wow, 8 turns to Mids and a GMerch on the way. What sorcery is this? I generally wait for math until chopping much but maybe I shouldn't. Again great to see the possibilities. Thanks
How am I doing? (Monarch, Pericles, Toestra map)
- Thread starter skarpa
- Start date
Your T50: You shouldn't have warriors inside cities. They need a 
-police only at size 3. Don't road pre-T50. Try to always work the tiles you've improved (capital has improved 4 very good tiles, so don't whip 4->2, just slow build). In general, don't start workers at size 1 (rather grow to 2, single chop and 1-pop whip for example). You haven't chopped enough!
No worries, it doesn't need to be perfect. You are improving.
-police only at size 3. Don't road pre-T50. Try to always work the tiles you've improved (capital has improved 4 very good tiles, so don't whip 4->2, just slow build). In general, don't start workers at size 1 (rather grow to 2, single chop and 1-pop whip for example). You haven't chopped enough!No worries, it doesn't need to be perfect. You are improving.
thanks. I tried playing on last night before I saw this and you're really opening up the gap between us. I got the Mids nearer finished but the the Glghthse is further off. I got a city built for the gold but forgot to send any worker with it to improve tiles so it's sat costing me money and doing nothing. I got a phalanx and an archer out fogbusting who'll see settlers get to settle safely but no more settlers built yet. I messed up whipping Corinth and now its unhappy. Tech rate is 26 compared to your 40. That fifth city is costing more and if that was me I would be worried my economy would tank but you clearly don't need to. I generally settle beyond 3 cities only after currency. I may give it another go today when I'm not tired.
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It's in general not a huge deal IMO to be unhappy - for me it's more important to keep working the best tiles. You can whip unhappy pop off later, (3-pop settler with a granary for example).
Yes, that pigs/gold-spot demanded quite a bit of worker turns. For me the main immediate point of it was +1
. On monarch I think you can settle around 10 cities before you start to really need currency. With GLH maybe never. 
comes from. Here it's GLH trade routes, some cottages and some coastal tiles. At currency building wealth here and there. Tech rate is weak now but it will explode very quickly.that's very impressive. Earlier I played to turn 100. A little rushed but I'm nowhere near that. Mids and GLH finished and libs built. I did start running usual 2 scientists in each but decided I didn't wnat to spoil my chance of a GE or GM. A GE duly spawned and can build MoM or GLib - I'm not sure which, either would take too long with no marble. Normally I would have had a couple of GS by now and bulbed Alpha (maybe) and Phil (definitely). As it is I'm still 8 turns from CoL and my econ is tanking a bit - 40% avg tech rate - even though I have currency.Because you mentioned 350BC earlier, here is the development I'd expect around that date.
Spoiler :
I took 4 workers up to Argos and developed the gold and pigs and chopped and mined so it now has Gran, Lib and a Lighthouse in 2 turns. Not too sure I should have done that. Lib because it's cheap and I may need to build a uni so I can get Oxford elsewhere. Lighthouse because I thought 8 commerce from the sea would be good, the city could grow bigger and still work all the land tiles it could before. I also wanted to get the stuff done there so workers can head east or south and not return.
I put Knossos where you have and have nearly built a workboat. 2 workers are just roading to it now from corinth. A 3rd is being built and the 4 others can get there quicker once they've finished cottaging Athens, Sparta and Corinth (GLib?) or maybe Knossos for Glib as there is a ton of chops available. I want to get libs and scientists running in these last two cities asap. I settled my Mycenae just SE of the cows so gets rice and phants in second ring and i can still build where your Mycenae is. No settlers being built just mrkts in Athens and Sparta. I know these aren't good value but allow saving to be as profitable as teching and I can run merchs in Sparta to keep spawning GMs. I tend to treat philosophy as a leader as a continual golden age as far as GPs go but I really must try the caste, pacifism thing and starve cities if necessary to run more. I've just been wary of using GAges to spawn GPs to make more GAges - not if that's all I'm really getting out of them. I have seen it done though.
Ragnar's scout showed up. I see he founded Buddhism. I did see Zara had sent a boat on your game but not on mine. No sign of Kublai or Rameses. Having two aggressive neighbours really affected my game on previous tries. I know both are a long way off but they always seem to chose violence sooner or later. I think Kublai attacked me in my first try but I fended him off. In the first try I stayed out of religion as all were different and just wnet free rel at lib. in my second try Kublai and Ragnar were the same rel so I adopted theirs and hoped they'd target Rameses. I never met any of the other leaders until I had caravels out.
Anyway now I've seen what you've acheived I'm going back to turn 1 or near enough to see if I can do better. Or at least not repeat the same mistakes!
