Quick Answers / 'Newbie' Questions

[Tone]

No, it is not patched at all. I bought a three-pack with civ3, play the world and conquests in the store.

^ Then it means you bought complete, which has already all the patches.

Then I'm not exactly sure why it has an error. Complete comes patched to 1.22 for C3C, IIRC. Are you playing the standard, unmodified game?

Only bjfrones can answer this but I didn't read his answer as being that he'd bought complete. It sounded to me as if the retailer had separate copies of the three packages and bundled them together to sell as one. I could be wrong of course but this would explain why it's not patched.

 

[TruePurple]

This thread has a Flip Calculator.......Should answer ALL your questions on City Flipping.........even to the exact percentage to 2 decimal places!

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=53157

It doesn't answer all my questions. Actually it just raises more questions.

What does it mean by "local culture"? Local as in a city? Or does neighboring city cultures matter as well?

By ommission, does this mean a cities individual culture doesn't matter (unless greater then then AI)? Neighboring city culture doesn't matter?

Only culture expansions matter on local level for the purpose of claimed tiles? What decides what tiles are claimed? Does neighboring city cultural expansion stack for claiming tiles?

Doesn't matter if a edge city has 1000 culture or 9999 culture except for the purposes of total culture (and then that culture could be anywhere?)??

 

[bjfrones]

Only bjfrones can answer this but I didn't read his answer as being that he'd bought complete. It sounded to me as if the retailer had separate copies of the three packages and bundled them together to sell as one. I could be wrong of course but this would explain why it's not patched.

No, in the left corner it says 1.00......

 

[Tone]

No, in the left corner it says 1.00......

So you haven't got Complete then. (You've got them in three different packages, right?) I suggest that you get CAII then as I'm pretty sure that it can read saves that are not fully patched but I may have not ever tried as far back as 1.00 so no guarantees! You can get the seed number by then going to the World Map tab and selecting Properties. Be patient; the map can take a while to load.

 

[Ginger_Ale]

Only bjfrones can answer this but I didn't read his answer as being that he'd bought complete. It sounded to me as if the retailer had separate copies of the three packages and bundled them together to sell as one. I could be wrong of course but this would explain why it's not patched.

Ah...you are most correct!

 

[gmaharriet]

So you haven't got Complete then. (You've got them in three different packages, right?)

This brings up an interesting question, which bjfrones has not yet asked, so I will. Although patching his games to the most recent version would not help him with the particular map he wants to recreate, at some point it would probably be most beneficial for him to apply the patches.

My question (because I can't remember back to when I did it) is, if he wants to add patches, does he need first to upgrade vanilla to 1.29f, then PTW to 1.27f and then Conquests to 1.22? Or can he just do the Conquests upgrade alone, and will that patch the other two versions at the same time?

@bjfrones - Patching to the latest versions would get rid of any bugs in your games. Also, it would be easier for any of us to answer your questions, since we'd know the same game mechanics you're working with. Just a suggestion.

 

[Bartleby]

If you patch conquests it does automatically upgrade vanilla (and PTW if present) to the latest version.

As far as I know, if you want to "start over" you should be able to get the seed from a 1.0 save and use it in 1.22; the tech tree will be different is all. But if you want to continue playing other games started pre-1.22 you can't do that unless you have two installs. For a while I had 1.22 and 1.17b running side-by side.
edit: Was is 1.15b? Can't remember any more.

 

[bjfrones]

OK, then I will do that.
What else is new in the latest patch?

 

[Bartleby]

The readme will have a full list of changes after you patch; I can't remember off the top of my head. One thing that I think happened between PTW and C3C (so this isn't actually a patch thing, just something you may well want to change if you haven't already) is the NoAIPatrol setting in the .ini file: In PTW you could set NoAIPatrol=1 and the AI didn't aimlessly move its units in the interturn. In C3C this is the default setting and you need to set NoAIPatrol=0 otherwise the barbarians will just fortify in camps and do nothing.

 

[Chamnix]

It doesn't answer all my questions. Actually it just raises more questions.

What does it mean by "local culture"? Local as in a city? Or does neighboring city cultures matter as well?

