Quick Answers / 'Newbie' Questions

[Hellfiredoom]

No, it is just vanilla with the patches iirc.

This is correct. I myself play GOTY (even though I have PTW/CQ on CD), though I'm tempted to make the jump to CQ so I can keep up with all the conversations here on the site.

Thefitzman1: you can confirm this by the version # displayed in the bottom left corner of the main game screen (v1.29f = Vanilla).

 

[Hellfiredoom]

Temples normally generate 2 cpt. It is only when you are mobilized that the cpt would be halved and match what you observe here.

So, I would wager to say that you have mobilized. The thing is ... you cannot build temples (and other cultural improvements) when you are mobilized.

Aha! Makes sense. Thanks for the reply. I do indeed use MB quite a bit towards end game when storming thru enemy territory. After wiping out an AI, before resetting the MB option, I start building Temples in each newly conquered city to start the culture build. Then flip back to MB and continue on with the blood-letting.

 

[Pacioli]

What is your preferred city placement pattern for a histographic win?

 

[Spoonwood]

Once you have hospitals you want to use all the tiles you can, while having as widely spaced cities as you can. Prior to that it depends on the level of the game.

 

[Pacioli]

Does the AI get more aggressive when you are about to win a game? Or is it my imagination?

 

[vmxa]

It seems to, which would make sense. I cannot be sure as I have seen them attack with 1 town and I own all the rest of the land. IOW no chance, but then what other way is there at that point?

OTOH you can see them sit in the water and let it boil them alive, if you have good relations. No way to know for sure, unless we see the code.

 

[HistoryLines]

Hello community again,

Q5:
I play a multiplayer game against a human and some computers. Following situation. I am Persian and my opponent is American. The German has build the Pyramids. America will conquere them in maybe 20 moves. I have 16 Cavalries in Galleons on my way to ambush my friend the German and take his Pyramidcity. I want to raze it, so the american can never get his usage. BUT, and this is my question, because I hav to take the city first and can only raze after 2 turns, what will happen to my already build granaries? While I hold on the Pyramids , they are free, but when I raze the city, will all my existing granaries be gone??

sincerely

____

 

[vmxa]

No any hand built granaries will still be there and you will resume paying maint for them. Why can you not raze the place as soon as you capture it?

 

[TheOverseer714]

Having a wonder does not affect existing city improvements. Your granaries are safe. The Pyramids will provide granaries on that continent and pay upkeep on the existing ones in cities held by the owner of the pyramids.

 

[HistoryLines]

Thanks for the quick answers! Here is but another one:
_
Q6
Can someone confirm that it is a mistake to built COPERNICUS’ OBSERVATORY in a town only with a libary, without an university yet, because, even when you built the university after, it will not get count into the science doubling? I got this impression!

_
Q7
Why should I bother with money? I have science in later game always on 100%, and I only loose maybe a worker or one cheap building in one move in one city because of debt. But because it is late game and I have so many cities, it does not matter and I can rush build with deleting units nearly immediately. But the science race is far more important. Am I right?

_
Q8
In a multiplayer game, my opponent is in a Democracy and we are at war since the beginning. Why is he still able to run his Civ efficently? Even if he has all Luxuries, Cathedrals etc., shouldnt the population revolt after the war during for 2000 years with overwhelming force? And can I by just asking him for a peace treaty, he rejects me, enhance the war revolting process?

_
Q9
I want to switch to communism but I am afrait of 8 rounds anarchy. It the durance of anarchy random, or does it depend on the happiness?



Lots of questions , I know. Sorry. I am playing this long long game and I am so concerned of loosing. THX

 

[ChaosArbiter]

8: If you haven't been pressuring him, and he hasn't been pressuring you, WW won't really start hurting him. It only really kicks in when enemy units are in your land, and/or you've got units in enemy territory.

9: Religious Civs only experience 1 turn of Anarchy. Aside from that, yes it's random.

