Wintertime, but was born sometime in either September or October in early Autumn...

That is generally known in many areas, afaik. The obvious thing even clergymen bring up is "how could Joseph and Mary march all that distance towards Bethlehem if it was well into the winter period?".
 
Well in other news another person has abstained from supporting the Maya.
 
Well there was probably a guy named Jesus Christ, but just basically this shows you that it's still a myth. Maybe not that he was a myth, but how he's pictured now.
Technically speaking "Christ" was not part of his name per se, but his title (from the Greek version of Messiah, meaning "anointed one").

Correct, but misleading. Crucifixion back then had to be efficient due to the sheer number of people that had to be executed. Hence what the Romans did was to permanently install wooden poles at specific execution areas and the convicted would carry the upper part that tied their arms themselves to the area. This is reflected in how Jesus is said to have carried his cross, which in itself also incorrect.
I also heard somewhere that nails used for executions were quite expensive, so the fewer used the more efficient and cost effective, so one nail through both ankles, and one nail through both wrists...sounds painful!

Most likely looked something like this...


I don't think anyone has ever claimed Jesus was clean-shaven. That being said, there's no way one could verify how he looked like other than some basics that come with his era and ethnicity.
Hmm...I recall somewhere him being depicted as clean shaven, or at least with a very thin beard. A bit of "detective work" so to speak can tell us some things, though not everything. In this case, we can consider his culture and time period to work out aspects of what he would have looked like, and from that we know that it would have been highly unusual for him to have long hair or to have been clean shaven. One specific group did grow their hair long, the Nazirites, however other factors show that Jesus wasn't a member of this group (perhaps it's the similar sound of Nazarene to Nazirite that started that misconception?).

He would be considered frail by modern standards due to the poorer living conditions of the time and his own socioeconomic background. What is true is that he probably had very strong forearms due to working as a carpenter, but I wouldn't call that "fit", personally.

As for "brown-skinned", it depends how you define that, I guess. He would be similar in complexion to modern Levantine peoples, which is more or less how Orthodox/Miaphysite iconography portrays him to be. The pale, blonde imagery is mostly Western, more often than not Protestant. This is in itself just a general characteristic of people to always try to portray something in a familiar facade.
His upbringing as a carpenter is only part of the reasoning. The distance he traveled on foot is not by any means for the faint of heart.

That is generally known in many areas, afaik. The obvious thing even clergymen bring up is "how could Joseph and Mary march all that distance towards Bethlehem if it was well into the winter period?".
You won't believe this, but someone just said to me today that he was born in December, so it does still seem prevalent a belief (I took a moment to correct them, by the way).

That is a valid point too about Joseph and Mary traveling to Bethlehem, especially with Mary being pregnant at the time. Doesn't seem to make sense that they would do so in Winter.

Well in other news another person has abstained from supporting the Maya.

I didn't expect a second abstainer so soon, but anyway, still the vast majority are in favor.
 
perhaps it's the similar sound of Nazarene to Nazirite that started that misconception?
I'm reasonably certain the association of Jesus with long hair comes from Renaissance depictions of him, which were influenced by Medieval and Renaissance fashion. I've personally never heard any association of Jesus with the Nazīrīm, though I have heard (mostly refuted) speculation that He was associated with the Essenes.
 
I'm reasonably certain the association of Jesus with long hair comes from Renaissance depictions of him, which were influenced by Medieval and Renaissance fashion. I've personally never heard any association of Jesus with the Nazīrīm, though I have heard (mostly refuted) speculation that He was associated with the Essenes.
That makes sense, though it's a shame that it stuck with us right into the Information era. Historical accuracy is important to me..
Though there does seem to be some striking similarities between Jesus and the Essenes, not everything matches up, so I don't think that there really is a connection. More of a coincidence, I would say.
 
I also heard somewhere that nails used for executions were quite expensive, so the fewer used the more efficient and cost effective, so one nail through both ankles, and one nail through both wrists...sounds painful!

They were sort of expensive, but they used the same nails on everyone which is why a large portion of fatalities from crucifixion were due to contamination/infections from the nail wounds. But the practice of using less nails depends on the circumstance. Sometimes crucifixions didn't even have nails, they simply tied them into the usual cross position with the ropes they used for the criminals to carry their upper part of the cross.

Hmm...I recall somewhere him being depicted as clean shaven, or at least with a very thin beard. A bit of "detective work" so to speak can tell us some things, though not everything. In this case, we can consider his culture and time period to work out aspects of what he would have looked like, and from that we know that it would have been highly unusual for him to have long hair or to have been clean shaven. One specific group did grow their hair long, the Nazirites, however other factors show that Jesus wasn't a member of this group (perhaps it's the similar sound of Nazarene to Nazirite that started that misconception?).

That's true, albeit we have lots of reasons to conclude Jesus was a very unusual person in general and his appearance might have even influenced the image of him being a blasphemer or social deviant by his era's puritan authority standards.

