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Play by play: A go at Monarch

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Strategy & Tips' started by ionize, Jan 28, 2012.

  1. Raliuven

    Raliuven Emperor

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2010
    Messages:
    1,428
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Another thing to try to avoid is moving your worker back and forth across a river unless their ending place after crossing the river has 1) use all of their movement anyway or 2)is on the unimproved tile you are going to be working.

    Of course you can't always help crossing a river to do improvements, but planning your moves so you don't lose turns by crossing is helpful.

    This of course applies to the early game before engineering is researched.
     
  2. ionize

    ionize Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    Location:
    Cork, Ireland
    Here is my latest update. I'm close to the shift from BC to AD.

    Turn-log inside: (warning 40 turns inside! :lol:)
    Spoiler :
    load game
    Change build in Akade to worker
    Change build in Bad-tibira to worker
    Change build in Umma to worker
    Change build in Erech (Desert Valley) to barracks

    IBT
    Masonry => Mathematics

    Turn 81
    Found Akshak in Desert Valley
    Akshak => barracks
    Lagash gets a scientist
    MM Sumer for more fpt
    Adjust sliders, Mathematics in 4 turns
    Just remember upon diplomatic screen, Celts got fur and excess fur as well!

    IBT
    Ur Library => The Great Library

    Turn 82
    vEnkidu vs cWarrior, loss -1hp
    Rush granary in Lagash for 60gp

    IBT
    Lagash granary => Library
    Agade worker => barracks

    Turn 83
    Nothing important

    IBT
    Celtic warrior close to our border
    Umma worker => worker

    Turn 84
    Adjust sliders, Mathematics in 1 turn +21gpt

    IBT
    Mathematics => Currency
    Sumer library => courthouse

    Turn 85
    Nothing important

    IBT
    Brennus wants us out of his land, we apologize. :p

    Turn 86
    Nothing important

    IBT
    zzz

    Turn 87
    Spot a whale at far Easter coast, which hints at another island/continent.
    Will risk a jump with curragh next turn(s)!

    IBT
    10 shields return to Kish.
    Cultural expand in Sumer.

    Turn 88
    Spot land near whale, looks like a continent. I hope the curragh won't sink.
    Spot barbarian camp in nomansland.
    Bad-tibira gets a Scientist
    Adjust slideres, Currency in 3 turns.

    IBT
    Isin enkidu => enkidu
    Curragh sinks... :(

    Turn 89
    rEnkidu vs cWarrior, clean win 25gp from camp

    IBT
    Bad-tibira worker => barracks

    Turn 90
    Change build in Umma to galley. Rush galley for 84gp.
    Adjust sliders, Currency in 1 turn -3gpt
    (save)

    IBT
    Currency => Construction
    Lagash library => settler
    Umma galley => worker
    Kish civil disorder..... ;(
    Kish gets second scientist

    Turn 91
    Adjust slideres, Construction in 8 turns +7gpt
    Rival check:
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts (Republic), 9 cities, peace, weak to, -Literature -Currency
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------

    IBT
    Brennus gives us the boot, we cave.

    Turn 92
    Umma gets a scientist
    Switch all scientists to taxmen, adjust sliders, Construction in 6 turns
    +3gpt

    IBT
    Road to iron done, we could build swordmen now! :D
    See barbarian horseman die to Celtic warrior.
    Kish granary => settler

    Turn 93
    Nothing important

    IBT
    Cultural expansion at Lagash
    Our palace gets a set of stairs and a right wing.

    Turn 94
    Adjust sliders
    Remove all taxmen but in Kish

    IBT
    rEnkidu vs cHorseman, win -1hp, promotes
    vEnkidu vs cHorseman, clean win
    10 shields returned to Bad-tibira

    Turn 95
    Spot ivory North of Ur, on the far Coast :/

    IBT
    Sumer courthouse => marketplace
    Lagash settler => settler

    Turn 96
    Galley arrives in Isin and awaits 1 enkidu and 1 settler to pick up
    Trade Currency for Polytheism +33gp

    IBT
    Brennus wants us out, we apologize.
    rCurragh vs cGalley, loss -1
    Umma worker => galley
    The Celts are building the Temple of Artemis.

    Turn 97
    Nothing important

    IBT
    Erech (Desert Valley) barracks => archer

    Turn 98
    Spot barbarian camp near our border
    Camp enkidu near ivory to check and get settler in.

    IBT
    We hit the Medival Age!
    Isin (Desert Valley) enkidu => harbor
    Our palace gets a left wing.
    We get Monotheism for free.

    Turn 99
    Adjust sliders, Feudalism in 17 turns
    Spot 2nd Ivory near Celtic land

    IBT
    zzz

    Turn 100
    rEnkidu vs cWarrior, loss -1hp
    Rival check
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts (Republic), 11 cities, peace, weak to, -Literature -Construction
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Sell Literature for 37gp
    (save & quit)

    load game

    IBT
    Lagash settler => temple
    Akshak (Desert Valley) barracks => archer

    Turn 101
    rEnkidu vs cWarrior, win -1hp
    Adjust sliders, change taxmen to scientists, Feudalism in 13 turns -1gpt

    IBT
    Agade barracks => swordman

    Turn 102
    The Celts got 2 ivory resources near their land...

    IBT
    Brennus gives us the boot, we cave.
    Bad-tibira barracks => swordman

    Turn 103
    rEnkidu vs cWarrior, loss -1hp

    IBT
    The Celts are building The Great Library

    Turn 104
    Found Zabalam (in the jungle)
    Zabalam (in the jungle) => worker
    rEnkidu vs cWarrior, win -1hp, promotes, 25gp from camp
    Adjust sliders, set up scientist in Umma, Feudalism in 7 turns +4gpt

    IBT
    The Celts are building The Pyramids

    Turn 105
    Lucky!! The new continent got wines at the shore... And I got a settler. :D
    Have to give Lagash a scientist

    IBT
    zzz

    Turn 106
    Find teal borders on new continent.
    Have to give Sumer a scientist

    IBT
    zzz
    Sumer marketplace => temple

    Turn 107
    Found Kissura (wineyard) on new continent :)
    Discover horses right next door (one cultural expand)
    Kissura => harbor
    Contact Americans
    Rival check:
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    America (Despotism), 11 cities, peace, weak to,
    -Philosophy -Literature -Construction
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Trade Philosophy to America for 34gp
    Build embassy in Washington, size 2, The Pyramids in 112 turns
    Adjust sliders, Feudalism in 3 turns +2gpt

    IBT
    Kish settler => worker
    Erech (Desert Valley) archer => archer
    Entremont (Celtic) completed The Oracle
    Massive barbarian uprising near Kish!??

    Turn 108
    vArcher vs cWarrior, clean win
    Trade Construction to Celts for 8gp +1gpt

    IBT
    Lincoln wants us out, we apologize

    Turn 109
    vArcher vs cWarrior, clean win
    rEnkidu vs cHorseman, win -1hp
    Adjust sliders, Feudalism next turn +14gpt
    Scientist for Kish
    Trade Monotheism to Celts for 15gp +2gpt

    IBT
    Feudalism => Chivalry
    Lagash temple => courthouse
    Umma galley => catapult
    The Americans are building The Temple of Artemis
    Ali Ibn Rabban (SGL) is born in Ur :D

    Turn 110
    vArcher vs cHorseman, win -1hp
    rEnkidu vs cHorseman, win -1hp
    rGalleon vs cGalleon, clean win
    Contact the Hittites
    Contact the Netherlands
    Build embassy in Hattusas (Hittite), size 6,
    The Temple of Artemis in 26 turns
    Build embassy in Amsterdam, size 5, The Pyramids in 27 turns
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts (Republic), 11 cities, peace, weak to, -Feudalism
    Hittites (Despotism), 9 cities, peace, weak to, -Literature
    -The Republic -Monotheism -Feudalism
    America (Despotism), 11 cities, peace, weak to, -Literature
    -The Republic -Monotheism -Feudalism
    Netherlands (Despotism), 10 cities, peace, weak to, -Literature
    -Polytheism -Currency -The Republic -Construction
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    (save)

    IBT
    massive barbarian movements around the globe
    Akshak (Desert Valley) archer => granary

