Prince AI is pathetic

[Siptah]

If only spain had built half as many units as Brussel city-state

It's a cultural city state. So this is only a logical thing to do for Brussels. Don't you want to use that force for you as Gilgamesh?

Edit: is rome in Atomic/Modern era and Brussels has that army? *sigh* Why no upgrading instead of amassing units.

 

[qadams]

If only spain had built half as many units as Brussel city-state

Spoiler :

Yeah, that City-State unit spam is something they'll probably want to fix. Could cause a lot of traffic jams with 1 Upt.

 

[CaiusDrewart]

To be fair, prince difficulty in CiV is also insanely bad. But it had the perk of having cities being capable of defending themselves right when they're settled. So you couldnt go in with a couple of units and take them.

But if CiV had had the same defense system as in VI aka weak defense and no bombardment until building walls, it would have been the exact same result.

I wonder if in the first patch we'll see earlier and stronger city bombardment. It wouldn't surprise me.

As I recall in the first build of Civ V city defense was much weaker, but then they realized they needed to crank that way up to prevent the AI from getting rolled over. Of course, that also made it completely impossible for the AI to take the human player's cities, but hey, you win some, you lose some.

 

[stealth_nsk]

If only spain had built half as many units as Brussel city-state

Spoiler :

It looks like build priorities are waiting for heavy tweaking.

With Brussels it's likely to be "nothing else to build" case. It has walls, monument and granary. It can't build water mill as it's not on the river. As Industrial city state it's going to build Industrial zone, but it's not available yet. Also, it doesn't have resources to build classical era units, so it spawns cheap ancient ones.

It looks like one of the issues of adding districts. IMHO, Industrial and Cultural (and probably Commercial) city-states should consider building one of the early districts as their "special" district comes quite late.

 

[cazaderonus]

I wonder if in the first patch we'll see earlier and stronger city bombardment. It wouldn't surprise me.

As I recall in the first build of Civ V city defense was much weaker, but then they realized they needed to crank that way up to prevent the AI from getting rolled over. Of course, that also made it completely impossible for the AI to take the human player's cities, but hey, you win some, you lose some.

They just need to make AI prioritize their army and defense building more. I know nothing of programming, but is it hard to add a routine for AIs that grades every part of the game on each turn end : army, city defense, science, culture, etc... And then have another routine combine those grades with the leaders flavors in order to decide what it will do next ?

Ai is a complicated thing but i assume it's doable to hardcode some standard behavior.

 

[Siptah]

It looks like build priorities are waiting for heavy tweaking.

With Brussels it's likely to be "nothing else to build" case. It has walls, monument and granary. It can't build water mill as it's not on the river. As Industrial city state it's going to build Industrial zone, but it's not available yet. Also, it doesn't have resources to build classical era units, so it spawns cheap ancient ones.

It looks like one of the issues of adding districts. IMHO, Industrial and Cultural (and probably Commercial) city-states should consider building one of the early districts as their "special" district comes quite late.

Thanks for that insight. I didn't think of that. Surely, the CS should build other districts. Not only for themselves (Encampment, Industrial, Campus, Commerce) but also for trading with them and for pillaging them. Otherwise trade routes to CS are almost always worse than to others civs, right?

 

[rastak]

They do have some work to do. City state with 20 units and Spain and Japan with about 4 each isn't good. Hopefully not too hard of an adjustment to make. Stealth made a couple good points.

 

[Resand]

It's a cultural city state. So this is only a logical thing to do for Brussels. Don't you want to use that force for you as Gilgamesh?

Edit: is rome in Atomic/Modern era and Brussels has that army? *sigh* Why no upgrading instead of amassing units.

It's about year 1100AD. Research rates are insane, so Quill entered the modern era around this time.

I'm guessing the city state might have a more reasonable tech progression.

 

[RohirrimElf]

I`m worried about the passive AI. I do not get attacked all that often on civ 5. Which i find boring. I hope this does not get repeated with civ 6.

- Which difficulty level is Prince? And how many levels are above Prince? (i would like to know what bonus levels the AI gets above prince)

 

[darko82]

As expected, the same was true with Civ V. Untill CP appeared. I might wait a few years to get the game (for a few bucks) to get better AI.

And I believe the poor AI can be a deal breaker for many people.

 

[footslogger]

It's about year 1100AD. Research rates are insane, so Quill entered the modern era around this time.

