Player stats, sales, and reception speculation thread

[stealth_nsk]

That's an interesting contrast. 7 apparantley beating preorder records but over the first month having half as many average players as 6 did during its first month... A lot more players bought it but don't play I guess.

If you want to be optimistic, 7 probably has a bigger potential audience who already owns it that they could win back with updates and it will be saved... If you want to be pessimistic 7 turned off far more players than 6 did and it is doomed...

There's no contrast. If you look at any marketing theory, whether it's liquid premium theory, "the chasm" or simple price segmentation, you'll see the same picture - people who pay full premium price are small minority of all customers. People who preorder the game at full price (especially founder's edition, which was about 30-50% of presales) are premium customers. People who by during sales for 10-20% are "long tail".

It's just it, Civ5 and Civ6 both have much more owners yet and that's totally normal. Even without problems with reviews, Civ7 would require at least a couple of years to catch up Civ5 or Civ6 in the number of owners.

P.S. I'm putting aside the bad correlation between number of simultaneous players and number of owners (or number of active players) as this was discussed before multiple times.

 

[Leucarum]

P.S. I'm putting aside the bad correlation between number of simultaneous players and number of owners (or number of active players) as this was discussed before multiple times.

Somehow I missed that... Huh... It was what I was thinking about anyway.

 

[aieeegrunt]

That's an interesting contrast. 7 apparantley beating preorder records but over the first month having half as many average players as 6 did during its first month... A lot more players bought it but don't play I guess.

If you want to be optimistic, 7 probably has a bigger potential audience who already owns it that they could win back with updates and it will be saved... If you want to be pessimistic 7 turned off far more players than 6 did and it is doomed...

Preorders are an indication of how succesfull the franchise was doing *before*.

People preordered 7 because they enjoyed previous civ titles.

Reviews and player numbers tell you who well the game itself is doing.

 

[stealth_nsk]

Preorders are an indication of how succesfull the franchise was doing *before*.

People preordered 7 because they enjoyed previous civ titles.

Reviews and player numbers tell you who well the game itself is doing.

It's partly true, but there was a lot of information about the game during preorder. For example, age transition and civ switching was announced and explained in details before preorder even started.

So, I'd say people preorder if they think they like the game based on both previous games and preliminary information about this particular game.

P.S. As an additional confirmation for this, many games have large presales without having any previous games.

 

[youngsteve]

Preorders are an indication of how succesfull the franchise was doing *before*.

People preordered 7 because they enjoyed previous civ titles.

Reviews and player numbers tell you who well the game itself is doing.

The problem is, thanks to this disaster, if they ever release another civilization title the pre-orders will be low as fans of the franchise would no longer trust the game would be good.

 

[Krikkit1]

The problem is, thanks to this disaster, if they ever release another civilization title the pre-orders will be low as fans of the franchise would no longer trust the game would be good.

That depends on how good 7 ends up being, not how good it is now (or at launch)

 

[itix]

IMO preorders saved the game because there is a large customer base potentially buying expansions.

(I dont believe on that but...)

 

[fantsu]

As an additional confirmation for this, many games have large presales without having any previous games.

Not sure what games you are referring here, but I think VII had great presales because there has been such a success story behing the IP and because there was demand for a new 4X game, options getting thinner and thinner on that front as time goes on it seems.

Some games might benefit from similar demand if the genre doesnt have wide enough of a presence available.

Not to doubt too much, but I cannot say if its really a confirmation.

 

[stealth_nsk]

Not sure what games you are referring here

A lot of them. The simplest is to look at the list of successful Kickstarter funding: https://www.kickstarter.com/discover/advanced?category_id=35&sort=most_funded

There are some sequels like Shenmue 3 or Wasteland 2, but the majority of games there are original.

 

[Kmart_Elvis]

It's partly true, but there was a lot of information about the game during preorder. For example, age transition and civ switching was announced and explained in details before preorder even started.

So, I'd say people preorder if they think they like the game based on both previous games and preliminary information about this particular game.

P.S. As an additional confirmation for this, many games have large presales without having any previous games.

