Quick Questions , Quick Answers

[Somebody613]

One more question, because I'm confused.
How do you enable Quality changing?
Is it an option or is it a tech requirement?
The Promotions file simply states that it needs a level and nothing beyond that, but it doesn't look like that in-game.
I literally made a unit with ONE MILLION XP, and yet it couldn't Quality Up no matter what (I'm in Classical now, if that is the problem).
And it's not at the top Quality either - it simply ignores that function altogether.
This applies both to normal units and to heroes.
And, of course, I do remember it working in the past, but I don't remember any specifics, dammit.
So?

 

[raxo2222]

Quality Up is related to Size Matters.
Each Quality Up level is unlocked by lifestyle tech.

 

[Somebody613]

Quality Up is related to Size Matters.
Each Quality Up level is unlocked by lifestyle tech.

You sure you mean Quality, not Size?
Because what you said is clearly about Size (combining 3-into-1, the available max of which does increase with Eras).
Quality is a different thing and has a separate line of Promotions.
It was way too long ago, so I don't recall whether it applied to Heroes, but it definitely applied to common units, which now it doesn't.
Or I need to turn some Option ON, which is exactly my question.
I really don't think I need to go as far as Industrial (or more) to be able to Quality UP, really.
Or maybe I do, but it means my previous games were much longer - and that is a bit hard to believe, knowing me and the mod in question.
And anyways, this condition is mentioned in SIZE promotions, not QUALITY.
So I think you are mistaken here - though it doesn't help ME, damn.

 

[raxo2222]

You sure you mean Quality, not Size?
Because what you said is clearly about Size (combining 3-into-1, the available max of which does increase with Eras).
Quality is a different thing and has a separate line of Promotions.
It was way too long ago, so I don't recall whether it applied to Heroes, but it definitely applied to common units, which now it doesn't.
Or I need to turn some Option ON, which is exactly my question.
I really don't think I need to go as far as Industrial (or more) to be able to Quality UP, really.
Or maybe I do, but it means my previous games were much longer - and that is a bit hard to believe, knowing me and the mod in question.
And anyways, this condition is mentioned in SIZE promotions, not QUALITY.
So I think you are mistaken here - though it doesn't help ME, damn.

Both size and quality are unlocked like this.
I think other promotions may be unlocked like that too.
Look at lifestyle techs

 

[Somebody613]

Both size and quality are unlocked like this.
I think other promotions may be unlocked like that too.
Look at lifestyle techs

Where?
The Tech FILE literally says nothing about anything like this.
And the Promotions FILE only ties Quality to SIZE_MATTERS, which is also where the other stuff is, and it works right now.
But Quality doesn't.
Or it's too tricky to stumble upon, damn.
I'll try playing some more, but it doesn't seem to be the problem.

 

[raxo2222]

Where?
The Tech FILE literally says nothing about anything like this.
And the Promotions FILE only ties Quality to SIZE_MATTERS, which is also where the other stuff is, and it works right now.
But Quality doesn't.
Or it's too tricky to stumble upon, damn.
I'll try playing some more, but it doesn't seem to be the problem.

Look at ingame tech tree....

 

[Somebody613]

Look at ingame tech tree....

Can you show me a screenshot, because not only I can't see anything like this, but you might be missing some crucial "small" detail that is the problem in my build?
In MY game, it doesn't even mention Quality in ANY Tech, and the FILES don't point at any additional requirements either.
So it's really weird.

 

[raxo2222]

Can you show me a screenshot, because not only I can't see anything like this, but you might be missing some crucial "small" detail that is the problem in my build?
In MY game, it doesn't even mention Quality in ANY Tech, and the FILES don't point at any additional requirements either.
So it's really weird.

I guess you are playing without size matters.

 

[Somebody613]

I guess you are playing without size matters.

NO.
I have Sizes (and can combine/split units), I have even Quality WRITTEN on the units.
I just don't have access to Quality PROMOTIONS for some inexplainable reason.
Can you PLEASE show me a few screenshots of what YOU mean specifically?

