Player stats, sales, and reception speculation thread

[Kwami]

EU5 has no withheld content no nations hidden behind a paywall, no cut leaders , "civ" vii withheld content and flogged it as a DLC and released it the very same day ..

And EU5 has map models that are withheld and released the very same day. It also has scripts, events, options, graphics, and whatever else for multiple countries that were cut and promised for the following year. How is it any different?

There's no point in continuing this discussion with you because you aren't being honest. It's off topic, anyway. So, I won't respond again.

 

[Xur]

How so? I recall playing Rhye's and Fall on a TSL map back in the day - it was magnificent. Maybe the criticism is more about the switches at the fixed aged boundaries than the switches in general? Is everyone upset about Civ 7 really saying they would be upset if the distant land cities of England could split off and become the USA? Or is the criticism rather that you have to split off and that it has to happen at an age boundary?

That's my point. I always played TSL maps in civ and it was great. That does not work with the current civ7 system. My problem with the entire civ franchise is that it used to innovate and expand on already established core features - now they are removing them and starting from zero. Civ4 was peak, civ5 was a sidegrade(I enjoyed it) and then we got two downgrades in a row with civ6 and civ7. I am aware that civ6 was popular, but it's just not for me because I see that trajectory in design philosophy. Civilization was the king of strategy and I loved it. Now they are copying mediocre (at best) games like Humankind.

If Firaxis was just a little bit aware of their playerbase, they would have looked at workshop and acknowledged that they needed to add in a world map with TSL. TSL is one of the most used mods for both civ5 and civ6. That would have naturally guided their design away from leader/civ swapping. Instead they designed a system that goes against how many people choose to play the game.

I would love it if civ7 had TSL and overseas cities could split off, but that's not at all what they are doing in civ7. I dont even mind ages as much. I think ages are silly and poorly made, but it's not as big of a "no deal" thing as civ/leader swapping is (for me).

They are behaving like Maxis did with SimCity. Ignore the fanbase, make everything smaller and faster so it looks better on streams/MP. Their solution to workers were builders which were a micromanagement nightmare. Their solution to builders was to just delete them. My point is that many things like workers were never a problem - it's just that they refuse to implement tools that can help the player manage that worker. There are many of these stupid changes/removals that started in civ6.

 

[Kev1916]

And EU5 has map models that are withheld and released the very same day. It also has scripts, events, options, graphics, and whatever else for multiple countries that were cut and promised for the following year. How is it any different?

EU5 is being released tomorrow, check it out yourself. It is not nice to accuse people of being dishonest.
“you aren't being honest.”
Check your facts there are no countries being with withheld to be included in future DLC’s , stop making things up please .

 

[Ellye]

EU5 is being released tomorrow, check it out yourself. It is not nice to accuse people of being dishonest.
“you aren't being honest.”
Check your facts there are no countries being with withheld to be included in future DLC’s , stop making things up please .

You know exactly what he meant and you're just being obnoxious about it. Either that or you never played another PDS game before.

Yes, no country is "withhold" from the base game. Sure, you can select any country in the world.

And 90% of those countries will only have generic events and zero uniqueness to them at all. The only difference between playing Epirus or Mali is your starting situation. Until they release the Epirus Flavor Pack for U$39.99 and the Mali Flavor Pack for U$39.99.

I like PDS games, I have thousands of hours on them, but it's disingenuous to talk as if they hey haven't become a silly DLC playground.

 

[Leucarum]

You know exactly what he meant and you're just being obnoxious about it. Either that or you never played another PDS game before.

Yes, no country is "withhold" from the base game. Sure, you can select any country in the world.

And 90% of those countries will only have generic events and zero uniqueness to them at all. The only difference between playing Epirus or Mali is your starting situation. Until they release the Epirus Flavor Pack for U$39.99 and the Mali Flavor Pack for U$39.99.