    Turn 111
    vArcher vs cHorseman, win -1hp
    rEnkidu vs cHorseman, win -1hp

    IBT
    Kish worker => settler
    Zakam (in the jungle) worker => worker

    Turn 112
    vArcher vs cHorseman, clean win
    rEnkidu vs cHorseman, win -2hp
    vEnkidu vs cWarrior, win -1hp
    rGalleon vs cGalleon, clean win
    Umma second scientist
    Contact Persia
    Rival check
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Persia (Anarchy), 9 cities, peace, weak to, +Engineering -Literature
    -Monotheism -Feudalism
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Trade Literature and The Republic with Persians for Engineering
    +207gp
    Build embassy in Persian Persepolis, size 6, The Temple of Artemis
    in 9999 turns

    IBT
    vEnkidu vs cHorseman, loss -1hp
    Sumer temple => cathedral

    Turn 113
    vArcher vs cHorseman, clean win, 25gp from camp
    Kish gets a scientist
    Change production in Umma to temple
    Trade Monotheism to Persia for 228gp
    Trade Monotheism to Hittites for 33gp
    Trade Monotheism to America for 7gp
    Trade Engineering to Celts for 90gp +5gpt
    Rush harbor in Kisurra (wineyard) for 212gp
    Rush courthouse in Lagash for 204gp
    Rush granary in

    Turn 114
    Nothing important

    IBT
    Lagash courthouse => marketplace
    Kisurra (wineyard) harbor => worker

    Turn 115
    rEnkidu vs cWarrior, win -1hp, 25gp from camp

    IBT
    Cultural expansion in Sumer
    Agade medieval infantry => archer

    Turn 116
    Nothing important

    IBT
    William wants us out, we apologize
    Bad-tibira medieval infantry => medieval infantry

    Turn 117
    Upgrade vEnkidu to Pikeman for 60gp
    Trade Feudalism to Celts for Monarchy +72gp +3gpt

    IBT
    Cultural expansion in Lagash
    Erech (Desert Valley) archer => archer
    The Persians are building The Great Library

    Turn 118
    rGalleon vs cGalleon, clean win, promotes
    Second scientist in Kish
    Rush harbor in Isin (Desert Valley)

    IBT
    Celts demand 27gp, we cave
    Chivalry => Theology
    The Great Library is finished in Ur!
    Ur TGL => temple
    Isin (Desert Valley) harbor => galley
    The Celts are building Sun Tzu's Art of War

    Turn 119
    Bad-tibira gets a scientist
    chop forest near Sumer

    IBT
    Lincoln wants us out, we apologize
    Zabalam (in the jungle) worker => granary
    The Celts are building The Hanging Gardens

    Turn 120
    rEnkidu vs cWarrior, win -2hp
    Switch Agade to worker
    (save & quit)
    Finally I found every other rival. They are the Americans, the Dutch, the Hittite and the Persian (as well as good old Brennus of the Celts).

    The tech-pace is crawling. I'm in a slight lead before the Celts and Persian and we outpace the other three by far. The Great Library will not have any effect, unless Brennus and Xerxes take the lower branch, while I go for Democracy.

    I still have my SGL and I'm not sure for what to use him:
    a) Sistine's? Well I will have three cathedrals at max by then.
    b) Sun Tzu's? Well I wanted to go conquest, but at the moment it will not have that big an effect.
    c) The Hanging Gardens? Would be nice, I could release Entertainment costs. But I could also hook up the wines (soon...) and get the ivory due North near Celtic land.
    d) Templars? Would be nice to wage war with Brennus. I got 3-4 barracks now pumping (slow) veteran units.
    e) The FP? Would like to have it in the East/NE territory to boost productivity.

    Your input would be much appreciated. :)
     

    Attached Files:

  3. Spoonwood

    Spoonwood Grand Philosopher

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2008
    Messages:
    4,842
    Location:
    Ohio
    I'd recommend

    f) The Pyramids in Zabalam, and sell all your granaries.

    You could also go:

    g) The Great Lighthouse so you might trade earlier with your wines city and the other continent.

    If you can pull off the Republic slingshot, don't build the Great Library. I don't know why you had stopped settler and worker production from cities where you built granaries. Generally speaking it works out well to put out settlers and workers from cities with granaries. I would settle on that hill nearest the coast up north of Ur, as well as clearing marsh squares so that you can found cities up there. In other spots you have tiles within your cultural borders that you can't use, because you don't have cities near there, such as the hill southwest of Ur, and west of Ur also. You have a lot of open tiles in the south where I would put cities also. A settler bought from Agade this very turn (instead of a worker) can also help you to plant up near those horses sooner. You have a lot of good tiles in terms of production near Ur which you could use if you had more cities in the spots I've mentioned (even more so once cleared in one case).

    In general, I wouldn't recommend worrying about infrastructure all that much, other than some granaries and possibly barracks if you really fear an AI (the Celts lie FAR too far away to worry about them, in my opinion), until you've settled all the tiles that you can, and you have plenty of workers. On this map, 15 workers for 12 cities isn't even close to enough. You need a lot more to clear the marsh and jungle that you can use. Also, when you have a city hit size 12 like that of Ur or Sumer, you don't want it to have extra food in the box for long. Mine or forest tiles so that you can maximize the number of shields you pump out of that city.

    I'd swap Sumer to the Forbidden Palace, and NOT chop that forest near it. Instead mine a tile near it so you might get the Forbidden Palace in faster. You might also want to take the luxury slider higher even to say 60% so your citizens can work more tiles. You have the Great Library and so much potential territory that researching later on whenever you want to shouldn't pose much of a problem at all. You don't need courthouses in cities like Sumer. In other words, in core cities you rarely, if ever, can profit enough from a courthouse.

    Temples and cathedrals might come as advisable on this map, but you really can use so many workers and settlers to settle and develop so much more territory that seems far away to me. You said this
    I also feel frustrated with no luxuries in sight. But, jungles and marshes don't frustrate me in general (unless playing for a fast domination/conquest game), because 1. they consist of uncleared grassland. Once you clear them, you have rather powerful tiles. 2. Jungles like this usually hide coal, so you almost surely won't have a problem getting coal in the industrial age. 3. Marshes usually hide oil if you get into a real pinch. 4. The AIs generally don't even try and settle near jungles and marshes. 5. You can clear those tiles in general far more effectively than the AIs since you can put out more workers to clear them than the AIs ever will (using stacks of workers on unroaded squares in this case can work out very well).

    Don't bother researching to Democracy. Going Monotheism-Theology-Education-Banking/Astronomy before going on the lower path often works out well, since the AIs generally prefer the lower path, and thus you can get to techs first and trade for the AIs techs and possibly luxuries (not here for a while). But, revolting to Democracy from a Republic doesn't make sense unless you play as religious (and it might not even then).

    Again, you really can use A LOT more workers and settlers on this map.
     
  4. Spoonwood

    Spoonwood Grand Philosopher

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2008
    Messages:
    4,842
    Location:
    Ohio
    That only happens if you have 2 industrious workers (pre Replaceable Parts) stacked on one flatland tile, and they both build the road. This doesn't factor in how much time you've spent in moving those workers to that tile.

    I think I agree that in most games "you do not need to lose a lot of sleep over lost turns going from a tile you just worked to another tile to work, as long as you get there that turn." as you put it VMXA, given that you have a fair amount of workers in the first place. Not having enough workers comes as a serious drawback, while not optimizing worker turns comes on an entirely different level and seems minor in comparison at least. I think I also agree with the rest of the post.

    That said, I would NOT recommend one start a game planning to stack them. I'd recommend that one start a game planning to use only one worker per road on a flatland tile as much as one reasonably can do so. Game situation will often dictate a better play otherwise absolutely, like roading to a neighbor so you might trade for their extra luxury source, to clear marsh or jungle in a situation like this possibly, or for a war.
     
  5. Spoonwood

    Spoonwood Grand Philosopher

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2008
    Messages:
    4,842
    Location:
    Ohio
    How would everyone else having this much marsh and jungle around on a map like this?

    To me with this much marsh and jungle, the game seems more easily played for a spaceship launch with clearing it all, especially with the AIs so far away. But, would you want to do this playing for conquest/domination since that would imply probably more wars later on, or would you more seek to clear less of it, and just try to overwhelm the AIs earlier? Or do rails and more workers counterbalance going to war later on for say an "average" player? Does anyone know of any similar situation in a COTM competition to see what different players did with a start like this?
     
  6. ionize

    ionize Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    Location:
    Cork, Ireland
    Thanks Spoonwood for that wall of text. It's really helpful.

    Sounds reasonable. With the SGL The Pyramids will be up very fast. I just hope the AI still goes slow on building wonders and don't pop The Pyramids next turn... :mischief:

    This piece is special to me. I usually am allergic to jungle and marsh tiles and hate to consider settling them. But I will try and pump out more workers from my satellite cities and settlers from Ur, Sumer and Lagash (they build fastest).