As for the Nazarene part, it's unlikely for 2 reasons. The first one is that there are very early Christian depictions of Jesus where he has short hair, so the misattribution of "Nazarene" as "Nazirite" wouldn't have occurred to the people that were roughly contemporaries and therefore could have a cultural reference for what Nazirite inferred. The second reason is the fact that Christian gospels explicitly already make references to the Nazirites, for example in the case of John the Baptist.

His upbringing as a carpenter is only part of the reasoning. The distance he traveled on foot is not by any means for the faint of heart.

You mean in the desert? Sure, he definitely had endurance. That being said, it's not like he made the whole trip in one go and he would still be quite slender (again, by modern standards).

You won't believe this, but someone just said to me today that he was born in December, so it does still seem prevalent a belief (I took a moment to correct them, by the way).

There are always people that need some:
Spoiler :


I'm reasonably certain the association of Jesus with long hair comes from Renaissance depictions of him, which were influenced by Medieval and Renaissance fashion.

Nah, Jesus has been depicted with long hair since late antiquity. The style which persists in oriental denominations is this:
Spoiler :




But even in those times there were deviations, like the one in Ravenna:
Spoiler :
 
They were sort of expensive, but they used the same nails on everyone which is why a large portion of fatalities from crucifixion were due to contamination/infections from the nail wounds. But the practice of using less nails depends on the circumstance. Sometimes crucifixions didn't even have nails, they simply tied them into the usual cross position with the ropes they used for the criminals to carry their upper part of the cross.
That's pretty bad, but somehow not surprising, especially for that time period.

That's true, albeit we have lots of reasons to conclude Jesus was a very unusual person in general and his appearance might have even influenced the image of him being a blasphemer or social deviant by his era's puritan authority standards.
The Biblical accounts say he could blend in with a crowd of his contemporaries. If so, he cannot have stood out too much in his appearance.

You mean in the desert? Sure, he definitely had endurance. That being said, it's not like he made the whole trip in one go and he would still be quite slender (again, by modern standards).
I wasn't thinking about the desert part, but that too, now that you mentioned it. Actually the area he walked in his life time was a really impressive feat, so if he was slender, he would still have been fit.
 
We are still talking about Jesus in a thread about the Maya....:p
*scrambles*
It's because of how Christianity melded with the Mayan beliefs and gave rise to the cult of the three speaking crosses that fueled the Casta War resistance. which leads me to, Dark horse Mayan leader Canek who could be a part of a third expansion or DLC scenario coupled with Mexico civ...
*looks if there's a mod around*

Jokes aside it would be interesting if a Mayan civ could have one feature relating to modern Mayans, It's so annoying how common is this pop culture idea that the Mayans misteriously "dissapeared".
 
We are still talking about Jesus in a thread about the Maya....:p
Has a party two thousand years ago...It's still being talked about. XD

Also, I worked out that the Maya civilization existed around the time that the Devil tempted Jesus by offering him power over all the kingdoms of the world...I wonder if that somehow included the Maya?
 
*scrambles*
It's because of how Christianity melded with the Mayan beliefs and gave rise to the cult of the three speaking crosses that fueled the Casta War resistance. which leads me to, Dark horse Mayan leader Canek who could be a part of a third expansion or DLC scenario coupled with Mexico civ...
*looks if there's a mod around*

Jokes aside it would be interesting if a Mayan civ could have one feature relating to modern Mayans
Well, on topic, there is actually a significant Syriac Orthodox presence among modern Mayans, which was a statistic that surprised me. :p

It's so annoying how common is this pop culture idea that the Mayans misteriously "dissapeared".
There are still Mayans just like there are still Nahua, but I'd prefer the civ itself focus on Classical Maya personally.

Also, I worked out that the Maya civilization existed around the time that the Devil tempted Jesus by offering him power over all the kingdoms of the world...I wonder if that somehow included the Maya?
"Jesus leads the Maya in Sid Meier's Civilization VI..." :crazyeye: That surely won't offend anyone. :mischief:
 
Well, on topic, there is actually a significant Syriac Orthodox presence among modern Mayans, which was a statistic that surprised me. :p
That is interesting! How did that happen?

There are still Mayans just like there are still Nahua, but I'd prefer the civ itself focus on Classical Maya personally.
Indeed, they didn't actually ""disappear" like some think, they just got depopulated and displaced.

"Jesus leads the Maya in Sid Meier's Civilization VI..." :crazyeye: That surely won't offend anyone. :mischief:
Well he did say "no".
 
"Jesus leads the Maya in Sid Meier's Civilization VI..." :crazyeye: That surely won't offend anyone. :mischief:
Well no offense to Jesus but he isn't Lady Six Sky. Not because I don't like him but he's not a lady or Mayan.
Plus Jesus sounds too Latin for a Mayan leader name. :p
Almost as bad as a French leader possibly leading England...oh wait
 
Well, on topic, there is actually a significant Syriac Orthodox presence among modern Mayans, which was a statistic that surprised me. :p

Apparently a similar thing happened for another group that entered into communion with the Ecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Orthodoxy_in_Guatemala

I'm actually really interested in what caused this. There must be some relevant cultural factors involved as well.
 
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