Honestly, they seem to have added a lot of unique flavour this time around

I like PDS games, I have thousands of hours on them, but it's disingenuous to talk as if they hey haven't become a silly DLC playground.

Sure. And Firaxis look like they want to be more like them... PDX definitely put out too many DLC for me to stay up to date on all of them for all their hames... But if EU5 is as good as it looks it could swing me.

 

[Xur]

As long as the game is good, I don't mind paying 500€ over the years. It's typically 10 years for a PDX game, so it's not as bad as people try make it. It sounds like a lot, but if it a good game, then I can get several thousands hours of entertainment out of it.

EU4 was DLC over 12 years totalling 375€. Civ7 is not even a year old and has DLC for 97€ and that's even at a discount. I don't know what the normal price would be. I think it's fair to say that Firaxis is worse on the DLC part, unless you are gagging for leaders and civs.

 

[itix]

Apparently Civ VII is 35% off on Steam now, so it is 45 USD or 45 EUR. Nicely timed since the new update and part of the free DLC is released tomorrow, simultaneously with the EUV release. It is a smart move because some players might hold off from buying EUV, especially if its ratings are not good.

 

[Kev1916]

You know exactly what he meant and you're just being obnoxious about it. Either that or you never played another PDS game before.

Yes, no country is "withhold" from the base game. Sure, you can select any country in the world.

And 90% of those countries will only have generic events and zero uniqueness to them at all. The only difference between playing Epirus or Mali is your starting situation. Until they release the Epirus Flavor Pack for U$39.99 and the Mali Flavor Pack for U$39.99.

I like PDS games, I have thousands of hours on them, but it's disingenuous to talk as if they hey haven't become a silly DLC playground.

Eh , the post was about withheld content.
Really ! the review score for “civ” 7 first of what 18 micro transactions is 88% negative as quoted .
Again maybe look at some of those 300+ reviews are they also obnoxious.
3 DLC’s for a fraction of the price and spread over a year , puts 2K to shame

 

[itix]

It is a matter of taste whether one prefers 2K way of doing DLCs or the Paradox way of doing DLCs. Either way, the goal is to make money.

But there is something Firaxis could learn from Paradox and it is.... mod support. EUV is not yet released but it already has mods from modders. They gave early access to a few prominent modders and Steam workshop is already up. This is nice, even though I generally avoid using any mods and resort to vanilla experience.

And vice versa, Paradox tends to lock achievements behind ironman mode without mods. It is just silly.

 

[Kev1916]

It is a matter of taste whether one prefers 2K way of doing DLCs or the Paradox way of doing DLCs. Either way, the goal is to make money.

Currently 2K has what 16+ packs for $100 within 6 months of release.

EU5 3 dlc’s released over 14 months $21

 

[Marla_Singer]

That's my point. I always played TSL maps in civ and it was great. That does not work with the current civ7 system. My problem with the entire civ franchise is that it used to innovate and expand on already established core features - now they are removing them and starting from zero. Civ4 was peak, civ5 was a sidegrade(I enjoyed it) and then we got two downgrades in a row with civ6 and civ7.

I see what you mean. I would say that in Civ 1-4, each tile contained a lot of stacked information: entire cities with all their buildings and mechanics, full armies, and multiple layers of interaction. From Civ 5 onward, the series began spreading those elements across the map: 1UPT, districts, sprawling cities, etc.. The result is that more elements are directly represented and interactive from the map, but the density of information held in each tile individually is reduced. And as maps don’t have more tiles, this results in less information overall despite things looking busier at map level.

Even if earlier iterations were more basic, they still aimed to represent a coherent and believable world on a global scale: remember that in Civ 1, the option to play “EARTH” was written in capitals in the main menu. But this shift in scale (or density) gradually made that goal harder to achieve. The series moved from simulating a strategic world to depicting a tactical board of operations. This is why historical scenarios and simulationist mods such as Rhye’s of Civilization or Realism Invictus became less feasible over time: the newer design simply can’t support the required density anymore. That's what Civ 5 critics meant when they complained about archers shooting arrows across the English Channel. The scale is no longer strategic.