 

[TheOverseer714]

Q6. It would behoove you to build a University in your Copernicus town, but by no means does it prevent the 50% gain in research that wonder gives. AFAIK, what Copernicus does is take your existing amount of beakers and adds 50%, i.e. 20 beaker plus 10 more. The more beakers you have, the better the output. A really good "super science city" might put out as much as 700-800 beakers per turn. Old wonders tourist income, Colossus commerce boost, Copernicus and Newton, library and university, high commerce tiles, etc. makes for one.

Q7. As long as I am not losing units and buildings, I'm not overly concerned with being rich. Having money has it's pros and cons, which can be debated endlessly

Q8. Are you causing your opponent war weariness by taking their cities, bombarding their territory, keeping troops there, attacking their military units, and capturing defenseless units?
If not, they will not have unmanageable WW.

Q9. Unless you are playing a Religious tribe, Anarchy depends on a combo of chance and the size of your country. By the modern times, it will average 7 turns usually.

 

[Lord Emsworth]

Q6
Can someone confirm that it is a mistake to built COPERNICUS’ OBSERVATORY in a town only with a libary, without an university yet, because, even when you built the university after, it will not get count into the science doubling? I got this impression!

No, it is irrelevant. Scientific improvements and wonders only affect the base commerce that you devote to science. For instance if your city makes 40 commerce of which you devote 50% to research, that means that without any improvements/wonders the city will generate 20 beakers. A library would net you another 50% of the base commerce in beakers, i.e. 10 beakers in the example. The same goes for a university. The science wonders net you another 100% of that base commerce in beakers, i.e. 20 beakers here.

And as you can easily see, it does not matter if you add up 20+10+10+20 (Base+Lib+Uni+Cop) or 20+10+20+10 (Base+Lib+Cop+Uni).

Q7
Why should I bother with money? I have science in later game always on 100%, and I only loose maybe a worker or one cheap building in one move in one city because of debt. But because it is late game and I have so many cities, it does not matter and I can rush build with deleting units nearly immediately. But the science race is far more important. Am I right?

Whether you need more cash or more research will heavily depend of what you want to do. If you are playing Vanilla or PTW and if you are out for a military solution then building cheap units (in terms of shields) and upgrading them to better units is a perfect use for money. Examples are warriors to swords, horses to knights or cavalries, and cats to artilleries. Pillage resources if you must in order to be able to build the cheaper unit. In the case of artilleries you need to build the cats before you get to Replacable Parts though.

Similar holds true for C3C as well although you will always pay more for the upgrade: 3 per shield without Leo's and 1.5 with Leo's in C3C versus 2 and 1 in C3/PTW.

Q8
In a multiplayer game, my opponent is in a Democracy and we are at war since the beginning. Why is he still able to run his Civ efficently? Even if he has all Luxuries, Cathedrals etc., shouldnt the population revolt after the war during for 2000 years with overwhelming force? And can I by just asking him for a peace treaty, he rejects me, enhance the war revolting process?

For some odd reason AI democracies do not fall even if they are yet so War Weariness ridden. But yes, AI republics and democracies do suffer from WW, and heavily at times.

And in answer to the last question, no the peace negotiations that take place after the war has broken out have no bearing on the War Weariness.

Q9
I want to switch to communism but I am afrait of 8 rounds anarchy. It the durance of anarchy random, or does it depend on the happiness?

I believe the number of turns that you get is indeed random to some extent, but is also to some extent affected by the size of your empire and the difficulty level you play on (Similar to the outcomes of battles). But I am almost certain that happyness has nothing to do with it.

 

[ChaosArbiter]

but is also to some extent affected by the size of your empire and the difficulty level you play on (Similar to the outcomes of battles). But I am almost certain that happyness has nothing to do with it.

Difficulty level has no affect on battle result.

 

[Lord Emsworth]

Difficulty level has no affect on battle result.

True, and that is not what I wanted to say.

I meant to say that in the case of anarchy periods there is as well bit of randomness involved as are certain factors affecting your chances to some extent, just as it is the case in battles. But it is not the same factors; it is empire size and difficulty levels in the case of anarchy periods, and attack/defense strenght and terrain etc in the case of battles that affect the outcome. Sorry if that was unclear.