Local means culture in the city you are concerned about only. If it was your city from the beginning, the factor will be one. If you captured the city from the AI, and the AI had built culture there, then the factor will be 2 until you have more culture in that particular city than the AI had.

By ommission, does this mean a cities individual culture doesn't matter (unless greater then then AI)? Neighboring city culture doesn't matter?

Correct on both counts.

Only culture expansions matter on local level for the purpose of claimed tiles? What decides what tiles are claimed? Does neighboring city cultural expansion stack for claiming tiles?

Tiles are claimed based on distance to the nearest civ's city. If tile A is directly next to an AI city, and your nearest city has a tile between it and tile A, then tile A will always belong to the AI no matter how great the disparity in culture.

In the case of a tile equidistant from two civ's cities, the city with the greater culture controls the tile. If the cities have the same amount of culture, then the one that is founded first controls (I think - I suppose it is possible that the one that is listed first in the database controls).

How many tiles are claimed is based on that city's culture - you get expansions at 10, 100, and 1000 culture - your "fat cross" just gets fatter at each expansion.

Doesn't matter if a edge city has 1000 culture or 9999 culture except for the purposes of total culture (and then that culture could be anywhere?)??

Right again.

 

[TruePurple]

Tiles are claimed based on distance to the nearest civ's city. If tile A is directly next to an AI city, and your nearest city has a tile between it and tile A, then tile A will always belong to the AI no matter how great the disparity in culture.

Well if AI has no culture and you have at least one expansion thats not necessarily true. Its also not true the other way around. So what about tiles that arent equal distance?(but not necessarily adjacent to a city either)

How many tiles are claimed is based on that city's culture - you get expansions at 10, 100, and 1000 culture - your "fat cross" just gets fatter at each expansion.

And 10,000 (and so on I assume) yes yes *rolls eyes* I know about cultural expansion.

In the case of a tile equidistant from two civ's cities, the city with the greater culture controls the tile.

So is it total culture or culture expansion that decides tile control or a mix?

What about tiles that arent equal distance from two cities? How are those decided?

Is Chamnix on the right track with his explanation? (well the parts that are clear anyways)

 

[Tone]

Tiles are claimed based on distance to the nearest civ's city. If tile A is directly next to an AI city, and your nearest city has a tile between it and tile A, then tile A will always belong to the AI no matter how great the disparity in culture.

Well if AI has no culture and you have at least one expansion thats not necessarily true. Its also not true the other way around.

Have you got an example of that please?

And 10,000 (and so on I assume) yes yes *rolls eyes* I know about cultural expansion...

Is Chamnix on the right track with his explanation? (well the parts that are clear anyways)

Maybe I am being over-sensitive here but I have to wonder whether you are deliberately trying to be rude towards people that are only trying to help you?

 

[TruePurple]

Maybe I'm miss remembering but I think I've seen a city claim tiles right next to another city even if its not also next to those tiles, as long as the other city has no culture but you've had some expansion.

You are being overly sensitive imo. Its face value, no insult or anything. A real and reasonable question. I find its a smart move to get a second opinion, even experts are wrong and/or have differing opinions and I've not ever seen charmnix post before so I haven't a clue what his knowledge level is.

 

[gmaharriet]

You are being overly sensitive imo. Its face value, no insult or anything. A real and reasonable question. I find its a smart move to get a second opinion, even experts are wrong and/or have differing opinions and I've not ever seen charmnix post before so I haven't a clue what his knowledge level is.

If you need to verify a member's credentials before deciding how much value to give their advice, I suggest you take the time to browse the high scores in both the Hall of Fame and the GOTM/COTM (Game/Challenge of the Month). You'd find that Chamnix currently ranks #3 in cumulative high scores over a very long period of time and he's well-known to be among the very best players.

If you need the same verification in deciding whether or not to seem to be rude, credentials don't matter. It might be wiser to show appreciation and courtesy to any individual who takes the time to answer your questions. Maybe I'm being oversensitive, but you frequently seem to be rude and combative. JMO

 

[Tone]

Maybe I'm miss remembering but I think I've seen a city claim tiles right next to another city even if its not also next to those tiles, as long as the other city has no culture but you've had some expansion.

