"Random Personality" worth 1-2 difficulty levels

[noto2]

So a few months ago I decided to start playing with the "random personality" box checked because I thought it would make the game more interesting and less predictable. I also started playing with Kmod at the exact same time. I was an emperor player and then got completely demolished on Prince. I attributed the enormous increase in difficulty to Kmod (which is very true). But then, after losing many many many prince games in a row to the exact same situation, being dogpiled, it occurred to me that I had given myself a double-wammy. Not only is Kmod harder, but random personalities makes the game much harder. Game after game I would carefully choose which civ to ally based on many factors, only to be backstabbed over and over again. If random personalities was not checked, I would know obviously Ghandi would never betray me, for example. With the setting checked I never know who is who, really. Does anyone else play with this setting? I checked it to make the game more challenging and interesting and boy, got more than I bargained for! I think it really does make the game a LOT more difficult...diplomacy is very difficult now.

 

[Thedrin]

I don't think I've ever played a game without random personalities so I'm unable to say how much more difficult that setting makes the game, but I have to view every AI I meet as a threat.

 

[Kesshi]

I think it's KMod making the game harder. The AI is much less dumb (I'm reluctant to say "smarter") on KMod. When I swapped to KMod, I dropped down a level or two, and still haven't fully adjusted to it, yet.

Typically random personalities makes the game easier since it has a chance to match up personalities to attributes that don't do well with it. For example, Monte and Shaka are both aggressive in personality and attributes, however, give someone Ramesses' traits and Monty's or Shaka's personality, and they'll just starve themselves out of gold building units that aren't strong enough to do anything with. Or consider someone with Boudica's traits but Ghandi's or Mansa Musa's personality.

I will acknowledge that a difficulty increase may incur due to Random Personalities in the way that you don't always know who will plot at pleased and who will declare at cautious. (Or even who will plot at friendly.)

 

[rah]

But you do get a lot of indications from looking at the diplo number vs attitude.
While you might not be able to nail down the exact, you can get pretty close.

 

[Thedrin]

How deep into the game are you before you can do that?

 

[rah]

Heck, not that far in for quite a few, usually the extremes on either end. When a civ won't open borders with you before you have religion, it isn't hard to figure out. Or those that are pleased at as low as +3.

 

[joanne]

I play almost exclusively single player offline; I play standard size normal speed, however I set random personalities on along with huts+events for fun roleplaying

Like rah said, diplo attitude is a pretty good indicator, and those with extreme tendencies or unique quirks are the easiest to ID: if someone won't open borders below pleased you know it's probably Toku; if they're still willing to trade techs even though everyone else is in wfyabta it's most certainly Mansa; if they can be bribed to DoW on someone they're friendly with it's likely Cathy. Possible favorite civics are another factor, but it's more of a hit-or-miss affair

 

[noto2]

I try not to bother figuring out who is who though, otherwise what's the point. To the person who said it makes the game easier I disagree. Whether it's Monty or ghandi doing nothing but invading you with wave after wave of units itwill really bog you down. At least on standard settings you could anticipate Monty s move
With random personalities sure ghandis melee units don't get that second promotion but you won't have anticipated the attack

 

[Seraiel]

Random personalities is only more difficult, if you don't know the AIs well. I'd bet that I'd be able to guess every type of AI correctly some years after I've met them, the only thing that would add to my excitement which is hard to guess, is, can that AI plot at pleased, anyhow, chances to be dowed at pleased are so low already, and I think the last time I got DoWed is more than the quarter of a year ago already.
Random personalities is never 1 or even 2 difficulties, that would mean the difference between Emperor (cakewalk) and Deity (work) . It's a little more difficult, agree on that, as unrestricted leaders i. e. is easier, but it's not even as difficult as Raging Barbs on Marathon non-Archipel.

K-Mod is harder, I've heard that often already, regrettably there is no K-Mod HoF, so I see no sense for me in playing it.

 

[noto2]

yeah, point taken. Random personalities is probably worth .25 or .5 of a difficulty level. Kmod, on the other hand, is easily worth 1-2 levels, so combining the two makes the game close to 2 levels more difficult

 

[King Kalmah]

Random personalities is only more difficult,

I agree...

Random personalities is never 1 or even 2 difficulties, that would mean the difference between Emperor (cakewalk) and Deity (work) .

Says the guy who only plays three gold or more starts,,,but anyway the difference is basically what Noto said

.here listen to this...

If you can't predict who your enemy is and then you ally with Gandhi who has the personality of Cathy. You don't know he is going to back stab you and you leave your border lands with one warrior each and then whap Gandhi strikes and you are caught not only off guard,but you maybe acting with your main force on another side of you continent.While you race back Gandhi takes three or more cities...

K-Mod is harder, I've heard that often already, regrettably there is no K-Mod HoF, so I see no sense for me in playing it.

