Race Wars 1: Nordic Sagas

[alerum68]

Alerum
Bede
JB <== Is up
SmellinCoffee <== On deck
Sir Bugsy

Sound good?

As for the use of the armies, I didn't want to pillage to much because we were taking units at such a fast rate, I figured it would be our improvements soon enough anyway. Mainly used them to cut the road between us and them to give killing zones.

I don't know how many horseman we have.

 

[jb1964]

Only have done a pre-flight so far. Will play tonight.

Just finished up my turn on two other SG's.

 

[jb1964]

The amphibious assault is huge at this stage, plus you can get counter attacked if you are sitting in a boat.

I assume you mean to say that you can't get counter attacked sitting in a boat?

What is the threat on the water? Loosing a galley, or two, of Zerks would ruin my whole day.

 

[Sir Bugsy]

Brother Bede is correct as always. We need to keep the Zerk window open as long as possible. The slower the research the better for us. We'll be walking a fine line between keeping the research slow and staying caught up. I'd say min or no research to save money for purchases would be best. I would also minimize technology sales.

 

[jb1964]

OK, I'm on board with the slow tech approach. I'll sell what I can sell to Cleo or see if I can use it coax her into a war with a secondary target.

Peace w/ Japan for the two cities is fine but taking the last one shouldn't be a chore. Either way we need a new set of necks for our Zerks.

Suggestions?

Egypt - Can't fight herself
Arab - ?
Aztecs - ?
Celts - ?
Cathage - Seems like a good choice since they share the land mass.
Japanese - Done that
American - Done that also

 

[Sir Bugsy]

Forgive a new guy any mistakes here, but why don't we want to lop off Egyptian heads next?
1. This will slow down their research.
2. They have a lot of coastal cities that will make wonderful targets for our zerks.
3. Carthage doesn't have as many coastal cities and when we did go to war with Cleo we would have two fronts to fight.

 

[jb1964]

We were interested in keeping Cleo around as a research partner, however, if we're more interested in keeping the pace of research slow, and she's the leader, then you have a good point.

The war with Cathage was one we would start but only observe.

Let's think this one more level down. We want to slow research to keep the Zerk advantage. That is, avoid the production of muskets, rifles, infantry, etc. If we drag Cleo into supporting a war effort then another civ will soon take her place as leader. Do we want to start a global war to send everyone down a rathole?

 

[alerum68]

We do run into the problem if going to war with the world, and the war coming to us at 1 time. No, our best bet is to find our strongest oppoent, and take them down to next, then go to the next strongest, until we claim the world... no unit can match our zerks, so only sheer numbers will overwhelm us... we don't seem to have anyone with larger numbers then we have, so we don't have much worries... the only reason I'd see for not taking on Egypt quiet yet is to ensure our core can keep producing units to take over the world instead of having to defend the motherland.

 

[Smellincoffee]

We attack with Beserks and we won't need to worry about defense. The AI will be too busy trying to duck.

 

[alerum68]

That's true to a point, but since the AI can only do land based assults with any chance of claiming a city, and never will launch a good beach head landing, I suggest we save Egypt for last, maybe having her for an Ally until the very end... Egypt and the Norse taking on the world until it's just them left... of course, we all know how this will end...

 

[jb1964]

OK, I'll finish off the Japanese and then we can line up for the next bigest kid on the block. In the mean time I'll try and find a way to get Cleo to empty her coffers.

 

[alerum68]

try and see if you can trade a luxury for GPT. GPT will slow her research rate while taking her gold will only prevent her from upgrading units.

 

[Smellincoffee]

Can't we just start one little war with Cleo? Get Odense back?

 

[Bede]

I learned something in GOTM32 that may be of value here.

Thinking to slow down the research pace on the other continent I sold the next biggest kid on the block one each of all my luxes (I was only missing two, I think) for something in the neighborhood of 400gpt. With the added luxuries the cities became so productive, that the tech pace actually increased from one every 12 or so to one every six and the other nation was earning over 100gpt. So I ended up using the added income to finance technology theft, not the safest thing to do with a local neighbor!!, but in this case the counter party was on the other side of the world. I spent the next 20 turns running my research pace as fast as possible down the side of the tree not being worked by the other guys, and when the time came and the lux deals expired, sold my tech and a resource instead for all the treasury and about half the gpt. The other nation's economy collapsed in a heap, the tech pace slowed to a crawl and the other guy's gpt never got above 10 for the next 20 turns. So, the conclusion is, if you want to slow the pace, sell resources not luxes. The AI will use the resources to build military, especially if they are at war, thereby costing them more gpt rather than generating it...

I am also coming more and more to Bugsy's way of thinking here. Take Egpyt's caostal towns, wreck her access to trade and resources, make her a client state, only able to trade with us. Then move on the other parts of the world.

Sorry to keep changing my focus here, but my 4 mile daily walk gives me lots of time to ponder alternatives. I think it was Harry Truman who wished all economists were born one handed for then they would never be able to say "On the other hand.....