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I think GS is the best you can get really. I would never bulb alpha though, just academy if you get it early or philo bulb if it's not far. GS is minimum +1000
and GLib is only 350
, kinda meh. Rush MoM maybe yeah, but not sure if it's better than a GS. Rush Taj is the first really good use for a GE. GM kinda similar - monarch AI probably doesn't have big cities to get 2000
until very late, so you'll get like 900. Ok, maybe comparable to a GS.It's very important to have the boat ready to improve the fish immediately at border pop! You can build the boat in another city or chop.
In general you'd rather grow the cities than stagnate while running specialists, because not every city can get a
out. It's best to leave the job for the cities most suitable for it! The ones with most food. Other cities can for example whip settlers.For me it's a bit strange not to grab the ivory spot - that +1
is very valuable for you.It's important to open coastal trade routes to AIs. For extra umpf
:s, resource trades/sells and for religion spread. All these affect diplo, too.
I think GS is the best you can get really. I would never bulb alpha though, just academy if you get it early or philo bulb if it's not far. GS is minimum +1000
It's very important to have the boat ready to improve the fish immediately at border pop! You can build the boat in another city or chop.
In general you'd rather grow the cities than stagnate while running specialists, because not every city can get a
For me it's a bit strange not to grab the ivory spot - that +1
It's important to open coastal trade routes to AIs. For extra umpf
Well I had another go pretty much from the point I made my first mistake - trying to road to Sparta unnecessarily. I've done better I think with 7 cities down and 1 just about to be settled for the diamonds. Couldn't do anything like as good as you - those islands ain't so close y'know. I've a galley just out to check 'em out 7 turns away but I really should have had a settler and some muscle onboard in case something looked good to settle. Before then Athens made the fishing boat for Knossos. I've noticed the benefits of overseas trade but waited until astro on previous plays of this map. Never occurred to me to go for these islands. My Mycenae still gets ivory, just not the same ivory. it's not the best city site but i wanted to infill a bit between going out to south and east and maybe forbid palace later. City number 7 pharsalos shares the rice, grabs a wine and allows Mycenae to trade with Athens via the river (I think!), anyway it definitely is. Both are on grans until pop 2 when I'll switch to workers. Athens and Sparta are about to finish workers too.
Zara turned up this time. We opened borders but I don't have any trade routes with him. I don't understand - if his fishing boat can get here it's not oceanic trade so should be available. He traded IW for Maths. He's got other low level stuff but I have nothing he wants for alpha. Ragnar, Kublai and Ramesses have all put in an appearance this time too. I notice the marble is now in reach if I carry on playing. No GPs as yet. Corinth has 2 sci up, darn city boss keeps putting a boffin on in athens which makes a GE less likely. I still kinda want one for MoM if not GLib I've not had a GM so early before so your comments about trade missions have been noted. Maybe just hang onto him and go for a boffin next.
Anyway once again thanks for the input. I'll re-read everything and then maybe have another go
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Yes, roads are a luxury. Workers have more useful things to do usually! Like chop.
- improve food
- chop
- cottage
- connect
-resource or a city that otherwise isn't connected and must be immediately connected. Not all cities need to be, they just don't have :s then.Yes, and to be safe I had two galleys, plus you need 4 workboats (and 2 settlers). That's 420
. A big project indeed, but the give you better :s in every city, hence I wanted them quickly. That's how you should use the forest! Stuff like libraries or lighthouses are not that important imo and can be 2-pop whipped.Still I have 'found' clam island and a settler has just been made who could claim it. Workboats may need to wait a bit. With cottaging in place around Athens and Sparta my econ should improve quickly. I think I have enough covering forces for now so more settlers and workers?
Would need to do some renaming to be able to open the save I guess. Judging from the screenshot you keep building workers in new cities. In general it's the worst place to build workers! Cities in -cap can stagnate building a worker or preferably you should whip all settlers/workers. 1T of in next turn whip. It is optimal.
-cap can stagnate building a worker or preferably you should whip all settlers/workers. 1T of in next turn whip. It is optimal.Thanks for trying to look. Most workers have been built in Athens or Sparta. These latest ones are just cos I'm running short with the new cities. I played through to turn 125. Most stuff is developed now thanks to the horde of workers you recommended. I managed to settle the fish isle - nice indeed thanks. Just one right now but I see the 2 tiles distance doesn't apply to islands(?) so clam isle could be done. I did it on the cheap with one settler and one galley. Fishing boats from Athens whilst growing. Otherwise no new cities, my tech rate has been miserable. Beaten to CoL and PHIL it seems. Should have a GS and bulb that in 6 turns and I have that GE and GM awaiting use. Either can bulb metal casting which seems a bit of a waste. I'm one turn from Lit so could bulb GLib or better chop it out at Mycenae - I've saved chops for it. No chance of marble for a while as barb city is 1 tile northwest of where I wanted to build city for marble. Ivory online but no construction or horseriding yet. Fellow leaders are mostly cavemen, possible exception Ramesses but only mono and priesth for trade ATM. World has divided into Hindu (zara, ramesses and kublai) and Buddhist camps (Bismark and Ragnar). Ragnar, Kublai and Ramesses all plotting, hopefully against each other and not me. I think I'm too strong for Ragnar to fight and maybe time to take Hinduism as state rel which ought to make the others happier.