 

[HistoryLines]

Hello again, thank for all the answers to my previous questions.

The long game against my friend turns out to be probably lost. He took 11!! towns from his neighbour AI in one turn only (with workers and railroad) and will even get the pyramids before I can destroy them myself, because of the 2 turn raze delay in multiplayer games.

Anyway, I have not given up yet and have some more questions. I am not native english speaking. Tough understanding ahead.

_
Q10
Shields, gold and science are gained by the square you work on in your citiy. So it would not matter, if I have e.g. 3 really big towns over 25 or 5 a 12 population as long I work the same number of squares. It is not so, that the 13th square from a big town gets you more shields, gold or science than the 1st square of a small town, right?

_
Q11
Do modern elite units have a higher chance to get a President than say e.g. an old 5er elite phalanx?

_
Q12
I am ahead in science. The only thing I get from this is, that I can start to build wonders earlier. He might finish them with rushed-president-build nevertheless before me. I calculated "Railroad" through and noticed that I have to spent 2880 science and he, as the 2nd, will only have to spent 2057 on "Railroad" to invent it. We play level prince with 4 Ai`s left.
Nevermind that, he told me he is doing the following:
Raising money with Zero % science and putting entertainers to scientists, so he researches for a while just one step a turn. Then putting science up to 90 or 100% and researches until the accumulated money is empty. He will gain from this the "free" research from scientists. It this true?

_
Q13
When I right-click the unhappy workers in my cities I get always the reason, why they are unhappy. They tell me 33% against the war and 66%, because the city is overpopulated?? What does overpopulated mean? 12er town without hospital maybe?

_
Q14
My opponent is in a democracy and has J.Bach Wonder (+2), 8 luxury with markets (+20!), temples (+1) and cathedrals (+3) and coloseums (+2) everywhere, so he gets +28 happy faces in total. Does that mean until his cities grow over 28 he will never ever get even one unhappy face, despite our war??

_
Q15
I had build the Newton wonder in my Copernicus wonder city. Before that I got 60 science output by constant science per centage. Afterwards only 82! So I gained only 22 science?? Does the Newton only doubles the library and universities effects, not the total one with the Copenicus??



THX. I will post a graphic of our game next time, to ask some strategic questions ;-)
We are playing Civ3 1.21f. Sincerely your HistoryLines

 

[CKS]

Q11: All elite units have the same chance of generating a leader. Modern units are not better at it than outdated ones, except for the increased chances of winning a battle because of increased attack or defense strength.

Q12: As other civs learn a tech, it becomes easier for you to learn it, so your friend needs fewer beakers to research a tech since you already know it. His method of researching can work well if he researches an entire tech with a single scientist and then researches others as fast as possible. If he doesn't research an entire tech, though, then it doesn't get techs for fewer beakers. If he does research an entire tech, though, it will take 50 turns, and in the games I play, this is unacceptably long (except possibly in the ancient age).

Q13: Each city gets a certain number of content citizens (how many depends on level - at regent I think it is two, but it might be 3). Any other citizens are unhappy because of overcrowding. (It has nothing to do with the presence of aquaducts or hospitals.)

Q14: No, if your opponent has +28 happy/content faces, it just means that he can balance out 28 unhappy faces worth of unhappiness. You can have much more unhappiness than the number of citizens you have in a town, which is very peculiar. A town with 7 citizens could have 5 unhappy faces from being size 7, 8 unhappy faces from drafting, and 21 unhappy faces from war weariness (if you are getting war weariness from several different foes). However, 28 happy faces is quite a lot, so managing unhappiness should be pretty easy for him.

Q15: Both Newton and Copernicus only double the base science output. They don't even double the output from libraries, universities, or research labs. You want all of these in your big commerce city, but if you have two cities with the same commerce, there is no advantage to having Newton and Copernicus in the same city.

 

[vmxa]

HistoryLines
"Q10
Shields, gold and science are gained by the square you work on in your citiy. So it would not matter, if I have e.g. 3 really big towns over 25 or 5 a 12 population as long I work the same number of squares. It is not so, that the 13th square from a big town gets you more shields, gold or science than the 1st square of a small town, right?"