    Currently my workforce is working night and day to erase the jungles near Sumer/Lagash (which is almost done).

    I will try this and see the effect for myself. I mean, I usually build the FP farther away from my capital than just two tiles. :lol:

    Thanks for asking this. I hope other more experienced players than I will provide some answers. For me it's a first to play this kind of map. :crazyeye:
     
  7. ionize

    ionize Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    Location:
    Cork, Ireland
    Oh I forgot to address the victory conditions. Initially it was supposed to be Conquest, but I didn't wage a single war so far. Meh... :blush: At the moment I think about Diplomatic or Spacerace. But maybe (with more cities on my continent and use of all the good tiles) I can still start massing an army and steamroll those pesky rivals. :lol:
     
  8. ionize

    ionize Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    Location:
    Cork, Ireland
    Just played a couple of turns. Jungle is 60% gone, marsh next. My core is strong and I hit a Golden Age. Pumping a lot of military at the moment and then... The Celts declared on me and are now throwing archers only at my MID, pikemen and archers. :lol: Have two galleons ready with 1MID 1settler each and will go in the offense in their territory.

    Hope to give you an update this evening, or tomorrow evening. It depends.

    [Edit:]
    Only problem is, I can't use my trebuchets, because of the hills and mountains. :lol:
     
  9. del62

    del62 Deity

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2008
    Messages:
    2,078
    Location:
    Northern England
    An SGL will build the pyramids immediately, which I assume triggered your Golden Age
     
  10. ionize

    ionize Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    Location:
    Cork, Ireland
    Ah, OK! The GA helped me a lot. I capture my first Celtic city and am pushing Celtic archers around left and right. I think I aim for the long haul and destroy Brennus outright. After that the continent is nearly 100% mine, apart from some pesky colonies (cities) from the Netherlands and Persia (but hey Conquest right ahead :mischief: ).
     
  11. Raliuven

    Raliuven Emperor

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2010
    Messages:
    1,428
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Just a clarification - if you use the SGL it will reduce the build time of the Pyramids to 1 turn. You do not receive it the turn you use the SGL. You will receive it on the following turn.

    However, because of the game mechanics, the wonder will build before the AI's production takes effect. Long story short, if you only have 1 turn left on a wonder build you will build it regardless* of what the AI does, build wise. The human gets the better end of this deal.

    *Of course the AI could seize or raze the city. Or it could flip. :D In addition, invasions by the AI may steal away/pillage shield producing tiles and pollution may do the same and cause your build to go an additional turn. But unless your build margin is razor thin (nice micromanging :goodjob:) this is rarely ever a factor. It is also a non-issue with SGLs as the SGL fills the production box to 100% of the needed shields.

    And, lastly, city riots. If the shield box is not full then this will delay you. If you use a SGL, however, IIRC because the shield box is 100% full the wonder would produce regardless.
     
  12. Spoonwood

    Spoonwood Grand Philosopher

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2008
    Messages:
    4,842
    Location:
    Ohio
    Once you have roads on those mountains, your trebuchets (and cannons and other units with similar restrictions) can cross over those squares. Actually, can't trebuchets cross hills, but not mountains and jungles without roads? Stacking workers on unroaded mountains to build roads faster so that you can move your artillery units to the war front earlier, I think, does make sense.
     
  13. ionize

    ionize Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    Location:
    Cork, Ireland
    I was thinking about shipping them in once I established a coastal city on the other site of the mountain range. I got a strong fleet and want my mass of workers rather to cut down those jungles and marshes. :)
     
  14. CommandoBob

    CommandoBob AbstractArt

    Joined:
    May 18, 2005
    Messages:
    8,231
    Location:
    Too near The Temple of Jerry Jones
    :nono:

    Oh, don't worry.

    If they won't bring war to you, just take the war to them. :trouble:

    They'll understand.
     
  15. ionize

    ionize Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    Location:
    Cork, Ireland
    Oh, at the moment Brennus is bleeding for is disrespect. :lol:

    So here is an update!

    Turn-log inside: (Warning! 30 turns :) )
    Spoiler :
    load game
    Rival check:
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts (Republic), 13 cities, peace, weak to, -Chivalry
    Hittites (Despotism), 9 cities, peace, average to, -Literature
    -The Republic -Monarchy -Feudalism -Engineering
    America (Despotism), 12 cities, peace, average to, -Literature
    -The Republic -Monarchy -Feudalism -Engineering
    Netherlands (Despotism), 10 cities, peace, average to, -Literature
    -Polytheism -Currency -The Republic
    Persia (Republic), 10 cities, peace, average to, -Monarchy
    -Feudalism
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Change Zabalam (in the jungle) to The Pyramids
    Use SGL to rush The Pyramids
    Change Ur to settler
    Change Sumer to Forbidden Palace
    Change Umma to worker
    Change Akshak (Desert Valley) to worker
    Change Isin (Desert Valley) to worker
    Adjust sliders, Theology in 14 turns +9gpt
    3 scientists left in Umma (1) and Kish (2), but both produce worker/
    settler and reset.
    Set reserach path to Theology => Education => Astronomy

    IBT
    Umma worker => worker
    MM Umma
    Agade worker => medieval infantry
    Akshak (Desert valley) worker => archer
    The Pyramids are finished in our land! Rejoice. :lol:
    Sumeria enters a Golden Age.
    Zabalam (in the jungle) The Pyramids => worker
    The Celts are building The Hanging Gardens
    (fill in lots of AI wonder production change messages)

    Turn 121
    vArcher vs cWarrior, win -1hp
    Upgrade eEnkidu to Pikeman for 60gp
    Adjust sliders, Theology in 8 turns
    Sell Monarchy to Persian for 24gp
    Sell all my granaries (4) for 15gp ea

    IBT
    Ur settler => marketplace
    Kish settler => settler
    Civil disorder in Kisurra (wineyard). *darn*
    Amsterdam (Dutch) finishes The Great Wall

    Turn 122
    Stop worker who chops forest near Sumer
    Umma gets a Taxman

    IBT
    Erech (Desert Valley) archer => medieval infantry
    Isin (Desert Valley) worker => galley
    Cultural expansion at Zabalam (in the jungle)

    Turn 123
    vPikeman vs cWarrior, win -1hp, 25gp from camp
    Found Der on hill SW of Ur
    Der => harbor
    Warn Lincoln to remove his troops from our land, he apologizes

    IBT
    Lagash marketplace => worker
    Umma worker => worker

    Turn 124
    Found Kua (Desert Hills) close to Desert Valley
    Kua (Desert Hills) => galley
    MM Der and Ur for better fpt/spt in Der

    IBT
    Persian swordmen comes to our wineyard..
    Lagash worker => settler

    Turn 125
    rEnkidu vs cWarrior, clean win, 25gp from camp
    rGalley vs cGalley, clean win
    (Time to be a good friend to my rivals:)
    Gift The Republic for 11gp to America
    Gift The Republic for 33gp to Hittites
    Gift The Republic for 26gp to Netherlands

    IBT
    vMID vs cWarrior, win -1hp
    Akshak (Desert Valley) archer => medieval infantry
    Kisurra (wineyard) worker => worker

    Turn 126
    vArcher vs cWarrior, win -1hp
    vArcher vs cWarrior, clean win, 25gp from camp
    rEnkidu vs cHorseman, win -1hp
    Found Marad (horse ranch) cxc of Kissura (wineyard)
    Marad (horse ranch) => worker

    IBT
    Ur marketplace => settler
    Lagash settler => worker
    Bad-tibira MID => trebuchet
    Zabalam (in the jungle) worker => harbor

    Turn 127
    Nothing important

    IBT
    road to wines done (need Astronomy asap...)
    We build the Forbidden Palace in Sumer
    Sumer FP => settler
    We love the King Day in Lagash
    Lagash worker => settler
    Umma worker => worker
    Kish settler => worker

    Turn 128
    vMID vs cHorseman, clean win
    Gift Literature to Hittites for 29gp

    IBT
    rEnkidu vs cWarrior, loss -1hp
    Theology => Education
    Ur settler => settler
    Agade MID => MID

    Turn 129
    Nothing important

    IBT
    A lot of Celtic archers come close to our main land
    Sumer settler => settler
    Kish worker => temple
    Isin galley => galley
    Entremont (Celts) builds The Mausoleum of Mausollos

    Turn 130
    Found Kuara close to Ur
    Kuara => harbor
    Rival check:
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts (Republic), 14 cities, peace, average to, -Theology -Chivalry
    Hittites (Republic), 11 cities, peace, average to, -Monarchy
    -Feudalism -Engineering -Theology
    America (Republic), 12 cities, peace, average to, --Feudalism
    -Engineering -Theology
    Netherlands (Republic), 11 cities, peace, strong to, -Literature
    -Polytheism -Currency
    Persia (Republic), 10 cities, peace, strong to, -Feudalism
    -Theology
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    (save & exit)

    (load game)
    IBT
    Ur settler => barracks
    Lagash settler => settler
    Umma worker => harbor
    Erech (Desert Valley) MID => trebuchet
    Akshak (Desert Valley) MID => MID
    Volcano in Celtic land erupted *gnihihi :D*

    Turn 131
    Warn William to get out, he apologizes.
    Adjust sliders, Education in 12 turns -9gpt

    IBT
    Sumer settler => barracks
    Bad-tibira trebuchet => MID
    Our palace's front is paved now.

