Playing as Japan on earth 18 Prince

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So I'm starting my 3rd game, as japan, on earth 18 prince.

THE ISLAND IS SOMETHING SMALL. Good side is that I've got 2 good cities there that will be impossible to harass for millenias to come. Also I've manage to build 2 other cities on the other shore, 1 on the hill with marble, and one more to the south with access to stone and ivory. I might pull a 3rd city on the last available space there before the others. I've built the oracle to get metal casting, now I'll be building the colossus since I have so many water tiles to work.

Any advice other than that ? How should I play that game now. Do I attack my nearest neighbor, china, and try to eat his cities as mine ? Or would he be better as an ally ?

edit : btw I have copper and one good prod city with a barrack, I'm already building axemen for all my cities, should I rush someone asap, and whom ?
 
I've scouted the land, china has one access to copper, which is a very collared city between two of mine. I just have to bring a few axemen there, DoW, next turn he has no copper and can only build archers while I have a stack of axemen with 2 promos. I think I'm going for it, otherwise I can't enlarge anymore.
 
You have to hit China early, otherwise it becomes a superpower on the map. China's got a lot of good land for you to take if you're quick about it, otherwise you're stuck with an archipelago empire that has no hammer production outside of Australia and Japan.

I'd DOW before finishing up the axemen if China's either mined or is mining the copper, and pillage it before he can build up his own force of axemen
 
Just settle 1-3 cities on the mainland and hit china before CKN's can screw you. You can shuttle troops across the little bit of ocean easily with a galley. However, the micro is pretty annoying.
 
Yeah I never did so much micro. Thing is, I'm attacking them after this post. I have 2 cities on hills with walls and archers, axemen and swordsman for defense, and a stack of 12 units + 1 ssettler. I'm burning niquang shanghai and beijing, and building a city 1 tile away from beijing original location (so that it has access to ocean). I walked around their cities they have made about 2 axemen yet so I'm still fine, and the time I waited I used it to build numerous wonders that'll help me in the long run like zeus and great library and colussus and oracle.
 
The hard part is not taking China,but holding China since once you control it all the Mongolians appear or the Khmers show up.Try to take out China or the Mongols,but don't mess with Khmer....its hard to explain,but its easier to take India by the 1400's then it is to control all of Indonesia by the 1500s(uprising's everywhere).

Long run short is to build only useful cities and not wasteful ones,also Russia(in my game) expended very slowly and only got to the middle of Asia by the 1600's...

good luck to you
 
Well I got what I wanted with my axe rush. Destroyed half of their cities, relocated beijing to my liking, and removed them acces from iron horse and copper. After I declared peace because WW was already there in my cities, and anyway I didn't have enough troops left and need to protect my new cities. So many units had brought my science bar down to 30-40. So I ''wealthed'' a bit and now its 750 AD and I'm building samurias to go finish the job on the chinese. All my cities are very well located with diverse useful resources and all are on hills except 1, so I get good defense bonuses in almost all of them.

Should I vassal them or what ? If I vassal someone too weak will it make my power ratio down ? If so, how do you vassalize someone that is not a complete wimp. The only time I could vassal someone is because he had 1 city left.
 
Kill China, move the capital to the mainland, kill the Mongols, India, Persia, Arabia and advance into Europe. Win :)
 
Kill China, move the capital to the mainland, kill the Mongols, India, Persia, Arabia and advance into Europe. Win :)

I strongly suggest this :p

You can search for Neal's game with Japan on Earth 18 in S&T forum. He did exactly that :D
 
Why move the capital to mainland ? My capital was built near the mainland and has lots of foods from resources, I'tll grow at least to 20 and it alreeady makes a lot of science. I usually shoot for my capital as a science city, water wrks good for that.
 
Why move the capital to mainland ? My capital was built near the mainland and has lots of foods from resources, I'tll grow at least to 20 and it alreeady makes a lot of science. I usually shoot for my capital as a science city, water wrks good for that.

If you are playing BtS then you will suffer from 'colonial expenses'. As you will have only 2 or 3 cities on the Japanese Island and 40+ cities on the mainland the costs will be astronomical. By moving the capital you will incur colonial expenses for the few cities in Japan which will be acceptable.