I'd be interested to see an example of that. Chamnix and I appear to have the same understanding of this principle and your thought appears to suggest that we are wrong.

You are being overly sensitive imo. Its face value, no insult or anything. A real and reasonable question. I find its a smart move to get a second opinion, even experts are wrong and/or have differing opinions and I've not ever seen charmnix post before so I haven't a clue what his knowledge level is.

OK, perhaps you are not trying to be rude but IMO you add comments that come across as being so.

I'll do the rest of this post via PM.

 

[TruePurple]

Well I did a test and placed a city near AI cap and only tiles next to my city I couldn't claim were next to AI city. Maybe its when you take over a enemy city in enemy domain? Otherwise I remembered wrong, must have been thinking of something else.

 

[bjfrones]

This brings up an interesting question, which bjfrones has not yet asked, so I will. Although patching his games to the most recent version would not help him with the particular map he wants to recreate, at some point it would probably be most beneficial for him to apply the patches.

My question (because I can't remember back to when I did it) is, if he wants to add patches, does he need first to upgrade vanilla to 1.29f, then PTW to 1.27f and then Conquests to 1.22? Or can he just do the Conquests upgrade alone, and will that patch the other two versions at the same time?

@bjfrones - Patching to the latest versions would get rid of any bugs in your games. Also, it would be easier for any of us to answer your questions, since we'd know the same game mechanics you're working with. Just a suggestion.

OK.
Thanks for all help, all of you.

 

[Othniel]

In the case of a tile equidistant from two civ's cities, the city with the greater culture controls the tile.

Then...

Well if AI has no culture and you have at least one expansion thats not necessarily true.

Have you got an example of that please?

Maybe I'm miss remembering but I think I've seen a city claim tiles right next to another city even if its not also next to those tiles, as long as the other city has no culture but you've had some expansion.

Chamnix and Tone are right. At first I seemed to have a recollection where what they said was not always true, but I was recollecting wrong. Here's the scenario that Chamnix referenced above that might be confusing things. TruePurple, I think your second quote above may mean that you are aware of what I'm writing, but I'll explain it out just in case...

-The AI has founded a city
-You then found a city 1 tile away from the AI city i.e. cxc
-Your new city builds culture and has an expansion

What happens is that the AI city starts out with all 8 tiles as its "Tier 1" tiles. Your city only gets part of its normal tile allotment (5 tiles, I think) because the AI had first dibs on those "contested" tiles.

However, if you build culture and expand, but the AI doesn't build culture, I think your city gains rights to the contested tiles. I wish I had a screenshot of this on hand just to make things clearer, but I don't.

I've never seen it where the cities are cxxc and you can gain rights to the AI city's "Tier-1" tiles by culture dominance.

 

[Diviner]

from my experience i would say, the two important things are cultural level and foundation time (beginning of the player's rule there to be more accurate). cities whose radius are overlapping will always decide this way.

note that 1st tier squares that are adjacent to the city square will always belong to the player and cannot be culturally conquered. there is one exception if cities built in cxc form, of course the newer city will always stand on the border. however 2nd tier squares are determined firstly by cultural level, secondly by foundation time. but i am not sure. i toyed with the following idea: if both of the cities exceed 100 cultural points the disouted tiles will always belong to the older city, so even if the newer city is level 5 he won't get more workable tile. that would explain a lot of problems about cultural expansions in borderlands.

the faraway tiles are splitted more fairly mainly by cultural level, then distance as far as i experienced.

 

[TruePurple]

I'm getting a headache. So confused. But thanks for continuing to try

Ok lets say you have two different nation cities 3 squares apart. They were founded at the same time. City A has just reached level 2 cultural expansion 100 culture. City B has been at level 2 cultural expansion for some time and has 944 culture. Does City B control the center space because it has more culture then City A? Or does it matter?

Lets say City B has a sister city belonging to the same nation, City C. City C has level 2 cultural expansion as well and is also the same distance from that space as City A & City C.

Does the space go under control of city B & C? Or does it not matter that two cities are exerting cultural pressure on the same space verses only One city for the other side, city A?