    Turn 132
    Nothing important

    IBT
    Ur barracks => MID

    Turn 133
    vMID vs cWarrior, clean win, promotes

    IBT
    Mursilis wants us out, we apologize
    Lagash settler => barracks

    Turn 134
    Found Kutha (in the jungle)
    Kutha (in the jungle) => barracks
    Found Nagsu (horse ranch) on small island with horse
    Nagsu (horse ranch) => harbor
    vMID vs cWarrior, win -3hp, 25gp from camp
    We gift Monarchy to Hittites for 29gp
    (save & exit)

    (load game)
    IBT
    Ur MID => MID
    Sumer barracks => MID
    Kua (Desert Hills) galley => harbor
    Celts lose a town because of volcano

    Turn 135
    Found Susa (The Rock) in near my natural mountain borders
    Susa (The Rock) => Enkidu

    IBT
    Celts in our land...
    Agade MID => MID
    Erech (Desert Valley) Trebuchet => MID
    Isin (Desert Valley) galleon => worker
    Akshak (Desert Valley) MID => MID
    Kisurra (wineyard) worker => enkidu
    Marad (horse ranch) worker => enkidu

    Turn 136
    Ask Brennus to leave, he apologizes... *whew*
    Found Tutub (near the swamp)
    Tutub (near the swamp) => worker

    IBT
    Xerxes wants us out, we apologize
    Mursilis gives us the boot, we cave
    The Celts declared war on us!!!
    vPikeman vs rArcher, win -3hp
    vArcher vs rArcher, win -2hp, promotes
    vArcher vs rArcher, clean win
    vArcher vs rArcher, win -1hp
    Ur MID => MID
    Sumer MID => MID
    Our main palace gets a 2nd floor
    Hattusas (Hittites) has build The Temple of Artemis
    Persepolis (Persia) has build The Hanging Gardens

    Turn 137
    (save)
    Found Kutallu (golden hill)
    Kutallu (golden hill) worker
    vMID vs rArcher, clean win, promotes

    IBT
    See only Celtic archers coming my way. Duh!
    Lagash barracks => MID
    Isin (Deser Valley) worker => galley

    Turn 138
    Tell Xerxes to get out, he apologizes
    (save & quit NOTE: all ready to go!!!)

    (load game)
    IBT
    Lincoln wants us out, we apologize.
    Ur MID => MID
    Sumer MID => pikeman
    Der harbor => worker

    Turn 139
    eMID vs rArcher, clean win
    rEnkidu vs rArcher, clean win
    vArcher vs rArcher, clean win

    IBT
    Mursilis wants us out, we apologize.
    Kish temple => courthouse
    Bad-tibira MID => MID
    Susa (The Rock) enkidu => worker
    Akshak MID => MID

    Turn 140
    eMID vs rArcher, win -1hp
    vArcher vs rArcher, win -2hp, promotes
    vMID vs rArcher, win -1hp
    vPikeman vs rArcher, win -3hp
    (save)
    Rival check:
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts (Republic), 14 cities?, war, strong to, -Theology? -Chivalry?
    Hittites (Republic), 11 cities, peace, strong to, -Theology
    -Chivalry
    America (Republic), 12 cities, peace, strong to, -Feudalism
    -Engineering -Theology
    Netherlands (Republic), 12 cities, peace, strong to, -Monarchy
    -Monotheism -Feudalism -Engineering
    Persia (Republic), 10 cities, peace, strong to, -Theology -Chivalry
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Tell Xerxes to get out, he apologizes.

    IBT
    vPikeman vs rArcher, loss -1hp
    Golden Age has enden.
    Ur MID => MID
    Sumer Pikeman => Pikeman
    Lagash MID => MID
    Civil disorder in Umma, MM second scientist...
    Zabalam harbor => galley

    Turn 141
    Adjust sliders, Education in 1 +17gpt
    vMID vs rArcher, clean win
    vMID vs rSpearman, win -1hp
    vMID vs rSpearman, clean win
    Trade Theology to Persia for 60gp +38gpt
    Gift Theology to Hittites for 2gp
    Gift Theology to America for 7gp

    IBT
    Education => Astronomy
    Great Library obsolete
    Isin (Desert Valley) galley => barracks

    Turn 142
    Adjust sliders, Astronomy in 14 turns -5gpt
    vMID vs rArcher, win -1hp
    vMID vs rArcher, win -2hp, promotes => we capture Agedicum, 2 slaves
    We abandon Agedicum
    Brennus will speak, but offers no cities. More war it is.
    Send William words to "get out", he apologizes

    IBT
    rEnkidu vs rArcher, loss -1hp
    eMID vs rArcher, loss -1hp
    Der worker => worker

    Turn 143
    vMID vs rArcher, clean win, promotes
    (save & quit Note: Check Diplo and F1!!!)

    (load game)
    Tell William to get out, he apologizes
    Tell Xerxes to get out, he apologizes

    IBT
    Ur MID => MID
    Sumer pikeman => MID
    Kish cultural expansion
    Agade MID => MID
    Erech (Desert Valley) MID => MID

    Turn 144
    Found Anshan (Celtic front) in place of Agedicum
    Anshan (Celtic front) => harbor
    vMID vs rArcher, win -1hp
    vMID vs rArcher, clean win
    rGalley vs rGalley, clean win
    Interestingly enough Brennus knows Invention. Won't trade. Will make him!!

    IBT
    Lincoln gives us the boot, we cave.
    Mursilis gives us the boot, we cave.
    vMID vs vArcher, clean loss
    rEnkidu vs rArcher, loss -1hp
    vMID vs vArcher, win -2hp, promotes
    Lose three workers in Kisurra to barbarians, damn Musilis... I want blood
    for that soon!
    Cultural expand in Zabalam (in the jungle)

    Turn 145
    vMID vs cWarrior, clean win
    eArcher vs rArcher, win -2hp, GL!
    vArcher vs vArcher, clean win
    Tell Xerxes to get lost, he apologizes

    IBT
    vArcher vs rArcher, win -3hp, promotes
    Lagash MID => MID
    Akshak (Desert Valley) MID => archer
    Kisurra (wineyard) enkidu => worker
    Marad (horse ranch) enkidu => worker
    Tutub (near the swamp) worker => worker

    Turn 146
    eArcher vs vArcher, win -1hp
    Tell Xerxes to budge, he apologizes

    IBT
    Oho! I see a Celtic longbow (seems like no iron after all :lol: )
    Ur MID => archer
    Kutallu (golden hill) worker => worker
    Alesia (Celtic) completed The Great Lighthouse (mine soon!)