I strongly suggest this :p

You can search for Neal's game with Japan on Earth 18 in S&T forum. He did exactly that :D

I didn't realise Neal had done Japan, I'll have to have a dig and see if I can find it.
 
In a similar vien, anyone have advice on Inca Prince level on Earth 18? I beeline sailing, start colonizing amazon, beeline alphabet and optics but when I meet european/asian civs they are technologically way ahead of me, plus they are wonderspamming like mad (Thats for me to do dammit ;)

It seems like the largest civs just sit around and sing kumbaya and tech trade, and there is nothing I can do about it. I also lost a game before I met them from AP cheese.
 
In a similar vien, anyone have advice on Inca Prince level on Earth 18? I beeline sailing, start colonizing amazon, beeline alphabet and optics but when I meet european/asian civs they are technologically way ahead of me, plus they are wonderspamming like mad (Thats for me to do dammit ;)

It seems like the largest civs just sit around and sing kumbaya and tech trade, and there is nothing I can do about it. I also lost a game before I met them from AP cheese.

Solution: First Old World Civ you have to contact is Mansa Munsa the tech whore. He techs like crazy and sells to almost anybody.
 
Solution: First Old World Civ you have to contact is Mansa Munsa the tech whore. He techs like crazy and sells to almost anybody.

When I met him he wasn't... plus he hates me now cause I war dec'd him to get relationship bonuses from Asoka (who led tech) and a few others. I did manage to leverage optics for quite a bit, but still, the wonderspam has them popping GS's like mad, and spreading tech'd like a prostitute spreads herpes.
 
In a similar vien, anyone have advice on Inca Prince level on Earth 18? I beeline sailing, start colonizing amazon, beeline alphabet and optics but when I meet european/asian civs they are technologically way ahead of me, plus they are wonderspamming like mad (Thats for me to do dammit ;)

It seems like the largest civs just sit around and sing kumbaya and tech trade, and there is nothing I can do about it. I also lost a game before I met them from AP cheese.

Its a tough start, probably the most difficult to play on the Earth18 map. You have the correct idea to go with sailing but then you should city spam the Amazon area and cottage the whole lot. If you want any further ideas then I can only recommend Neal's attempt here. He played at Monarch and won the space race although he could probably have won any other condition he wished.
 
When I met him he wasn't... plus he hates me now cause I war dec'd him to get relationship bonuses from Asoka (who led tech) and a few others. I did manage to leverage optics for quite a bit, but still, the wonderspam has them popping GS's like mad, and spreading tech'd like a prostitute spreads herpes.

Really? Whenever I first met him he was almost always willing to trade techs.... :dunno:
 
I think things are going well. So far i didn't see a difference between noble and prince... doesn't seem harder. Here's my game status right now :

It's 1155 ad. I'm tech leader, score leader, power leader, and Isabella and Frederick are now my vassals even tough I didn't even see one of their cities, nor talked to them during the game. They just popped on my screen and asked to be vassals so I said yeah. As wonders I have built : sistine chapel, national epic, great library, university of sankore, erioc epic, hanging gardens, colossus, oracle, statue of zeus, moai statues. Captured : Notre Dame (it doesn't seem to be producing culture, is this because I captured it ?) On the way : Taj Mahal

It's one turn after I've been first to discover Liberalism. Used it to get Nationalism, right now I'm building the Taj Mahal. While the taj is being built I'm beelining for economics to A) Build banks and get my science slider up and b) settle the second great merchant in my future westpoint ironworks city, which has lots of hills. My tech is at 60% but I'm still doing 300 beakers. When the taj mahal i built I'll build banks in my big commerce cities and bring science back to 80 or more if possible, all the while researching astronomy under the taj golden age to speed it up since it need lots of beakers. Right now my science is at 60 % because I have a l,ot of sleeping samurais and captapults and various other units. I'll say what I plan on doing with those after the next question, which is ;

My capital is still on the original island. I was thinking of moving it either to the coastal city kyoto, or the mountaineous one Pai Mei Redoubt. That's one of my debates. The one I move cap to will have westpoint and ironworks. Now, if I put them in Pai Mei the mountaineous city, with bureaucracy and those two NW I'll be pumping land and air units with lots of xp like crazy. On the other side, if I put it in Kyoto which has access to sea, I will also be able to build high xp ships aswell. But kyoto doesn't have a lot of hammer squares, so that's why I'm debating. Unless I switch to build some cottages which will be towns later, or wait until workshops give big production. It seems that logic (and greed) tells me to build those 3 things in the mountaineous Pai Mei Redoubt since earth map has more inland than seashore cities anyways, so naval isn't as crucial, and I'll have more production in it than Kyoto.

