1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

preventing or predicting sea invasions

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by FLUKE, Oct 31, 2007.

  1. FLUKE

    FLUKE Chieftain

    Joined:
    May 22, 2007
    Messages:
    50
    Location:
    Wales
    I was playing a archipelago map when Monty (who else?) declared on me and had already put 3 Galleons worth of troops near a poorly defended city on my main island, of course I lost it immediately as I couldnt get my troops there quick enough.

    Is the only way of preventing a sea invasion a manual search of the coastline every turn?

    I had frigates and galleons of my own and could have blown him out of the water before he landed but I was caught with my pants down as they say:blush:
     
  2. r_rolo1

    r_rolo1 King of myself

    Joined:
    May 19, 2006
    Messages:
    13,818
    Location:
    Lisbon, Portugal
    AI normally have a gathering city for their navy ( normally the closest from you :lol: ) It is wise to put a caravel or a sub near it to check if the fleet had sailed out of harbor. And if you're suspecting that you're going to invaded by sea, activate the "see friendly units moves " option... naval units have a higher speed and they can pass throught you line of sight unnoticed in their turns if you don't have it checked ( but otherwise disable it.... it can make the game really slow )
     
  3. LemonJello

    LemonJello Warlord

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2007
    Messages:
    123
    Location:
    The Crossroads of the Marine Corps
    I try to have a "picket line" of ships along likely approaches to act as an early warning to amphib assaults. If I have subs, they get placed outside enemy ports as well. That leaves me my wolf packs of subs to attack the enemy fleet.
     
  4. aragami_frog

    aragami_frog Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2007
    Messages:
    53
    I was able to fend off the first attack a few times and rather then taking out the pesky transport boat they came on... I instead just followed it back to it's home port noting the course it took (it always takes the same course despite what ever high powered ship you put in it's way). I'd wait for it to return to it's base, pick up more troops and then sink it in the ocean full of troops. That way not only do they lose the ship they lose the units. If you try to sink the ship as it leaves the AI will just rebuild another ship in their cities and then you don't know when to expect it to be completed and headed towards you.

    I usually put the border cities with better and more troops. Then have everyone else moderately to medicorely secured and then in the middle of my nation I place a unit of fast moving troops. True Calvary doesn't have as much fire power as a Infantry unit etc... but when you need to rush to a surprise attack site it's best to launch them into action to hold the enemy while you can mass some of your slower more powerfull units to head towards the new war front.
     
  5. GoodGame

    GoodGame Red, White, & Blue, baby!

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2004
    Messages:
    13,725
    My own strategy is just flood my 'peaceful' competitors area with privateer stacks. This tends to weaken their own fleet, slowing down the chance they try an amphibious invasion, and will also give you a heads up that an invasion fleet is on the way. Don't think their stack of galleons+frigates beelining to your coast is a Great merchant expedition-----start making military preparations as soon as your privateers see something like that.



     
  6. Dubzilla8

    Dubzilla8 Just Right of Center

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2006
    Messages:
    89
    I personally always thought it would be nice if there was a sort of international waters buffer zone or something, where bringing naval units within a certain distance of a civilization would be considered an act of aggression. Maybe not an automatic declaration, but I think it would be cool if you could sink the ships without declaring. You'd get a penalty to relations, obviously, but not a long drawn out war unless they declared after your attack. Afterall, the person who declares gets more war weariness, right?
     
  7. aragami_frog

    aragami_frog Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2007
    Messages:
    53
    Today I had an AI do similar to me, suddenly declare war on me and that same second a group of horse men were on my shores. I beat off that round of attack and foritifed the coast with assorted Destroyers.

    Well, they wisen'd up and attacked by landing in another AI's city and attacking. Well, I saw them approaching one of my cities and I quickly dispatched them before they entered my soil.

    Then comes the main point of my post, I saw the enemy city where their ships (a couple Destroyers and a couple transports) were inside and all I did was just march a rifleman into the friendly AI's city and it destroyed all of them with no shots fired.
     
  8. LemonJello

    LemonJello Warlord

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2007
    Messages:
    123
    Location:
    The Crossroads of the Marine Corps
    Now, that is something I'll have to remember to try the next time.
     
  9. Navarre

    Navarre Legio XIII

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2007
    Messages:
    536
    Location:
    France
    Since Izzy razed on of my best cities that I made the mistake to let almost undefended in Vanilla, I learned the lesson. Coastal cities are the most vulnerable. I can't count the times where I've seen a SoD attacking my cities right from the sea (seems to be the new AI favourite strategy in BTS), and only after that the declaration of war.

    Always guard the coastal cities as if you were at war. If you don't , you'll lose them when the war will come. Usually they come with cavalry, so riflemen and some grenadiers will do.
     