I can speak only for myself, but I'm sure others can relate: when they first announced ages and switching to a new civ for each one, I was very skeptical. Also with the unpaired leaders. Benjamin Franklin leading Maya into Ming into Prussia? What?

Other parts of the game looked good...I thought the graphics were beautiful. So, I pre-ordered Founder's Edition, even with my skepticism. I had over 1000 hours in Civ 6. I've been playing since Civ 2 in the mid 90s on a Packard Bell computer. I've loved every iteration of the series. Surely FXS won't let me down! Unfortunately I was. My skepticism was well founded. It's my least favorite game of the series.

I should also mention i went through the exact same scenario with Starfield a couple years ago. Pre-ordered it because I'm a huge BGS fan with thousands of hours in Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, and the Fallouts. Surely BGS won't let me down!

If Civ 7 released as is, but with a different title and different studio, I would not have pre-ordered it. I got it because it was a Civ game by FXS.

 

[stealth_nsk]

I can speak only for myself, but I'm sure others can relate: when they first announced ages and switching to a new civ for each one, I was very skeptical. Also with the unpaired leaders. Benjamin Franklin leading Maya into Ming into Prussia? What?

Other parts of the game looked good...I thought the graphics were beautiful. So, I pre-ordered Founder's Edition, even with my skepticism. I had over 1000 hours in Civ 6. I've been playing since Civ 2 in the mid 90s on a Packard Bell computer. I've loved every iteration of the series. Surely FXS won't let me down! Unfortunately I was. My skepticism was well founded. It's my least favorite game of the series.

I should also mention i went through the exact same scenario with Starfield a couple years ago. Pre-ordered it because I'm a huge BGS fan with thousands of hours in Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, and the Fallouts. Surely BGS won't let me down!

If Civ 7 released as is, but with a different title and different studio, I would not have pre-ordered it. I got it because it was a Civ game by FXS.

That's exactly what I'm talking about, it's a spectrum. You have some trust in the company and/or franchise, you have some positive and negative impression, you have budgeting concerns and many more factors affecting your decision.

So you didn't took into account your skepticism enough and the game turned out disappointment for you, that happens. There are also a lot of people who didn't preorder due to their skepticism and many others who preordered and are happy.

 

[itix]

A lot of them. The simplest is to look at the list of successful Kickstarter funding: https://www.kickstarter.com/discover/advanced?category_id=35&sort=most_funded

There are some sequels like Shenmue 3 or Wasteland 2, but the majority of games there are original.

Kickstarter games are basically about pre-funding a venture. You invest $10 and you may get a game worth $30, saving you $20. Or, if it fails or the game is garbage, you lose $10. It is not really the same.

 

[fantsu]

A lot of them. The simplest is to look at the list of successful Kickstarter funding: https://www.kickstarter.com/discover/advanced?category_id=35&sort=most_funded

There are some sequels like Shenmue 3 or Wasteland 2, but the majority of games there are original.

A lot of demand for Shen Mue, a lot of demand for Wasteland 2 since failure of Fallout, its successor.
A lot of games on the list as similar. Again, niche games. Bloodstained was Symphony of the Night 2, or so they thought. Fan fiction games like Mighty Number 9, because Megaman. Spin-offs or nostalgia for missing genre.
Civ VII did it different, I think.

 

[aieeegrunt]

It's partly true, but there was a lot of information about the game during preorder. For example, age transition and civ switching was announced and explained in details before preorder even started.

So, I'd say people preorder if they think they like the game based on both previous games and preliminary information about this particular game.

P.S. As an additional confirmation for this, many games have large presales without having any previous games.

Trying to pretend that the preorders for the 7th installment of the most popular game series in a very niche genre isn’t because of, well everything I just said is absurd.

And you are still left with the cold hard fact that half of the people who played this hated it.

The problem is, thanks to this disaster, if they ever release another civilization title the pre-orders will be low as fans of the franchise would no longer trust the game would be good.

They got the benefit of the doubt because 1 UPT, hexagons and districts were also pretty controversial, but it was still a civ game that a lot of people enjoyed.