But I have a gut feeling that later kyoto might be able to have just as much prod as Pai Mei with later civics, towns, workshops and lumbermills with the few forests I kept. Which would put them on equal footing except kyoto will most likely have larger population and ability to build ships. What do you think I should do ? Here's a screenshot of those 2 cities to give a better idea :
paimeikyoto.jpg


Next, about my samurais. Rifling is still very far now from everybody except me, but since no one is short of them I rather research things that strenghten my econ and science to support my soon-to-be larger empire, and use my samurais as military. To put in context, here's what my empire looks like :

japan.jpg


Now is the time to enlarge it. I've secured tech lead, power, vassalized people and managed to build a lot of useful wonders, while my original city is spamming great scientists (I only build wonders that emphasize great scientists there) that are building science academy everywhere. North of me looks to be uninteresting cold land, except one mongol city that I might capture, although itdoesn't have special resources. I'm not decided yet if its worth the extra maintenance. Maybe I should just burn everything north. To the west is a desert, not appealing. I'm thinking of moving southwest, first just beside Pai Mei Redoubt to capture or burn chinese cities there, then try to go south and colonize australia ? Haven't discovered australia yet, but I think asoka has it, and he's friendly towards me with +15 -3. He's 6th in score, while cyrus is 2nd (I'm 1st). While his cities are not as inviting to capture, I think I'd benefit more to fight him since he's the second strongest. It would bring him down while bring me still further up. He hasn't been hostile to me at all, but hey, he's 2nd, that's a sin that deserves to be punished. He does have 3 vassals though, but I have 2.

persia.jpg


As you can see in the screen shot, the black spot between him and me is filled with I suppose Indian cities. If I go make a smal brust in persia, capture tarsus, burn persepolis and susa and built a new city on the gold hill near susa to get the hill bonus defense instead of susa average location, then call it quits, make peace and put lots of longbowmen and samurais in those 2 cities in case of surprise attack, I think that would cripple persia, give me 2 more cities (possibly 3 or 4 depending on how many chinese cities there are in the black spot), then I can concentrate on reaching rifling, and then I'll probably go attack the greek north and west of persia since tehy've alway been hostile to me while not being very strong. Maybe he'll be my vassal if I do so.

Have I made a good analysis and plans for my game ? I'm not sure about the maintenance costs of such an emterprise, it's only my 3rd civ4 game.
 
I would first kill both the Mongols and specially the Chinese ( the fact that they are alive is producing unhappiness in your cities that were built in lands once chinese: "We yearn to join our Motherland" ). Then you can draft rifles or get cannons and smash India and persia. After that the game is pretty much won.
 
I though of that too. It sure would make the current war a few turns faster, but I'd also like to cripple cyrus a great deal before beelining for rifleman and cannons, so he doesn't have them when I do. I don't have unhappiness from captured cities, I raze them all and built new ones with the settlers I always carry with my stacks so I don't have a real problem with China being alive. They have 4 cities left and I'll take the larger one while pushing to go into persia's land, so China can't really build anything threatening to me, and mongols aren't very scary neither.

So I was thinking that attacking Persia would badly cripple world's no2 power (especially burning Persepolis), then when I get rifles and cannons I'll be the only one with it, and can proceed to wipe out mongolia, china and persia all at the same time with those units, or make them capitulate. Do you think this plan could work or is it really in my best interest to destroy china/mongols beforehand ?
 
Well the cities I see are weak,both China and the Mongols combined couldn't beat your empire...

I say take out Persia and then finish off your nieghbors...after that you will have the guns to take India.For me India was the easiest nation to beat,but again thats my experience,,,,

also pick the mountian city for your cap
PS is Russia weak/strong....mediocore...?
 
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