3 metros of 25 each is 75 pop. You would need 7 cities to get 75 pop. 6x12=72.
The three metros can only work 21 tiles, while the 75 pop, 7 cities could work 75 tiles.
I did not check to see if the support is the same, but likely the 7 cities provide more unit support.

This does not take into account the large factor that you cannot get more than 3 units out of those metros in a single turn, while the 7 cities, could make 7 units.

"Q11
Do modern elite units have a higher chance to get a President than say e.g. an old 5er elite phalanx?"

The odds will be the same for both in a single battle. The difference is that the modern unit, if it was a blitz unit, could attack more than once in a turn and hence have more chances for a leader. It also has a greater change to win the battle.

"Q12
I am ahead in science. The only thing I get from this is, that I can start to build wonders earlier. He might finish them with rushed-president-build nevertheless before me. I calculated "Railroad" through and noticed that I have to spent 2880 science and he, as the 2nd, will only have to spent 2057 on "Railroad" to invent it. We play level prince with 4 Ai`s left.
Nevermind that, he told me he is doing the following:
Raising money with Zero % science and putting entertainers to scientists, so he researches for a while just one step a turn. Then putting science up to 90 or 100% and researches until the accumulated money is empty. He will gain from this the "free" research from scientists. It this true?"

Not sure why he would have entertainers at all. A citizen can be either a joker, taxman or a scientist. If a taxman they make 3 beakers in C3C. (Prince is not a level in civ III, so I am not sure if this is II or IV or what).

A taxman makes 2 gold, all net for both types. So you would have to look at the towns to see what multipliers they have for science. It could be that running taxmen for a bit and then using deficit research would payoff.

I would suspect that it is better to just use scientist, till you get enough beakers to switch. This is due to the likelyhood that one has not make lib/universities in all towns.

"Q13
When I right-click the unhappy workers in my cities I get always the reason, why they are unhappy. They tell me 33% against the war and 66%, because the city is overpopulated?? What does overpopulated mean? 12er town without hospital maybe?"

It just means they want to grow the place to the next bump, be it a city or a metro.

"Q14
My opponent is in a democracy and has J.Bach Wonder (+2), 8 luxury with markets (+20!), temples (+1) and cathedrals (+3) and coloseums (+2) everywhere, so he gets +28 happy faces in total. Does that mean until his cities grow over 28 he will never ever get even one unhappy face, despite our war??"

Maybe, not just due to the lux, but at size 21 the new pop will be free to be specialist.
The level impacts how many happy improvement needed to stay happy during war.

If he built all that in all towns, either you were very slow to get aggressive or I am not sure what. That should have cost him his head making all those structures.

"Q15
I had build the Newton wonder in my Copernicus wonder city. Before that I got 60 science output by constant science per centage. Afterwards only 82! So I gained only 22 science?? Does the Newton only doubles the library and universities effects, not the total one with the Copenicus??"

It does not double any of those structures. It is base on your base beaker count. Multipliers are done on the base gold or beakers. I should say net base. You get nothing for corrupt shields.

 

[vmxa]

THX. I will post a graphic of our game next time, to ask some strategic questions ;-)
We are playing Civ3 1.21f. Sincerely your HistoryLines

I am confused for sure. IIRC Civ III at any patch levle, did not support MP play. That came in with PTW and it was flaking. That was the last time I played against humans.

Conquest improved the MP play. I am quessing you are palying PTW at 1.21F, which does have MP.

 

[Lord Emsworth]

Hello again, thank for all the answers to my previous questions.

The long game against my friend turns out to be probably lost. He took 11!! towns from his neighbour AI in one turn only (with workers and railroad) and will even get the pyramids before I can destroy them myself, because of the 2 turn raze delay in multiplayer games.

Anyway, I have not given up yet and have some more questions. I am not native english speaking. Tough understanding ahead.

_
Q10
Shields, gold and science are gained by the square you work on in your citiy. So it would not matter, if I have e.g. 3 really big towns over 25 or 5 a 12 population as long I work the same number of squares. It is not so, that the 13th square from a big town gets you more shields, gold or science than the 1st square of a small town, right?