 

[Thunderbrd]

To clear this up, if you have more exp that would allow you to select a promotion beyond just one, quality ups are taken off the list of selections because to quality up would erase all that excess exp. It only allows itself to be selected if it's the final promotion selection you can make. This is not to protect against WB manipulations, but rather to keep a player with a ton of retrains from killing off most of what he should be able to put on the unit by incidentally prematurely selecting a quality up and cutting off access to the rest of his selections to come.

 

[Somebody613]

To clear this up, if you have more exp that would allow you to select a promotion beyond just one, quality ups are taken off the list of selections because to quality up would erase all that excess exp. It only allows itself to be selected if it's the final promotion selection you can make. This is not to protect against WB manipulations, but rather to keep a player with a ton of retrains from killing off most of what he should be able to put on the unit by incidentally prematurely selecting a quality up and cutting off access to the rest of his selections to come.

I have normal (quite trained) units as well, though I haven't checked the level requirements (easily done, though).
If that is true, how do I remove this limitation (just asking, it's avoidable when I *know* about it)?
And I also somehow feel that this edition (definitely wasn't like that long ago) could have something to do with my own complaining about exactly that problem, loool.
Would be rather funny, ya know.
Gonna check it soon.
Thanks.

 

[Thunderbrd]

If that is true, how do I remove this limitation (just asking, it's avoidable when I *know* about it)?

It's hard coded and probably a bit complicated so - you'd have to change the C++ and compile a new dll.

And I also somehow feel that this edition (definitely wasn't like that long ago) could have something to do with my own complaining about exactly that problem, loool.

No, it was in place from around when I created the Quality Up promos - I saw the potential for a problem early in that it erases all XP on the unit when you take the promo.

 

[cobbaut]

Two things I noticed...

1. Ice on hill is not visible on the map ?

It took me a while to figure out why the unit could not access this hill. It looks plain, but it is ice...

2. Only one settler for each AI on Nightmare start ?

I seem to remember that in my previous Nightmare game every AI got two settlers to start with. I could be wrong... This game (started with SVN from 6th January 2021) gave every AI only one settler (Pop 50 for everyone for a long time).

Did I miss a certain option for this ?

cheers,
paul

 

[Toffer90]

1. Ice on hill is not visible on the map ?

Ice is a water feature, and was never designed to be on land.

2. Only one settler for each AI on Nightmare start ?

They start with 2 settlers on latest, and I haven't seen anyone tinker with it in recent versions.

Could be they just haven't settled the second city yet, how many turn in are you?

 

[cobbaut]

Ice is a water feature, and was never designed to be on land.
They start with 2 settlers on latest, and I haven't seen anyone tinker with it in recent versions.

Could be they just haven't settled the second city yet, how many turn in are you?

Even after 780 turns they still have only one city. (I saved turn 0 of this game.)
About the Ice on land, I will look for the name of the map script I used later today.

 

[cobbaut]

Ice on land: The C2C_SmartMap created that plot.

One settler for AI on Nightmare:
I just tested (twice) starting a custom game on Nightmare and each AI only gets one settler unit (verified in World Builder on turn 1 and turn 3). SVN from yesterday.
Could it be one of these settings?:

 

[Toffer90]

One city challenge is the reason.

 

[Somebody613]

It's hard coded and probably a bit complicated so - you'd have to change the C++ and compile a new dll.

No, it was in place from around when I created the Quality Up promos - I saw the potential for a problem early in that it erases all XP on the unit when you take the promo.

I've built a few normal units with high XP, yet they also can't Quality Up no matter what, despite technically being eligible on all counts.
So it's something about Options, not the feature itself.
Is any other Option affecting (or relying on) Size_Matters in ANY way?
Or are you SURE that Quality Up isn't hardwired (through procedural code, not defines) to rely on another promotion, and thus I don't see it because of that?
This is really BUGGY, if you ask me.

 

[cobbaut]

One city challenge is the reason.

OMG I am stupid!

 

[Somebody613]

One city challenge is the reason.

Unrelated, but I just realized that this might be THE reason why my one_civ one_city barb_civ map suddenly got populated with a ton of minor civs, lol.
Barbs are building new cities, but those cities are viewed as "over the limit", so they switch to another civ.
And minor civs are still not fully developed, so this clearly utilizes some "cheat bug" somewhere in there.
LOL, this is GREAT - I LIKE IT!