    Turn 147
    eMID vs vLongbow, clean win
    vArcher vs rArcher, win -2hp
    Form our first proud Sumerian army! Fill it with 3 MID!
    eMID vs rLongbow, win -2hp, GL!
    rEnkidu vs rArcher, loss -1hp
    vMID vs cWarrior, clean win, 25gp from camp
    Brennus forces just die and he won't trade... well well :D

    IBT
    William wants us out, we apologize
    Lincoln wants us out, we apologize
    Ok, Brennus completely ignored my forces. :lol:
    Barbarians near Anshan (Celtic front)
    Sumer MID => archer
    Susa (The Rock) worker => worker
    Der worker => worker

    Turn 148
    vMID vs rWarrior, win -1hp
    eMID vs rArcher, clean win
    vArcher vs vArcher, win -3hp, promotes
    eMID vs rArcher, win -1hp
    vArcher vs rArcher, clean win, promotes
    Trade Chivalry for Invention with Persia

    IBT
    eArcher vs rArcher, loss -1hp
    vMID vs rLongbow, loss -2hp

    Turn 149
    eArcher vs rLongbow, win -3hp
    Pillage tile at Gergovia
    Adjust sliders, Astronomy in 9 turns -12gpt
    Kish gets a taxman
    Umma has to get a clown and will starve no matter how much I use the
    sliders, they won't change
    Change Umma to temple and rush it for 46gp...
    Kua (Desert hill) gets a scientist
    Change Kua (Desert hill) to temple
    Bad-tibira gets a scientist and will starve
    Change Bad-tibira to temple and rush it for 132gp...
    Sell Education to Persia for 10gp +34gpt

    IBT
    vMID vs rLongbow, loss -1hp
    vMID vs rLongbow, loss -1hp, promotes.. ;(
    Ur longbow => longbow
    Lagash MID => longbow
    Umma temple => harper, will keep clown.. ;(
    Bad-tibira temple => pikeman
    Isin (Desert valley) barracks => MID
    Kua (Desert hills) temple => harbor
    Volcano in American land erupted

    Turn 150
    Rival check:
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts (Republic), 15 cities, war, strong to, -Education
    Hittites (Republic), 11 cities, peace, strong to, -Chivalry -Invention
    -Education
    America (Republic), 12 cities, peace, strong to, -Engineering -Chivalry
    -Education
    Netherlands (Republic), 12 cities, peace, strong to, -Monotheism
    -Feudalism -Engineering
    Persia (Republic), 10 cities, peace, strong to
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    (save & quit Note: Check F1! Units not moved! Kick Lincoln out or war. :lol:)

    Long story short, I conquered one city so far... War is going slow, but steady.
    Some interesting facts:
    1. Brennus has no iron. He only throws archers and longbows at me. :D
    2. Two GLs so far. One MID army is already en-route to the front, the other will form soon.
    3. It was not just me who got f**ked over by the terrain. America, Netherlands and Hittites are knee-deep in jungle and surrounded by mountains as well.
    4. Only Brennus and Xerxes got really lucky with terrain. I will be happy to conquer Celtic land and make it my own. We are the bor.... .... ah! Wrong text. :lol:

    For those too lazy to read the log, here is some further info.

    And I realized how long turns can get when you wage a war... :crazyeye:
     

    Attached Files:

  16. ionize

    ionize Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    Location:
    Cork, Ireland
    As the Celtic war is going well and I will have Brennus sacked within the next 10-20 turns I'm looking for excuses to get the war to the new frontier (a.k.a. the other continent). I'm no good with intercontinental wars and could need some advice here.

    Here are a few information:
    - Got a few galleons and am saving up for upgrades at the moment.
    - Got two cities on the other continent (for wines and horses, which I got connected via sea trade thanks to astronomy and navigation).
    - The land is hard rocks in the middle and tons of jungle to the NE and SE.
    - The only two nations which look scary to me at the moment are the Americans (they are big) and Persia (they got Gunpowder and a lot of closed in fertile land to the NE of their continent).

    Now two additional questions are:
    1.) Do I start a new war now, while I fight Brennus? How should I do it?
    2.) Do I sign in as many allies as possible to get them all to waste units?
     
  17. CommandoBob

    CommandoBob AbstractArt

    Joined:
    May 18, 2005
    Messages:
    8,231
    Location:
    Too near The Temple of Jerry Jones
    A lot depends on how your cities are defended and how easy it is to send them more units. Do you have a ship chain set up to those new cities?

    If the cities are well defended and they can be reinforced rather easily, then going to war over there and signing up allies into MAs is a good plan. If nothing else, you allies will bleed your target a bit while you finish up on the homeland. They fight and you watch.

    Make sure the MAs are tied to gold per turn. Too often, if you give someone a tech for an MA, they'll do a half hearted job of the war; half-hearted even by AI standards. A few units will trudge to the front line, flex their muscles and then that AI makes peace with your target. They gain a tech and you gained nothing. Using gpt, resouces or, as a last resort, luxuries, will keep them at war longer, since even if they do nothing active they get paid. And an inactive ally is better than an active foe.

    The longer they are at war with the target means that the target cannot trade with them for goodies. And that helps you.

    Can you post a save?
     
  18. ionize

    ionize Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    Location:
    Cork, Ireland
    @CommandoBob Ok! Thanks for the info. I have now killed the Celts and have a period where I want to relax (or rather I want to ship my army over :mischief:).

    Here is the turn-log (BIG, 50 turns!!)
    Spoiler :
    (load game)
    Tell Lincoln to move or die, he moves.

    IBT
    Akshak (Desser Valley) longbow => longbow
    Zabalam (in the jungle) galley => settler

    Turn 151
    Form 2nd Army with MIDs
    Adjust sliders, Astronomy in 4 turns -37gpt

    IBT
    Mursilis wants us out, we apologize
    Sumer longbow => MID
    Agade MID => MID
    Kutha (in the jungle) barracks => pikeman

    Turn 152
    Get our armies in position and ship in 2 trebuchets (gotta produce more now)
    Tell Lincoln to move or die (again), he moves.

    IBT
    Ur longbow => university
    Der worker => settler

    Turn 153
    Army #1 and stack +trebuchets meet up. Ready to go! >;D
    pillage roads

    IBT
    Lagash lonbow => university
    Cultural expand at Umma
    Cultural expand at Bad-tibira
    Susa (The Rock) worker => worker
    Erech (Desert Valley) MID => aqueduct
    Cultural expand at Kua (Desert Hills)

    Turn 154
    Trebuchets 2/2
    vMID vs rArcher, clean win
    pillage roads

    IBT
    Lincoln gives us the boot, we cave
    vMID vs rLongbow, win -2hp, promotes
    Americans settle Detroit in OUR mountain range (that's a declaration of war
    to me...)
    Astronomy => Navigation
    Now we got WINES finally connected! :D
    Tutub (near swamp) worker => harbor

    Turn 155
    (20 turns alliances)
    Adjust sliders, Navigation in 19 turns +23gpt
    Change Erech (Desert Valley) to temple
    Change Sumer to knight
    Change Akshak (Desert Valley) to knight
    Army #2 vs rLongbow, clean win
    pillage roads
    Disband enkidu in American land. Can't get it out..
    Buy Hittites into war with Celts for Chivalry
    Buy Persia into war with Celts for Astronomy, get 56gp
    Gift Engineering to America for 18gp.
    Trade Wines with Monotheism for Dyes from Netherlands

    IBT
    A ton of archers +longbows walk past my army #1 +stack
    'Our people want to build the Heroic Epic!'
    Civil disorder in Anshan (Celtic front), give them a scientist
    Kisurra (wineyard) worker => caravel
    Marad (horse ranch) worker => harbor
    Our palace's right wing got a second floor
    Volcano near Entremont (Celtic) is active

    Turn 156
    (19 turns alliances)
    Army #2 vs rSpearman, win -3hp
    Army #2 vs rSpearman, clean win, MID promotes
    eMID vs rSpearman, win -4hp
    (longbow left, but leave it to take town with Army #2 and secure)
    eArcher vs vLongbow, clean win
    vMID vs rLongbow, clean win
    vMID vs rLongbow, win -3hp
    Gift Engineering to America for 20gp

    IBT
    Zabalam (in the jungle) settler => library
    Kutallu (golden hill) worker => worker

    Turn 157
    (18 turns alliances)
    vLongbow vs rArcher, win -2hp
    vMID vs vLongbow, win -1hp
    eMID vs rSpearman, loss -1hp
    eArcher vs rSpearman, win -1hp
    Army #2 vs rArcher, clean win, we take Alesia +0gp +The Great Lighthouse
    vGalleon vs rGalleon, win -2hp
    Trade Education to Hittites for Spices +2gpt
    Gift Education to America for 21gp
    Gift Engineering to Netherlands for 2gp
    I decide to abandon Alesia, for safety reasons.