I haven't seen all the Quill videos but is that correct that he enters the modern era around 1100AD?? If so, that's really terrible and will ruin any immersion for me. I don't recall this being a problem on prince level in Civ5. This thread has me worried with all the evidence of a hopeless AI.

 

[RohirrimElf]

footslogger,

Quill is a deity civ 5 player. It does not surprice me in the least that it is to easy to plan your way through the tech/civic tree at speed with eureka boosts.

I will install slomo science mods the day when they are available for civ 6.

 

[Kouvb593kdnuewnd]

Prince is the 3 out of 6 or so difficulty in Civilization VI. Ai have at best have very smal bonuses here.

 

[footslogger]

Quill is a deity civ 5 player.

Well, he has been looking very unfamiliar with how Civ6 works and if he can rush through the tech tree so quickly on one of his first attempts I think many of us will be able to do the same. The game seems to need a lot more balancing and, if I judge this to be the case after a few days of playing it, I will just put it aside until a couple of big patches have appeared. Doesn't matter how many wonderful new features Civ6 introduces, if the combat stinks and the tech and civic trees are all out of sync then the game will be unplayable for me.

 

[trendy]

I really wish people would stop being apologists on this. It's three weeks before release I very highly doubt the AI is changed at all. I kind of doubt it's accidental it's bad either. Given the time commitment that civ takes firaxis won't want to discourage newbies from playing their future games by giving them a bad experience (losing because the AI doesn't suck).

Firaxis has had tons of time to fix civ 5 AI, yet it's really not much different from vanilla. Bring in a few dedicated fans, and they fix it right up... If they couldn't be bothered to improve the AI in 5 why do you expect them to do it here?

I know I wish they would make a good AI. Watching the AI throw 10 trebuchets at your city in civ5 on deity without any followup melee is really really painful. But I'd expect more of the same here.

 

[stealth_nsk]

I really wish people would stop being apologists on this. It's three weeks before release I very highly doubt the AI is changed at all.

It's not how game development works.

The more actively you change gameplay, the less advanced AI you may have and the less it follows the gameplay changes. Once the game is more or less stable and in the process of polishing - that's there hard work on AI begins.

The build is at least 1 month before release (maybe a bit more, depending on the development process) and a month of hard work on AI could fix significant flaws and surely could fix something as minor as build priorities IF there's no bigger problem hidden behind.

So, we'll have AI being improved by release, that's guaranteed. Whether it will be able to field as many military units as needed - possible, but we don't know.

 

[Deggial]

The (especially hard to code) tactical AI seesm to be quite good, though. At least I haven't seen so horrible mistakes as Civ5's AI tended to do - there were in fact quite clever moves to be seen in some of the movies I watched so far (e.g. the "slinger bypass").

Unit production and unit upgrading is all part of the strategical AI and should be
a) easier to tweak and
b) more responsive to plain bonus increases.

While it's still too early to judge, I am still mildly optimistic.

 

[Danzo_87]

I just hope that they handicap the AI just so that those who had first access could explore the core mechanic of the game instead of being constantly worrying about being defeated by the AI (just my little tiny hope though)

 

[kaspergm]

footslogger,

Quill is a deity civ 5 player. It does not surprice me in the least that it is to easy to plan your way through the tech/civic tree at speed with eureka boosts.

I will install slomo science mods the day when they are available for civ 6.

With due respect for Quill, the problem is that he did not PLAN his way through the tech tree. In fact, most of what happened to him in terms of tech boosts etc. clearly came as complete surprises for him, and every time he says "I gotta do this for a tech boost" he then immediately forgets about it and does something else.

I know this is preview version, and hopefully they'll use this to tweak numbers, but the fact that Quill can enter modern era before 1100 AD without really playing optimally shows a lot about how poorly balanced things are. Yes, he did build two campuses with universities, but one of them was really bad, that that should not exactly be out of the ordinary. He did seem to get super easy access to great scientists, and then yes, AI opponents were just abysmally bad.

PS: And seeing Brussels unit spam and blocking everything off was just cringeworthy. I mean, did they not learn anything from Civ5?

 

[darko82]

So, we'll have AI being improved by release, that's guaranteed. Whether it will be able to field as many military units as needed - possible, but we don't know.

Well, that was not the case with Civ V. Besides, they left the poor AI in Civ V. They did not fix even the basic flaws untill now.