Pyramids in SE

[MT5678]

Hello.
I realize that this thread may have been discussed already.
But I was looking for some advice.
I am a Prince player (ok, I own noble and am sorta good at prince).
I have always used CE in the past.
I am looking to try out SE.
It sounds fun!
I was wondering if any of you had any advice on the role of pyramids.
Is it vital, and if you should quickly try for it?
Or should you focus on building up your infrastructure?
Thank you for your advice

As a side note, I tried out SE with Saladin on prince in Vanilla 1.61
I was researching CS in 250 B.C. I made some mistakes, like not getting alphabet, but everyone hated me (religion) anyways.

 

[OTAKUjbski]

I too can pwn Noble and currently play primarily on Prince ... sometimes Monarch when I'm feeling a lil' masochistic.

CE is also my preferred (and most understood) economic model.

Like you as well, I've been trying to learn how to run an effective SE.

I don't feel like Pyramids break an SE, but it certainly helps to solidify its competitiveness and superiority in the early game.

If I'm Industrious or have Stone, I'll most likely go for it. If I'm both, then I know I'll go for the Pyramids.

Not getting the Pyramids immediately bumps GL to the top of my Wonder-full priority list.

In either case, I almost always ensure I get GL in my Science City.

 

[cabert]

there are 2 things about SE:
1)- direct output of scientists
2)- Great Scientists from GPP given by the scientists.

With pyramids, you double 1).
With philo, you "double" (not really, but you get them twice as fast) 2).

If you have the pyramids, you go for representation, and even settling your GSs makes sense since you have a rather large 1).
If you don't, you mostly want to lightbulb your way to liberalism and constitution (thus get representation), thus focus more on 2).

It all depends on the map and leader. Note that conquering pyramids is just as good as building them.

 

[frob2900]

I agree with cabert in that on some maps conquering the pyramids is a very good option. It has generally been a workable strategy for me on Monarch/Pangea to focus on military early and take out the AI (generally Ramesses/Huyana Capac or someone like that) that ends up with Great Library/Parthenon/Pyramids etc.

Conquering wonders gives you a city and a wonder, which is just great, and it also takes the wonders AWAY from the AI A specialist economy is very useful for this kind of early warring, since by generating great people points you can realistically pop a few great scientists in the BC years, potentially giving you a huge boost in techs even though your building armies rather than slavishly maxing out your per turn tech rate.

Popping techs that the AI doesnt have gives you the option of trading, thus taking you to tech parity with the AI, even though you have been building armies/warring and they have been doing most the research. Dont worry if your slightly behind at times. Catapults/Swordmen can fight Longbows easily if you are producing enough military and have settled a Great General in a city, giving CRII swordmen. (Another good thing is getting War Elephants. Those really work wonders)

Remember that since youre running an SE, you should have 1-2 scientists running in most cities and always whip libraries in new conquests. If you go for caste system make sure you have enough cities with mines/good hammer tiles to keep your war machine going without the whip (can be tricky).

Now since you can bulb paper/education you are on the fast track to Liberalism. Once you hit that it could be a good idea to get nationalism, since then you can draft. This allows you to "rush" through drafting, even while running caste system for max research. If you have conquered the pyramids and ca 30-40% of the map at this point the game is often in the bag, ive noticed (even on Monarch).

Dont worry about waiting for rifling to start drafting. If you have trebuchets and the best AI defenders are musketmen, then drafting Macemen/muskets is in itself a very viable option.

 

[beeflow]

Pyramids are not required but they are nice. You can find a coule of games on these forums (above Monarch) from the more experience players who run an SE and don't build pyramids. One thing I've noticed from these games is that they go to war early.

I've been trying the SE on monarch (vanilla CIV) and it seems you need to beeline to certain techs and then back trade for those you don't have. This was an important concept for me when I moved up from Prince to Monarch.

 

[MT5678]

Thanks, guys.
Yeah, I like to go to war early to cripple or eliminate one rival.
But when I played an SE, I had no copper, and the iron was far away.
I should have hit regenerate (or started over).
Anyways:
Can any of you give me specific games on Monarch+ w/ SE and no Pyramids?
I would really appreciate it.
Thank You All.

 

[martin031]

Thanks, guys.
Yeah, I like to go to war early to cripple or eliminate one rival.
But when I played an SE, I had no copper, and the iron was far away.
I should have hit regenerate (or started over).
Anyways:
Can any of you give me specific games on Monarch+ w/ SE and no Pyramids?
I would really appreciate it.
Thank You All.

If you lack the metals, then what I do is try to get to construction quick so I can make a stack of cats, which work well even with archers. My war goals are usually more focused then, I try to find a city with metals, take it and hook it up to the rest of my cities. But usually if you don't have metals u should have horses or elephants. If not then I would not feel too bad about the restart.