    IBT
    eArcher vs rLongbow, loss -1hp, promotes
    Sumer knight => university
    Bad-tibira pikeman => longbow
    Isin (Desert Valley) MID => MID

    Turn 158
    (17 turns alliances)
    Army #2 vs vLongbow, clean win

    IBT
    Brennus wants peace. I tell him to get lose.
    I see Xerxes losing an archer and settler to Brennus...
    Ur university => Copernicus's Observatory
    Susa (The Rock) worker => barracks
    Volcano at Entremont erupted. *gnihihi :lol: *

    Turn 159
    (16 turns alliances)
    Found Babil (Celtic front) cxxc N of Anshan (Celtic front)
    Babil (Celtic front) => walls
    Siege of Lindum:
    Trebuchets 1/2
    vMID vs rSpearman, win -1hp
    vMID vs rSpearman, win -2hp
    vMID vs rLongbow, win -1hp, capture Lindum, 1gp
    Abandon Lindum
    vArcher vs cWarrior, clean win, promotes, 25gp from camp
    Capture to slaves (Persian)
    Rush harbor in Anshan (Celtic front) for 184

    IBT
    Army #2 vs vLongbow, win -1hp
    Agada MID => settler
    Akshak (Desert Valley) Knight => Knight
    Anshan (Celtic front) harbor => walls

    Turn 160
    (15 turns alliances)
    Army #2 vs rLongbow, win -1hp
    Adjust sliders, Navigation in 9 turns
    Nagsu gets a scientist
    (save)
    Rival check:
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts (Republic), 13 cities, war, strong to, -Education
    Hittites (Republic), 11 cities, peace, strong to, -Astronomy
    America (Republic), 13 cities, peace, strong to, -Chivalry -Invention
    -Astronomy
    Netherlands (Republic), 12 cities, peace, strong to, -Theology -Chivalry
    -Invention
    Persia (Republic), 10 cities, peace, strong to
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    IBT
    vPikeman vs rLongbow, win -3hp
    VPikeman vs rLongbow, loss -1hp
    A ton of aqueduct messages pop up...
    Kutha (in the jungle) pikeman => settler

    Turn 161
    (14 turns alliances)
    Found Apisala (elefant farm) on Celtic side of continent near ivory
    Apisala (elefant farm) => walls
    War weariness sets in 23% in UR
    Adjust sliders, Navigation in 15 turns +9gpt

    IBT
    Kish courthouse => settler
    Kua harbor => settler
    Kuara harbor => settler

    Turn 162
    (13 turns alliances)
    Sell Astronomy to Hittites for 23gp +11gpt
    Adjust slideres, Navigation in 10 turns -3gpt

    IBT
    Der settler => library

    Turn 163
    (12 turns alliances)
    eArcher vs rLongbow, clean win

    IBT
    Xerxes wants us out, we apologize
    vMID vs rLongbow, win -1hp
    Lagash university => knight
    Zabalam (in the jungle) library => marketplace

    Turn 164
    (11 turns alliances, Dyes in 10 turns , Spices in 12 turns)
    eArcher vs rLongbow, loss -2hp, promotes
    Trebuchet 2/2
    eMID vs rArcher, win -3hp
    Army #2 vs vLongbow, clean win

    IBT
    eMID vs rLongbow, loss -2hp

    Turn 165
    (10 turns alliances, Dyes in 10 turns , Spices in 12 turns)
    Nothing important

    IBT
    Lots of Celtic moves, no attack.
    Sumer University => Knight
    Agade settler => settler
    Isin (Desert Valley) MID => settler

    Turn 166
    (9 turns alliances, Dyes in 9 turns , Spices in 11 turns)
    :lol: Barbarians right next to one of my workers in the mountains.
    ---
    Siege of Ratae Coritanorum:
    vMID vs vSpearman, clean loss
    vKnight vs vSpearman, loss -1hp, promotes
    vMID vs eSpearman, loss -2hp
    vLongbow vs rSpearman, win -3hp
    vLongbow vs eSpearman, clean win, capture Ratae Coritanorum +0gp
    Abandon Ratae Coritanorum
    ---
    Siege of Gergovia:
    Trebuchets 1/2
    Army #2 vs rSpearman, win -3hp
    Army #2 vs rSpearman, win -2hp
    vMID vs rSpearman, win -1hp
    vMID vs rLongbow, win -2hp, capture Gergovia +3 slaves +0gp
    Abandon Gergovia
    ---
    Anshan (Celtic front) gets a scientist
    (save & quit)

    IBT
    William wants us out, we apologize
    vKnight vs cHorseman
    Kutallu (golden hill) worker => worker
    Our palace's left wing got a second floor.

    Turn 167
    (8 turns alliances, Dyes in 8 turns , Spices in 10 turns)
    Trebuchets 2/2
    vKnight vs cWarrior, win -1hp
    eArcher vs rLongbow, clean win
    Army #2 vs vLongbow, clean win
    Army #1 vs vLongbow, win -3hp
    Army #1 vs rLongbow, win -1hp, MID promotes
    vMID vs rLongbow, win -2hp
    vMID vs rLongbow, win -2hp

    IBT
    Kish settler => settler
    Bad-tibira longbow => pikeman
    Kua (Desert Hills) settler => settler
    Kutha (in the jungle) settler => library
    The Hague (Dutch) builds The Colossus

    Turn 168
    (7 turns alliances, Dyes in 7 turns , Spices in 9 turns)
    rGalleon vs cGalleon, win -1hp
    Trebuchets 2/2
    eArcher vs vLongbow, win -3hp
    eMID vs rLongbow, win -2hp
    vMID vs rLongbow, win -1hp

    IBT
    Erech (Desert Valley) temple => pikeman
    Akshak (Desert Valley) Knight => Knight

    Turn 169
    (6 turns alliances, Dyes in 6 turns , Spices in 8 turns)
    Found Dabrum
    Dabrum => walls
    Army vs rLongbow, clean win

    IBT
    vMID vs rLongbow, loss -2hp, promotes
    vMID vs cHorseman, clean win
    vMID vs cWarrior, clean win, promotes
    Navigation => Gunpowder
    Lagash knight => knight

    Turn 170
    (5 turns alliances, Dyes in 5 turns , Spices in 7 turns)
    eMID vs cWarrior, clean win
    Trebuchets 2/2
    Army vs vLongbow, clean win
    Army vs rLongbow, clean win
    Army #2 vs rLongbow, clean win
    Oho, first hittite unit I see actually on our continent. And it's a settler with
    guards...
    Trade Worldmaps around
    Sell Navigation to Xerxes for 70gp +46gpt
    (save. Note: Think about stopping war with Brennus after alliances expire.)
    Rival check:
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts (Republic), 11 cities, war, strong to, -Astronomy
    Hittites (Republic), 11 cities, peace, strong to, -Navigation
    America (Republic), 13 cities, peace, strong to, -Astronomy
    Netherlands (Republic), 12 cities, peace, strong to, -Theology -Invention
    Persia (Republic), 10 cities, peace, strong to
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    :lol: Brennus would give me 60gp +39gpt for peace. (Keep in mind!!)
    (Note: My strongest rivals now are the Americans. I think I buy in the others
    for war later. But first I will finish Brennus of.)

    IBT
    Apisala (elefant farm) gets a scientist

    Turn 171
    (4 turns alliances, Dyes in 4 turns , Spices in 6 turns)
    eMID vs rLongbow, win -2hp
    eMID vs cHorseman, win -1hp, 25gp from camp
    Science 0%, Gunpowder in 49 turns +88gpt

    IBT
    Sumer Knight => Knight
    Isin (Desert Valley) settler => settler
    Kuara settler => settler
    Kutallu (golden hill) worke => worker

    Turn 172
    (3 turns alliances, Dyes in 3 turns , Spices in 5 turns)
    Start to cut Entremont of off Celtic land (pillage).
    Xerxes knows gunpowder and won't trade. (I think I have my new opponent
    to wage for on the other continent once I'm done with Brennus. :lol:)

    IBT
    Cultural expand in Erech (Desert Valley)

    Turn 173
    (2 turns alliances, Dyes in 2 turns , Spices in 4 turns)
    Army vs rLongbow, win -2hp
    Kisurra (wineyards) gets a taxman
    Uh! Xerxes will trade gunpowder for WM 378gp +24gpt. Not yet.