The point of mods is to increase realism or too add difficulty or to add new elements to the game.

I will play the K-mod one day to try out a new level in AI realism and intelligence and to see what the Developers would have given us if they have the time...

 

[Seraiel]

@ King Kalmah: You don't seem to understand, that playing for HoF means playing against other players / the map of other players. In addition, you also didn't recognize, that not all of my games had 3+ gold-starts, don't have the time to look right now, but I know that Replay #1 had 2 Lux as did Replay #5, Replay #3 had no Food. I'd say, my starts are at most HoF standard, I'm sure HoF players would agree that 2 Lux is definately below standards.

But listen to this: How shall your Ghandi backstab me, if I have a peace-treaty with him? Also, how shall he backstab me, when he's already in war with someone else? At last, do you really think I would not notice that I can bribe someone against Civs he's friendly with (one can see that! ) and then leave my borders undefended and let myself get caught of guard?

Sera

 

[Manco Capac]

Random personalities is never 1 or even 2 difficulties, that would mean the difference between Emperor (cakewalk) and Deity (work) .

There is an untruth here. Between Noble and monarch, we can consider a bump of one difficulty, but between EMP and IMM or IMM to deity means more value in the bump. Like twice (for instance) the harshness from noble to monarch.

Random personality is the factor that kills early game deterministic diplomacy given the hidden nature of the AI. But given one AI has another AI personality (indeed, it is not a true random values in the personalities), as time goes, and with help of experience (or sheets of info), you unravel the true face of the AI.

Favorite civics, religion loves or hatreds limits, behaviours, etc. help throughout the game to determine the real AI.

 

[Seraiel]

Hmm. What is early game diplomacy? It's whipping your cities down so they're smaller than the ones of others, it's not using overlap extensively so you're unattractive, once one has got Alpha, one can get every AI to pleased and bribe everyone against everyone. It's more a gamble and grind than that it actually has to do with manipulating and exploiting certain specifics.

About the difficulty lvls as such I don't know, I played exactly 1 round on Settler, 1 on Noble, 2 on Prince, 1 on Emperor, half a round on IMM and rest was Deity, so I have little experience. From what I've read, I would neither say that random personalities is Noble to Monarch (Warriors against Archers!) or even EMP to Deity (as said, fun against work) .

It'll get a lot easier for all of you in the future, as I may announce: Between 10 and 20 players are atm. working on a Strategy Guide explaining AIs and their behaviour, and it's short before going online, so better watch out .

 

[SamSniped]

If it adds 2 levels, then I play on Prince

 

[Mylene]

You cannot really compare all this..on normal deity games for example (try one without a gold mine on normal speed..) diplo can be much smaller things than "bribing everyone in".
Comparing difficulty levels with random personalities is somewhat silly, but they make it harder for sure.
Simply cos you may need some defenses, which can really slow you down.

 

[Seraiel]

You cannot really compare all this..on normal deity games for example (try one without a gold mine on normal speed..) diplo can be much smaller things than "bribing everyone in".
Comparing difficulty levels with random personalities is somewhat silly, but they make it harder for sure.
Simply cos you may need some defenses, which can really slow you down.

Give examples.

 

[GKey]

You cannot really compare all this..on normal deity games for example (try one without a gold mine on normal speed..) diplo can be much smaller things than "bribing everyone in".
Comparing difficulty levels with random personalities is somewhat silly, but they make it harder for sure.
Simply cos you may need some defenses, which can really slow you down.

Yep, in average Normal speed Deity game player will not have techs to bribe AI's on each other. Diplomacy will not help much there, player will struggle to catch up techtrade train and might be even forced to switch into spy economy at some point.
There is a reason why Obsolete and others, who can win Deity/Normal consistently earned so much respect on these forums.

 

[Mylene]

Give examples.

For example there is no guarantee you get enuf techs on average >>> difficult starts?
You struggle getting anything ahead of Deity AIs in early stages?
You are glad if you can get someone to pleased with small stuffs like ressource gifts, open borders, religion (oh yep SPI shines here..) ?
You know, it's somewhat pointless if you dun experience what real Deity "pressure" means, i can bribe everyone with 3 gold mines and argue "just do this and that".

 

[King Kalmah]

For example there is no guarantee you get enuf techs on average >>> difficult starts?
You struggle getting anything ahead of Deity AIs in early stages?
You are glad if you can get someone to pleased with small stuffs like ressource gifts, open borders, religion (oh yep SPI shines here..) ?
You know, it's somewhat pointless if you dun experience what real Deity "pressure" means, i can bribe everyone with 3 gold mines and argue "just do this and that".

Being a marathon player I can atest to the fact that Normal speed is 3 times faster then what Marathon is...So yes if you have no gold,less tech and have no religion...plus factor in the random personalities...what is to be done?