Praetorian Question

[Phatkarp]

I'm a Civ4 noob. In my latest game I'm deliberately trying to be more warlike, as I am a natural builder/turtle. For this purpose I chose to be Rome, and I'm hoping to execute an early war or two with the Praetorian UU.

My question is this: pre-Construction, is it worth it to build axemen or spearmen? My first thought is no, given the tremendous strength advantage of the praetorian. My plan right now is to build a few praetorians and specialize them through their promotions (i.e., shock praetorians to replace axemen, formation praetorians to replace spearmen).

Am I right, or am I missing something?

 

[iamnleth]

Spears and Axes are cheaper and don't require promotions.

 

[CivMcNut]

A spearman's strength is 4, against a mounted unit it is double so 8

An axeman's strength is 5, against a melee unit it is +50% so 7.5

A praetorian's strength is 8 to begin with against any type of unit and it gets a +10% bonus for a city attack.

This is all before any type of promotions. Really and truly you don't need another melee unit along for a fight, some charriots or horse archers to accompany might be a good idea and of course cats once they enter the picture.

 

[kcmarkwell]

Just build HORDES of praets and watch the world tumble at your feet.

 

[Mad2rix]

praetorians doesn't get +10% bonus against cities

 

[BalbanesBeoulve]

All you need is praetorians, but do give a few of them shock and formation promotions.

 

[ICNP]

Yeah Shock is useful as Axes are the only thing that comes close to scratching preats outside of cities. Medics are always good too... But in the end City raider is your best friend and should be held by 80% of your preat army. Beeline Iron working like a fool!

 

[Refar]

Formation is only avaiable at Level 3. A couple of spears for protection vs. Mounted is cheap.

 

[BARBEERIAN]

I usually still build plenty of Axes and Spears as Rome. Gotta leave something behind in all those conquered cities and for me it's usually 1 Axe, 1 Spear per city. They're also useful for supporting the stack. I prefer 100% of my Praets to be promoted with City Raider so I try to get the axes shock, and formation for the spears so they'll handle defense leaving the Praets fresh to pound the city.

Don't forget to bring a medic unit along too. I prefer a Chariot medic myself since stables give an extra promo for it making it faster to get all it's 'pre-general' medic promotions. I attach my first Great General to it and nab Medic III and the +1 Movement promotion. The good thing about the lowly chariot is it's almost always going to be your last defender so there's little risk of losing it.

 

[DigitalBoy]

Spears seem like a waste. On offense and defense, praetorians are as strong (stronger with promotions) as spears against mounted units. A couple of axes seem like a good idea at first since the only real threat to your praets are axemen, but praetorians are still stronger against melee units than axemen are. And axemen and spearmen by themselves are open to attack from their counters. A healthy praetorian has no real counter, at least not in the same sense that axemen and spearmen do. The only drawback praetorians have is requiring iron and a high hammer cost, but the obscene strength more than makes up for that.

Bottom line, spam praetorians like it's your job. They're the best city attacker, city defender, anti-melee, and anti-mounted unit you have, all rolled up into one package.

 

[Morgrad]

A spearman is a good against a chariot/HA as a Praetorian is - but who do I want killing that chariot or HA? The praetorian - more xp, please!

Once you get iron working, there is no reason to build anything but praetorians and occasionally a seige unit.

 

[PimpyMicPimp]

For max Praet ownage, I suggest this tech path:
BW, Wheel, IW. Backfill worker techs after. Your main priority is to get Iron Online and cracnking out the praets. Devout a city or two to just making them and, unless you're up against Sitting Bull, conquer at leasure.

 

[bestbrian]

I've never played as Rome so I've never gotten to play with Praets; I've got to give them a try on my next game. Also, as an aside, why is everyone a "builder looking to learn domination"? Where are the "warmongers looking to learn to build banks and wonders"?

 

[Bleys]

What is the cost factor (lazy, dont feel like looking it up)? If you can get 2 spears, or 1.5 axes, for the same cost as 1 Praet, then it makes sense to use them to fortify your cities instead of wasting Praets on defensive positions.

 

[Bhruic]

For max Praet ownage, I suggest this tech path:
BW, Wheel, IW.

Go IW before Wheel. You may get lucky and find iron next to a river, so you don't have to road it to get it online.

Bh

 

[DigitalBoy]

What is the cost factor (lazy, dont feel like looking it up)? If you can get 2 spears, or 1.5 axes, for the same cost as 1 Praet, then it makes sense to use them to fortify your cities instead of wasting Praets on defensive positions.

It's 45 (praetorian) vs. 35 (spearman/axeman).

3 praets (135 hammers) is about equal to 4 spears/axes (140 hammers) in terms of hammers.

If you divide 45 by 35, you see that in terms of hammers, the praet is worth 1.29 axes or spears. Advantage of numbers is there, just not very large.

 

[Phatkarp]

Also, as an aside, why is everyone a "builder looking to learn domination"? Where are the "warmongers looking to learn to build banks and wonders"?

I've got a theory on that. Natural builders are a little insecure about their ignorance of the finer points of warfare. When asking a "war" question, they don't want to sound stupid so they just own up to the fact that they usually don't seek out fights. I know that's why I added my little confession. If someone were to point out that my question was dumb, I would have started crying and never returned to these forums.

Warmongers, on the other hand, don't give a crap. If you mock them they will destroy you.

Thanks for all the replies. I think what I will do is build mostly Praetorians, with a horse unit for scouting and chariot with medic. I may through in a couple spears to garrison my conquests.

 

[CivDude86]

1 Prat is cheaper than 1 axe&spear wise which is very important since you can easily conquer till your broke.

 

[Quotey]

All units cost 1 in upkeep I believe. Though perhaps you mean you need less Praets than you do Axes?

 

[cabert]

If you rush to praetorians, you need iron. Thus you can leave out copper if you don't have it in your capital's fat cross.
If you go straight for iron, you won't build anything else than praetorians for a while.
I still build a few axes and spears which get specific promotions, but to be honest it makes no difference.