    IBT
    Xerxes wants me out, I apologize.
    Xerxes loses a settler to Brennus. :lol:
    Kish settler => settler
    Agade settler => pikeman

    Turn 174
    (1 turns alliances, Dyes in 1 turns , Spices in 3 turns)
    Found Erech
    Erech => walls
    vMID vs rLongbow, win -1hp, promotes
    Found Isin
    Isin => harbor

    IBT
    Celts and Persia signed a peace treaty.
    Lagash knight => knight

    Turn 175
    (Spices in 3 turns)
    Cancelled alliance with Hittites (accidentaly :blush:)
    Found Akshak
    Akshak => walls
    ---
    Siege of Camulodunum
    Trebuchets 2/2 (he got only 2 defenders +?archers)
    vMID vs rSpearman, win -1hp
    vMID vs rSpearman, clean win, capture Camulodunum +0gp
    Abandon Camulodunum
    ---
    Army vs rLongbow, clean win
    Capture 2 slaves (former Persian)
    vLongbow vs rLongbow, clean win
    (save & exit Note: Diplo! Check F1!)

    load game
    Buy harbor in Nagsu (horse ranch) for 36gp

    IBT
    Dyes-deal with Netherlands end.
    Lincoln wants to trade WM, I don't care.
    Riots left and right, because of dyes. (next time raise sliders before trade
    expires...)
    Bad-tibira pikeman => longbow
    Susa (The Rock) barracks => longbow
    Erech (Desert Valley) pikeman => longbow
    Zabalam (in the jungle) marketplace => temple
    Kua (Desert hills) settler => caravel
    Nagsu (horse ranch) harbor => caravel
    Tutub (near the swamp) harbor => temple

    Turn 176
    (Spices in 2 turns)
    Change Kisurra (wineyard) to settler
    Give Kisurra (wineyard) a clown...
    Change Anchan (Celtic front) to settler
    Give Anchan (Celtic front) a clown...
    Change taxman in Apisala (elefant farm) to scientist to keep min. science up
    ---
    Siege of Burdigala:
    vKnight vs rSpearman, win -1hp
    vKnight vs rSpearman, loss -2hp, promotes
    vLongbow vs vSpearman, clean win, capture Budigala +0gp +2 slaves
    Abandon Budigala
    ---
    vLongbow vs rLongbow, win -2hp
    Entremont is completely cut off.
    Army vs rLonbow, clean win
    Trade wines +horses +WM +250gp for Gunpowder with Persia
    Trade Navigation for WM +40gp with Hittites
    Trade Astronomy for 40gp with America

    IBT
    Der library => marketplace
    Lugdunum has build Sun Tzu's Art of War
    We lost our supply of spices

    Turn 177
    Buy spices from Hittites for 237gp +5gpt
    Army vs rLongbow, win -1hp
    Rush Knight in Sumer for 72gp to oppose barbarians
    eMID vs vLongbow, win -2hp
    Trade Gunpowder to Hittites for WM 250gp +12gpt
    Trade saltpeter to Persia for WM 30gp +10gpt
    Gift William Theology for WM +4gp
    Gift Lincoln Navigation for 12gp
    Change all longbow and pikeman builds to musketmen
    War weariness strikes again 37% in Ur. Harder elsewhere.
    => have to adjust sliders and do full clowns in three cities.
    => have to defeat Brennus a.s.a.p.

    IBT
    eMID vs rLonbow, win -2hp
    Sumer Knight => Knight
    Akshak (Desert Valley) knight => knight

    Turn 178
    Civil disorder in Dabrum => gets a taxman
    Found Anshan
    Anshan => worker
    ---
    Siege of Richborough:
    Army vs vSpearman, win -5hp

    IBT
    vPikeman vs vLongbow, loss -3hp
    Babil (Celtic front) walls => settler
    Isin (Desert Valley) settler => temple
    Kutallu (golden hill) worker => woker
    Barbarians capture one worker

    Turn 179
    (Spices 18 turns)
    vMID vs vLongbow, clean win
    ---
    Siege of Richborough:
    Army vs vSpearman, clean win
    Army vs rSpearman, -4hp, capture Richborough +0gp
    Abandon Richborough
    ---
    vKnight vs cWarrior, win -1hp
    Army vs rLongbow, win -3hp
    Found Kisurra
    Kisurra => walls

    IBT
    Lagash knight => cathedral
    Cultural expand in Der

    Turn 180
    (Spices 17 turns)
    ---
    Siege of Lapurdum:
    Trebuchets 2/2
    vMID vs rSpearman, clean win
    vMID vs rSpearman, win -1hp, capture Lapurdum +0gp
    Abandon Lapurdum
    ---
    Upgrade galley to caravel for 30gp
    I tell William to get out, he apologizes.

    IBT
    eMID vs vLongbow, win -1hp
    Umma harbor => marketplace
    Kish settler => marketplace
    Civil disorder in Dabrum... clown

    Turn 181
    (Spices 16 turns)
    vKnight vs cWarrior, clean win, +25gp from camp
    ---
    Siege of Tolosa:
    vKnight vs rSpearman, win -1hp, promotes
    vKnight vs rSpearman, win -2hp, capture Tolosa +0gp +2 slaves
    Abandon Tolosa
    ---
    Found Kua
    Kua => walls
    Change Apisala (elefant farm) to harbor
    Rush harbor in Apisala (elefant farm) for 164gp
    Tell William to get out, he apologizes
    Hittites know Printing Press, but won't trade.
    (save)
    Rival check:
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts (Republic), 6 cities, war, strong to
    Hittites (Republic), 11 cities, peace, strong to, +Printing Press
    America (Republic), 14 cities, peace, strong to
    Netherlands (Republic), 12 cities, peace, strong to, -Education
    Persia (Republic), 11 cities, peace, strong to
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    IBT
    William wants us out, we apologize.
    Zabalam (in the jungle) temple => university
    Kuara settler => settler
    Kutha library => settler
    Apisala (elefant farm) harbor => caravel
    Persian settler duos stream into former Celtic land

    Turn 182
    (Spices 15 turns)
    vKnight vs vLongbow, win -1hp
    Upgrade galleon to caravel for 30gp
    Upgrade galleon to caravel for 30gp

    IBT
    William wants to trade WM, I don't care.
    Ur build Copernicus' Observatory
    Ur Copernicus' Observatory => trebuchet

    Turn 183
    (Spices 14 turns)
    Nothing important

    IBT
    Lincoln wants us out, we apologize.
    Hittites want to trade WM, I don't think so.
    Barbarians in fromer Celtic land.
    Sumer Knight => Knight
    Gordium (Persian) finishes Knights Templar

    Turn 184
    (Spices 13 turns)
    eLongbow vs cWarrior, clean win
    ---
    Siege of Cataractonium:
    Trebuchets 2/2
    vMID vs rSpearman, clean win
    vMID vs rSpearman, win -3hp, captures Cataractonium +0gp
    Abandon city
    ---
    Found Marad
    Marad => harbor
    Upgrade galleon to caravel for 30gp

    IBT
    Ur trebuchet => trebuchet
    Cultural expand at Zabalam (in the jungle)
    Kutallu (golden hill) worker => harbor

    Turm 185
    (Spices 12 turns)
    vLongbow vs cWarrior, win -1hp, +25gp from camp
    Found Kutha
    Kutha => walls
    Upgrade galleon to caravel

    IBT
    eMID vs vLongbow, loss -2hp
    vMID vs cWarrior, clean win, promotes
    Kua (Desert Hills) caravel => aqueduct

    Turn 186
    (Spices 11 turns)
    Army vs vLongbow, win -1hp
    Army vs vLongbow, clean win
    Army #2 vs vLongbow, win -1hp
    Give William the boot, he caves.

    IBT
    Ur trebuchet => trebuchet
    Civil disorder in Babil (Celtic front)
    Akshak (Desert Valley) knight => aqueduct
    Kisurra (wineyard) settler => settler

    Turn 187
    (Spices 10 turns)
    vKnight vs cWarrior, clean win
    vPikeman vs cWarrior, win -1hp, 25gp from camp
    vKnight vs vLongbow, clean win
    vKnight vs vLongbow, clean win

    IBT
    Agade musketman => musketman
    Erech (Desert Valley) musketman => aqueduct
    Zabalam worker => settler

    Turn 188
    (Spices 9 turns)
    Nothing important

    IBT
    Xerxes wants us out, we apologize.
    Ur trebuchet => musketman
    Sumer knight => knight
    Cultural expand at Kish
    Civil disorder at Kua
    Bactra (Persian) finishes Magellan's Voyage

    Turn 189
    (Spices 8 turns)
    vMID vs cWarrior, clean win
    Found Nagsu
    Nagsu => walls
    ---
    Siege of Entremont:
    Army vs vSpearman, win -3hp
    Army vs vSpearman, win -2hp
    vKnight vs vSpearman, loss -2hp
    vKnight vs rSpearman, retreats
    Army vs vSpearman, clean win
    Army vs rSpearman, -8hp! :lol:
    ---

    IBT
    Marsillis gives us the boot, we cave (for the last time. :p )
    Anshan (celtic front) settler => settler
    Kuara settler => library
    Kutha (in the jungle) settler => knight
    Found Susa (celtic front) => walls