  10. FLUKE

    FLUKE Chieftain

    Joined:
    May 22, 2007
    Messages:
    50
    Location:
    Wales
    Sea lanes are busy places, even if you weren't at war, a formation of warships would get noticed and would put you on alert (in the real world), I think the game is weak in this area and could do more to alert you, particularly in the Modern Era, there is no way a SoD should be on your shores unannounced.
     
  11. Navarre

    Navarre Legio XIII

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2007
    Messages:
    536
    Location:
    France
    A late radar technology would be cool, with radars buildable in coastal cities which would alert you when suspicious moves are detected within a certain distance. Any warship entering this area would trigger a "warships detected near <insert city>" line just like enemy troops do during wars. By warship I mean anything but a workboat.

    I miss civil boats BTW. It would be cool to have commercial ships which can carry anything but military units. They wouldn't trigger radars, so sending them near a foreign country wouldn't be seen as an act of agression.
     
  12. 6K Man

    6K Man Bureaucrat

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    2,281
    Location:
    in a Gadda Da Vida
    I've pulled that stunt a few times, too. I can't quite understand why this isn't considered a bug. It certainly isn't the way it would work in the real world - the ships would would either be interned during wartime, or they'd have to head out to sea and fight (think Graf Spee).

    Failing that, the AIs should be programmed to not leave their ships unguarded in a city that could potentially be attacked. Or ships should not be automatically destroyed when a city is attacked by land - even defending at 1/4 their normal strength would be acceptable. Or something, dammit. Argh. :crazyeye:
     
  13. aragami_frog

    aragami_frog Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2007
    Messages:
    53
    Didn't Civ 3 have radar stations? I don't recall seeing them in Civ 4. I think they should be something you can build in your own territory or on any land that isn't own by anyone, or heck you can even build one on friendlies soil if you are good enough friends with them.
     
  14. LemonJello

    LemonJello Warlord

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2007
    Messages:
    123
    Location:
    The Crossroads of the Marine Corps
    Workers could build watchtowers and radar stations in Civ3, I believe. Put them on mountains/hills and they'd give you an added sight range. Something like that would be nice to place on those single tile islands as an early warning system. Maybe add upgrades to forts that would allow for radar/sonar stations that could detect subs and ships?
     
  15. aragami_frog

    aragami_frog Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2007
    Messages:
    53
    One thing I don't like about the workers though is if you have them on "Build improvements" or "Build Improvements in local city" they have a nasty habit of tearing down any forts you built.

    I'd build a fort and then years later a worker will go over there and start tearing it down to put up a town or a farm. I put the workers on automated since I usually have a ton of workers and don't like having to be bother with them every turn. It'd be nice to be able to say to them to just leave that one tile and the fort alone.

    I usually use the fort as an added defense for a stack of troops I posistion on the border of an AI I'm not so friendly with, that way if they declare war I can immediatly march them deep into their territory and disrupt commerce and reinforcements.
     
  16. Gooblah

    Gooblah Heh...

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2007
    Messages:
    4,282
    Try creating a "sonar net":
    1) Build around 10-20 submarines while Civics which give additional XP are on
    2) Give the subs Flanking I and Sentry promotions
    3) Arrange the sub in Sentry mode around the landmass so that each one's line of sight borders -not overlaps- with the next one's.
    4) Repeat the steps till the entire landmass is covered.

    This has the ability to do two things:
    First, enemy fleets will trigger the Sentry mode, awakening the sub and letting you know as well. Next, Destroyers and other sub-sinkers can be found before (usually) they get in attacking range, and if they do attack, the Flanking I gives the sub a chance to survive and reinforcements to arrive.
     
  17. Thanny

    Thanny Warlord

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2006
    Messages:
    265
    This isn't true. Chances of withdrawal apply only to attacks. You have zero chance to withdraw when defending, no matter how the unit is promoted. It either wins, and destroys the attacker, or it loses, and is destroyed.
     
  18. MrCynical

    MrCynical Deity

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2005
    Messages:
    4,582
    Location:
    The Dreaming Spires
    Your options are basically:

    1)Picket line. This is fairly effective, but expensive (hideously so if your picket line is actually going to be strong enough to stop enemy invasions as well as spotting them).

    2)In peacetime the AI tend to pile all their units in to one or two cities. Find them, watch them with spies, and work out where they'll head when they leave.

    3) Later on you can use aircraft for recon though this is both time consuming and irritating to do. It's cheap though.
     
  19. Navarre

    Navarre Legio XIII

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2007
    Messages:
    536
    Location:
    France
    There is an option, "Workers ignore ancient improvements" or something like that. Once I've worked my city tiles I put the workers on "automated commercial network", and I use this option to make sure they won't do anything stupid.

    But, if your workers destroy your forts, that means they are in a city radius and should be worked. You should build your forts outside of city range.

    About the forts, I like their use at a airbase. You build some forts on the coast and base some planes there, and you have a recon force to see what's going on the sea when you're at war. Planes could have a "automated recon" button tough, that'd make things easier.
     

Share This Page