The center tile of a metro gets additional gold and shields, but I am not quite sure if that goes for all traits or just industrious and commercial. (Or if there is a difference at all; I don't get to see metros all that often.)

For the rest there is no difference. Rank corruption may be an issue, but if you play Vanilla or PTW you can get around it by using ring city placement.

Do modern elite units have a higher chance to get a President than say e.g. an old 5er elite phalanx?

A leader? No. The only thing that makes a difference is the Heroic Epic, a small wonder that you can build if an army of yours has won a battle.

I am ahead in science. The only thing I get from this is, that I can start to build wonders earlier. He might finish them with rushed-president-build nevertheless before me. I calculated "Railroad" through and noticed that I have to spent 2880 science and he, as the 2nd, will only have to spent 2057 on "Railroad" to invent it. We play level prince with 4 Ai`s left.
Nevermind that, he told me he is doing the following:
Raising money with Zero % science and putting entertainers to scientists, so he researches for a while just one step a turn. Then putting science up to 90 or 100% and researches until the accumulated money is empty. He will gain from this the "free" research from scientists. It this true?

If I understand you correctly, then I don't think this is true. You have to either invest 40 turns of nominal research (50 in C3C) in your tech or provide the full amount of necessary beakers.

When I right-click the unhappy workers in my cities I get always the reason, why they are unhappy. They tell me 33% against the war and 66%, because the city is overpopulated?? What does overpopulated mean? 12er town without hospital maybe?

That is just the normal unhappyness that kicks in after the 4th, 3rd, 2nd or 1st citizen depending on your level. Regent (what you mistakenly call prince, I think) and Monarch get two citizens born content.

A hospital will not help you. Rather to the contrary if you let your city grow past size 12.

My opponent is in a democracy and has J.Bach Wonder (+2), 8 luxury with markets (+20!), temples (+1) and cathedrals (+3) and coloseums (+2) everywhere, so he gets +28 happy faces in total. Does that mean until his cities grow over 28 he will never ever get even one unhappy face, despite our war??

He should get 30 happy/content faces. You need to factor in those two citizens which are born content (see above).

And the meaning of those faces is ... Well, think of it like this. Every laborer (specialist are of no concern) is unhappy. Now the content faces can turn unhappy laborers into content laborers, while the happy faces can turn either unhappy laborers into content or content into happy laborers.

Your opponent has 10 content faces and 20 happy faces. (The happy faces are from the luxes, the rest provides content faces.) That would suffice to make everybody in a city up to size 15 happy. Beyond that, laborers will be unhappy again; with the maximum amount of laborers (20) there would be, with a setup like this, 15 happy and 5 unhappy.



Now, war happyness/wearyness is calculated from the total size of a city. The first level of WW in the Republic will generate a quarter of an unhappy face for every population point (here the specialist do matter). The first level of WW in Democracy generates half an unhappy face for every population point. Then you need to add them up, and round down to the next integer.

For a city of size 20 this would mean 5 unhappy faces for a republic, and 10 for a Democracy on the first level of WW. The same numbers go for a size 21 city as well, due to the rounding.


Now we _could_ do the math for when your opponent - with only the above mentioned sources of happyness will start to feel the effects of a first level WW.

I had build the Newton wonder in my Copernicus wonder city. Before that I got 60 science output by constant science per centage. Afterwards only 82! So I gained only 22 science?? Does the Newton only doubles the library and universities effects, not the total one with the Copenicus??

No, it should only provide an additional 100% of the base commerce that you put towards research.

I can't seem to get the numbers to work exaclty however:

22 base beakers
+ 11 from lib
+ 11 from uni
+ 22 from Cope's
+ 22 from Newtons
==> 88 beakers

21 base beakers:
+ 10 from lib (rounding)
+ 10 from uni (rounding)
+ 21 from Cope's
+ 21 from Newton's
==> 83 beakers

What you have gotten is quite close to what you should have gotten, but even a close miss is still a miss.

Maybe it has got something to do with corruption ...