As Civilization moved away from Grand-Strategy simulation, Paradox made it their hallmark, building ever more systemic, dynamic and believable worlds. They aren’t immune to criticism either though. They tend to consider that “more is always better” and not always for good reasons. I think they should make more effort to rationalize their concepts. Yet it feels like Firaxis has gradually abandoned Historical simulationist aspiration in Civ, leaving that whole space to Paradox.

 

[itix]

Civilization moved away from Grand-Strategy simulation

This made me realize that my way and Firaxis' way are departing. Have been for a long time already, but I was blind. They are never going to repack cities. Rather the opposite, and hypothetical Civ8 is going to have even more city sprawl.

 

[WillK96]

This made me realize that my way and Firaxis' way are departing. Have been for a long time already, but I was blind. They are never going to repack cities. Rather the opposite, and hypothetical Civ8 is going to have even more city sprawl.

I'm not so sure, I think Civ VI was relatively optimal. Most of the coverage around entirely unpacked cities seems fairly negative.

 

[Crashdummy]

Yeah, i didnt like the decision to unpack Cities, but it wasnt enough of a change that i dislikes to not like the game as a whole

 

[itix]

I'm not so sure, I think Civ VI was relatively optimal. Most of the coverage around entirely unpacked cities seems fairly negative.

I actually like Civ VI. I recently finished abandoned a game where I played it to the max. For me, it is more like an empire builder than (grand) strategy, which is fun too. I am going to play a new game in the future for sure.

Btw I saw the AI use bombers for the first time. It appears that there is a threshold at which it is triggered, like the AI must have a major victory. It has no concept of grinding the enemy down by relentless bombing.

 

[stealth_nsk]

Unpacking cities itself were great for the visibility and overall strategic game. I feel it wasn't fully flashed out yet. I'd say civilization need a little more time to play with resources, sprawl rules (free form in Civ6, connected districts in Civ7, anything else?), maybe more space between settlements...

I also think Civ7 didn't implement its full potential yet. I.e. I hope at some point tile switching will be added changing the situation with settlements a lot.

 

[Leucarum]

Unpacking cities itself were great for the visibility and overall strategic game. I feel it wasn't fully flashed out yet.

It has the potential to be. But at the moment everything blends together for me. We need building types at least to be way more distinct, or some sort of clearer map overlays.

 

[kaspergm]

Regular game and Settlers edition is currently 35 % off on Steam. I'm tempted albeit a bit divided. I don't have any particular desire to play Civ 7 right now, but I will probably wanna play it at some point, and if I should get a significant additional discount, that would mean waiting for a 50 % sale, and I don't think that's likely to happen this side of New Year? Also, buying now would give me the free download, if I'm not mistaken, which as I understand it, will not be free after a certain date in the new year - am I getting those things right?

 

[Leucarum]

Regular game and Settlers edition is currently 35 % off on Steam. I'm tempted albeit a bit divided. I don't have any particular desire to play Civ 7 right now, but I will probably wanna play it at some point, and if I should get a significant additional discount, that would mean waiting for a 50 % sale, and I don't think that's likely to happen this side of New Year? Also, buying now would give me the free download, if I'm not mistaken, which as I understand it, will not be free after a certain date in the new year - am I getting those things right?

At that price it's probably worth it even if you just play Antiquity only...

 

[stealth_nsk]

Regular game and Settlers edition is currently 35 % off on Steam. I'm tempted albeit a bit divided. I don't have any particular desire to play Civ 7 right now, but I will probably wanna play it at some point, and if I should get a significant additional discount, that would mean waiting for a 50 % sale, and I don't think that's likely to happen this side of New Year? Also, buying now would give me the free download, if I'm not mistaken, which as I understand it, will not be free after a certain date in the new year - am I getting those things right?

Yes, you're right. Tides of Power is free to claim until Jan, 5.