Plan. Settle diamonds in next couple turms. Loadsa workers to hand. Settle clam island asap. I've other settlers but would like to see my econ improve before settling - tech is 160 beakers at 100% but 93 gold out and only 31 in when at 0%. Don't feel good but should improve. Some courthouses built or coming. Tech or trade for Cal (spices and MoM), Mon (wine), Con and HR asap. Build phants and crush barb city, raze and resettle 1 tile SW or SE for marble
Completed most of plan. Barb city about to be razed - there's enough phants nearly there.
Settled island and diamond city. Converted to hindu. Only Ragnar still plotting. Were the others plotting to kill me? Chopped GLib and GE built MoM. Got Music and free GA. Traded for Cal, Mon and MC and some others. GM bulbed CS (I always find getting CS a drag so YAY!). Started GAge, went pac bureaucracy and caste. GS spawned and bulbed edu. Should be GM next turn. Small chance of GA as I was in a hurry cos I traded for calendar and built MoM in Sparta where the GE happened to be. Oh well. Should be near a GS by end of GA so tech Nat and bulb Lib I hope soon. Must remember to sell my map to the AIs
Things look good!
Maybe there was a miscommunication about lighthouses? All coastal cities that have seafood should get it after initial expansion, when the-cap allows, because it allows growth. It's a lot better building then than say a forge or a courthouse. In Argos it's debatable if it's better to just stagnate and work 1
3.
Maybe there was a miscommunication about lighthouses? All coastal cities that have seafood should get it after initial expansion, when the
-cap allows, because it allows growth. It's a lot better building then than say a forge or a courthouse. In Argos it's debatable if it's better to just stagnate and work 13.
I now feel kind of inspired to give this map script a try, but I'd probably play it on a smaller size adding one or more AI to make it more in line with standard settings. Btw I had a scooter accident and broke my shin and upper right arm so any playing will be kind of slow and exhausting with just my left hand.
That sounds really annoying. Get well soon
Things look good!
Maybe there was a miscommunication about lighthouses? All coastal cities that have seafood should get it after initial expansion, when the
Thanks. No miscommunication I think, I just haven't prioritised lighthouses in cities with so much food already, growth wasn't a problem and excess size is being whipped away but I hated how much they cost even though they are definitely worth it. I may whip moai in one island. Most have em now. Argos got one for the extra growth and commerce - it's now 30 per turn and because it could build it easily. It's been a decent wee production city - good for slow building units. Windmills will allow more growth now?
I'm at turn 175 now which is more or less where I was on the game when I started this thread. I've traded, teched and expanded. Econ looks better over 50% avg tech rate. I'm 1 turn off lib and deciding what freebie I'll pick. Usually mil trad but astro is a possibility for overseas expansion. I saw Henrik hold on for demo which may be an option. All the AIs are backward. Bizzy and Rag haven't even heard of paper. The others want it but ain't got it. Some nice trades for my map, discovered the world is round with that, no ships necessary! Met Caesar at last and for some strange reason instantly got trade routes with him but not the others. Everyone is pleased, except Rag who cautious. He is unaccountably even more useless than usual this game. He was plotting against Bizzy and now has his war which I suspect he'll regret. Zara is friendly. I'm about to send a GM to Caesar I think. I'll have other carvelles too and explore for islands to settle - if only I could find horses!
Much of the jungle is settled now with more settlers on their way. I've reached Rag and am thinking of settling the rice north of Uppsala which'll grab fish and clam and compete with Rag for the banana. I'm considering where to build FP, Taj and Oxford. Or do I save FP for overseas? My GLib city is too short of food for a good Oxford. It was built there because it was somewhere I could chop it. Would like to keep Athens and Sparta pure for GE and GMs really though I've messed up sparta a bit with MoM. Sparta hasn't recovered size from whippings - anger is gone but I forgot to check it was working food. Most cities have Hinduism with just the newer ones to convert. 25% production bonus is nice and I forgot last GAge that pac only works where is the state rel. Taj GAge should be better for GPs, or if not better at least as good given the increase in cost.
Where to go from here? Looks a good opportunity for a peaceful diplo victory? Any tips? Maybe crush Rag who no one likes first? More expansion definitely but I'm approaching Kublai to the south now too.
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