 

[jb1964]

Pre turn, Turn 190, 750 AD – Thinking of changing Heroic Epic to a worker. We have deals coming out the wazoo w/ Cleo so I’ll let the next player take her cities off her hands. Only trade to Cleo is Gunpowder and that’s not going to happen. She’s already crossing swords w/ the Celts so her hands are plenty full. Hmmmm, Aztecs and the Carthaginians have plenty of tasty looking coastal cities. Can’t find the other Japanese cities but making peace w/ them means breaking a deal w/ Cleo. That’s not going to happen either.

Top cities are making Sun Tzu’s and Heroic Epic. The next dozen or so are pumping Zerks. The rest are working on infrastructure and workers. Looks good to me.

Our forces are strong compared to all others. Our people appear quite happy.

1, Turn 191, 710 AD – A few Japanese cities riot and I toss them a clown. Thinking about going after Hannibal. I don’t like the way he looks. I declare on Carthage. My first attack results in two dead Zerks with zero kills. I feel ill.

Egypt signed a peace treaty w/ Japan breaking our argreement.

2,3,4, Turns 192-4, 770-790 AD – Fight, build, etc. Former Japanese cities not fairing too well with our occupation. We take Hakodate from Japan and 4 Cartheginian cities. HE is built in Bergen and I switch over to more zerk production.

5, Turn 195, 800 AD – Both Cleo and Brennus would like our help in slaughtering each other. I decline. Cleo will give us big bucks for Chemistry but I decline in the name of slow research. Arabia must have SoZ because I see a number of AC running about. We might consider how to kill off a civ w/ mounted units.

Science still at minimum. No other civ has a tech to trade us other than Republic.

Taking a break for the night.

Input more than welcome.

 

[alerum68]

Best way to take out fast movers is to set it up so they move into mountians, hills, jungles... something that will bog them down enough for us to wipe them out, 1 on 1. There is no other trick. Egypt broke the deal? We should make peace with Japan now, so we can concentrate on Carthage.

 

[jb1964]

I’m at work right now. Will take turns 6-10 tonight.

I can't even see the other two Japanese cities so they're getting zero attention. I imagine I'll run into them as I press into Carthaginian territory with the armies. Hakadote was fortified with a single spear so I'm not expecting much resistance, which is futile (note Borg cube).

We’re at turn 176 in an Emperor game. We have the strongest army, parity or a slight lead in tech, and a modest sum in the bank. A month ago I would have never thought I could have been a part, however slight, of such a feat. Well done team.

 

[jb1964]

Turns 6 through 10.

Well, Cleo got out of the war w/ Brennus and a turn later declared war on the Aztecs. I wonder what it is she’s trying to accomplish. (I later find that both sides in this war are without iron. See trade comments below)

The Arabs are not at war with anyone but are moving a serious amount of units in the North. I accidentally left Cadiz undefended and there are 7 Arab units within our boarders. I guess with or without defense they could take it if they wish.

Our military is still strong compared to all.

We’re without saltpeter but there’s some just North of Theveste in Carthaginian territory. And scanning the open territory near our new cities there does not seem to be any that can be colonized. The Egyptians and Aztecs both have an excess saltpeter. One of Cleo’s is next to Nara.

I made peace with Japan getting Ise and Republic in the exchange. The last Jananese city is just South of Ise, North of the Egyptian territory.

Both Leo’s and Sistine are being worked. Sun Tzu’s is being worked by just about everyone.

Abu will buy an excess wine for 5gpt.

Hmmmm, Aztecs will trade saltpeter for Iron straight up. If I give him iron then he can beat up Cleo more effectively. Let see what other deals are out there and come back to this one. The Celts are of no value. Goodness, Cleo does not have iron either and will give us saltpeter and 18gpt. If we claim our own saltpeter, which is not a problem then Cleo will come up to 20gpt. There is an iron East of Leptis Minor that can be claimed so we can sell to both sides.

We are leading in population and land owned. We’re sucking wind in culture. We’re leading in the overall world ranking, 958 to the second place Arabs at 906.

The save, 850 AD

 

[alerum68]

Looking good JB. Just keep bringing the axe to the farmer...

roster:
Alerum
Bede
JB <== Just played
SmellinCoffee <== Is up
Sir Bugsy <== On Deck

 

[Bede]

I really like the idea of selling iron to the Celts and the Egyptians and wouldn't buy saltpeter from anybody if there is a handy source, even if not connected. As long as Cleo stays at war with somebody else she'll be spending her gold on troops and logistics and not on science...

Might want to do a little investigation of the Arabs, just to find out what they are up to and what they have. (Clean the map of everything but borders and improvements, then scroll carefuly through it noting things like resource locations).

On the usefulness of culture in this game...I think it was Dorothy Parker who said, "You can lead a whore to culture but you can't make her think", and we have bigger axes.