    Turn 190
    (Spices 7 turns)
    (save & exit)

    (load game)
    Rival check:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts (Republic), 5 cities, war, strong to
    Hittites (Republic), 12 cities, peace, strong to, +Printing Press +Banking
    America (Republic), 14 cities, peace, strong to, +Printing Press
    Netherlands (Republic), 13 cities, peace, strong to, -Astronomy
    Persia (Republic), 13 cities, peace, strong to, +Printing Press +Banking
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Notes:
    - Keep researching Chemistry for trading. Seems like AI goes Democracy first
    - Kill Brennus asap and heal up afterwards

    IBT
    Lagash cathedral => knight
    Bad-tibira musketman => musketman
    Susa (The Rock) musketman => temple
    Sidon (Persia) completed Sistine Chapel

    Turn 191
    (Spices 6 turns)
    Make ROP with Hittites
    Make ROP with America
    Found Tutub => temple
    Rush settler in Babi (celtic front) for 76gp
    Rush aqueduct in Umma for 120 gp
    Change production in Kish to Aqueduct
    Change production in Akshak (Desert Valley) to marketplace
    Change production in Zabalam to harbor
    MM all citizen

    IBT
    Babil (Celtic front) settler => trebuchet
    Umma aqueduct => courthouse
    Kish aqueduct => marketplace
    Zabalam (in the jungle) university => barracks
    Dabarum walls => harbor
    Tutub (near the swamp) temple => marketplace

    Turn 192
    (Spices 5 turns)
    Nothing important

    IBT
    Ur musketman => knight
    Civil disorder in Apisala (elefant farm)
    Civil disorder in Akshak
    Hattusas (Hittite) has completed Leonardo's Workshop
    Persepolis (Persia) has completed JS Bach's Cathedral

    Turn 193
    (Spices 4 turns)
    Trade Astronomy +5gp for Printing Press with Netherlands

    IBT
    Sumer knight => knight
    Erech walls => trebuchet

    Turn 194
    (Spices 3 turns)
    ---
    Siege of Entremont
    Trebuchets 1/2
    eMID vs vSpearman, win -1hp
    eMID vs vSpearman, win -2hp
    vKnight vs vSpearman, retreats
    vKnight vs rSpearman, win -3hp
    eKnight vs vSpearman, clean win
    vKnight vs vSpearman, loss -1hp
    Army vs rSpearman, clean win, capture entremont and MoM +0gp +3slaves
    Abandon city
    ---

    IBT
    zzz

    195
    (Spices 2 turns)
    Found Kutallu => trebuchet
    Army vs vArcher, win -3hp
    Found Anshan => trebuchet
    Found Babil => harbor

    IBT
    Lagash knight => heroic epic
    Zabalam barracks => knight
    Isin harbor => trebuchet

    Turn 196
    (Spices 1 turn)
    Found Apisala => harbor
    Trade wines +horses +WM +1gpt +193gp to for Banking with Persia
    Change production in Ur, Sumer, Lagash and Zabalam (in the jungle) to bank

    IBT
    zzz

    Turn 197
    (Spices expire!)
    eArcher vs vLongbow, win -4hp
    ---
    Siege of Nemausus
    trebuchets 1/2
    Army vs rSpearman, clean win
    Stop attack to not expose trebuchets
    ---
    Siege of Eboracum
    eLongbow vs vSpearman, win -2hp
    eKnight vs rSpearman, win -2hp
    vKnight vs rSpearman, retreat
    vMID vs rSpearman, clean loss
    vMID vs rSpearman, win -3hp, capture Eboracum
    Abandon city
    ---

    IBT
    Erech aqueduct => library

    Turn 198
    ---
    Siege of Nemausus
    Army vs vSpearman, win -4hp, capture Nemausus +0gp +3slaves
    Abandon city
    ---

    IBT
    Kisurra walls => trebuchet
    Kua (Desert Hills) aqueduct => library
    Civil disorder in Apisala (elefant farm)

    Turn 199
    ---
    Siege of Lugudum
    vKnight vs vSpearman, win -1hp
    vKnight vs vSpearman, win -2hp
    ---

    IBT
    Agade musketman => trebuchet
    Akshak (Desert valley) marketplace => aqueduct
    Kuara library => aqueduct

    Turn 200
    Army vs vSpearman, win -4hp
    (save)

    IBT
    vKnight vs vLongbow, win -1hp, promotes

    Turn 201
    ---
    Siege of Lugdunum
    eMID vs rSpearman, clean win, capture Lugdunum +0gp +Sun Tzu's
    Keep it! :lol:
    ---
    Siege of Augustodurum
    Army vs vSpearman, clean win
    Army 2 vs rSpearman, win -2hp, capture Augustodurum +0gp
    Keep it!
    ---
    Celts are out! :D
    Trade Navigation for WM and Music Theory with Netherlands
    Starve Celts in Lugdunum and Augustodurum
    MM citizen
    Adjust sliders, Chemistry in 4 turns +7gpt
    Rival check:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Celts are out
    Hittites (Republic), 12 cities, peace, strong to
    America (Republic), 14 cities, peace, strong to
    Netherlands (Republic), 14 cities, peace, strong to
    Persia (Anarchy), 12 cities, peace, strong to, +Democracy
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    (save & quit Note: Ready to press Enter)
    It took me all these turns to get rid of the Celts. I'm super inexperienced with war. :blush: Anyways, the task is done. Brennus is gone and every single city but one (it got Sun Tzu's) is razed to the ground (conquer, keep, abandon :mischief:).

    The other continent won't be a problem, they are all a bunch of peace loving people. The problem might be their cities on my continent, but I think I just leave some gatekeepers behind.

    Not sure whom to go for:
    1. I kinda respect the Hittites. But their territory is spread out and would be hard to pick apart anyways.
    2. The Americans seem the hardest. They got a huge chunk of land and never once used up units. Could be fun. :D
    3. The Dutch look really week and lacked behind all the time.
    4. To me the Persians are a joke. Xerxes plays the big scientist, leading ever since I started waking Brennus. He grabbed 3-4 cities on my continent, but apart from that I don't hold him for a tough nut (though Immortals are...).

    My choice would be the Hittites at the moment (ignore what I wrote above). They got only one city on my continent and I can lance right into their main land and start waking Mursilis cities to pieces. Maybe I get the Dutch or Americans in for the war, but at the moment I'm short on cash (thank you war weariness :cry:) and only even in tech.

    Mh! I think about catching up in tech first and ship my stuff over. Will take 5-10 turns and I could be ready to roll.

    Any c&c welcome!
     

    Attached Files:

  19. Spoonwood

    Spoonwood Grand Philosopher

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2008
    Messages:
    4,842
    Location:
    Ohio
    You can acquire a luxury from the Hittites via gpt and lower the luxury slider a tick if you like. You do have marketplaces after all. I don't see why you've decided to build both banks and universities. If you want to do research universities can make sense, but if you don't, then banks can make sense. I don't see why you've mined out in extremely corrupt areas. Generally speaking (an exception does exist, but it's not worth mentioning), ares with extremely high corruption work out better as irrigated than mined, since food doesn't corrupt, while shields do. I also don't see a need for a harbor in a game like in a very, very corrupt area.

    Who do you want to attack? You're strong to everyone else on the planet.
     
  20. ionize

    ionize Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2011
    Messages:
    60
    Location:
    Cork, Ireland
    Good points (especially nothing I ever considered). So you mean I should specialize my core cities to either cash or beakers (banks vs universities)? Makes sense! I always considered having both is good. Stupid me. :eek:

    Well irrigating all the corrupt cities should be no problemo, I got an army of workers at my disposal. Which leaves the question what to construct in those corrupt nests? granaries I got through The Pyramids, which leaves aqueducts.

    I build harbors for the extra food. What else should I build in cities with 1spt. I just let them get a harbor and be done with it for 20-40 turns. Make a suggestion! To be honest I was always weak with those far-away cities. I see them as being there to grab land, increase my overall land/population and be the stage for future wars (in case they are on a different continent/border). :mischief:

    Your suggestion with the lux leads me to this solution for future wars:
    - acquire spices from Hittites for gpt
    - war with America (I want to eliminate my strongest rival first).
    - also I will get my banks and keep those universities. I need to emphasize cash for a bit, but will get back on the research lane soon. The AI is still slow and I can catch up easily. The banks will come in handy when I want to upgrade my units.

    Any more comments and criticism?
     

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