I would say that ship sailed, circumnavigated the globe, and returned laden with exotic spice at this point.

Civ8 is gonna have to earn that back.

 

[Civinator]

Regarding content creators... Today evening Writing Bull (German Streamer/Youtuber with a dedicated Civ focus) returned to playing Civ6 (after several months of Civ7 content since release and a recent civ pause of two months)...and while I could imagine that he gives Civ7 another chance at some point in the future, his announcement message is IMO telling and somewhat hitting a nail

I am really astonished about the merciless reckoning with the current Civ 7 by the "German apostle of Civ 7". Those civers who understand the German language, can listen to it here in the first 2 1/2 minutes:

 

[reyaik]

Sounds like he only will come back to streaming CIV7 once the modern age DLC comes out. That seems like it will be at best a late 2026 event, if ever. It probably makes commercial sense for his channel, yet at the same time, even in this announcement, he's not really coming clean with what the bigger issues are. Needless to say I am not going to watch CIV6 content. There's just plenty of it out there already.

 

[Bug Repellent]

I'm not surprised streamers are ditching Civ7. Every time I tried one of Ursa Ryan's Civ7 streams, I gave up once city sprawl takes over.

If you zoom in, the game does looks gorgeous. But zoom out to cover a few large cities - the normal in-game view - and it's just unintelligible.

This is an example from these forums. Unless they fix this somehow, I'll never buy Civ7. I might even get used to civ-switching, but never to this awful city sprawl. And I have an high refresh rate 32" 4K gaming monitor. I cannot imagine this game on a laptop.

 

[Krikkit1]

I'm not surprised streamers are ditching Civ7. Every time I tried one of Ursa Ryan's Civ7 streams, I gave up once city sprawl takes over.

If you zoom in, the game does looks gorgeous. But zoom out to cover a few large cities - the normal in-game view - and it's just unintelligible.

This is an example from these forums. Unless they fix this somehow, I'll never buy Civ7. I might even get used to civ-switching, but never to this awful city sprawl. And I have an high refresh rate 32" 4K gaming monitor. I cannot imagine this game on a laptop.


View attachment 743783

Well the update might actually reduce city sprawl (less buildings) however, they also should have the buildings more clearly reflect their type, ie a strong roof/background of blue-science, yellow-gold, purple-culture, orange-happy, red-prod/military, and green-food..possibly gray-warehouse)

 

[tman2000]

That's an interesting contrast. 7 apparantley beating preorder records but over the first month having half as many average players as 6 did during its first month... A lot more players bought it but don't play I guess.

If you want to be optimistic, 7 probably has a bigger potential audience who already owns it that they could win back with updates and it will be saved... If you want to be pessimistic 7 turned off far more players than 6 did and it is doomed...

My one plea to them is to just give up, modify a couple features like diplomacy, and let the game unbalance.

Then they can add DLC that is bonkers, stupidly broken, cool civs. That would be the only way to generate excitement and make money off of the established owner base. The DLC civs need to have unique features inside the engine, not just little permutations on adjacency type.

• Medes: you can only have one settlement, except commanders can "post up" in allied city-states and they function like cities you own, until your commander leaves.
• Edo Japan: whenever towns produce gold, they now produce additional food instead. Food is converted to gold by a single building in one city. Gold is converted into culture by another building in another city. Settlements on the route between these towns gain a happiness boost. Bushi can sacrifice population for gold in towns if the town is unhappy.
• Austria-Hungary (Modern): On starting the Modern Age (or after initial placement), you gain double the number of settlements to place which incur no cost to settlement limit. However, war weariness will slowly convert these into neutral city-states. The number of special settlements you possess also greatly boost culture and influence, but the number of former special settlement city-states incur an influence penalty.

This kind of thing would bring people in, but the core design philosophy at Firaxis right now is the polar opposite of this.

 

[tman2000]

I'm not surprised streamers are ditching Civ7. Every time I tried one of Ursa Ryan's Civ7 streams, I gave up once city sprawl takes over.

It's incomprehensible, isn't it?

For all that traded off to get the "diorama" look, there's no camera mode to take screenshots at custom angles. Bonkers.