Rat 10 - Revenge of the warmongers

[Greebley]

You can sort the threads by who created them (click on that title). This is the easiest way to see all threads started by a given person. Note that 1-8 are civ3 games and are in the civ3 succession game forum.

This is game 9 - We lost

Glad you are enjoying reading the game.

 

[goraemon]

OK I see it, won't be able to play until tonight or tomorrow

 

[ThERat]

well, Rat09 was a loss, but we learned our lesson I hope and play far better this time round.
A warmonger game seems to be played like a builder game for the start and after having a good economic base, then go for the expansion. Thus, it actually seems that a Civ with a UU in the latter ages is more suited than those with early UU's.

 

[Xarathas]

Hmm, I think that really depends on the start you get. If you start next to people, unlike Rat 09 and Rat 10, it's probably better to start with an early UU, and wipe them out early. Our main problem last game was more on the overexpansion side than anything. That whole period where we were running <50% science really hurt our tech'ing. I think it's generally a good idea to make sure you always stay above 70% or at the very least, 60% science. Last game, we just sorta kept expanding and warring and neglected the building phase necessary after wars to keep our economy up.

 

[ThERat]

agree with you Xarathas, in this game here, we had the chance to expand gradually without any opposition. So, we could keep the science rate at 70% and continue expanding.

As I suggested before, state property will help us a lot to reduce the distance maintenance we will have to pay for all those new cities, we acquire. I strongly recommend to revolt. I would do that before taking out Persia, since we suffer WW at the moment anyway and 1 turn anarchy will harm us less now.

I guess we need another 5 turns to wipe them out. Then on to Egypt.

 

[Greebley]

We also built very few cottages in 9 and went for early shields. That combined with the expansion was deadly.

Why don't we just complete the FP on the new island? Then we may not need to revolt until we have 3 islands.

 

[Xarathas]

How many turns is FP from completion? If it's soon, (like, 10 turns or less) then I suggest we wait it out. I don't think state property will be more beneficial than free market once that FP is built. Not to mention as courthouses come in, the state property loses even more value. I don't think we should switch over to SP unless we plan on utilizing the other half of that civic (watermill/workshop, to boost production, may not be a bad idea), at least not until we get on a 3rd continent.

 

[Greebley]

No, it will take a little while to complete. 27 turns IIRC. You may be right that that is too long.

What are we giving up if we switch to state property? I can't remember which civic row it is in. If we are giving up the +2 commerce or +1 hammer per town, I would be more inclined to use the FP. If it is one of the other 3 rows, then I think state property may be best. I vaguely remember it being in the 4th civic with merchantilism. If this is true, then I think going for it is a good idea. We are only giving up the free specialist or the extra trade route.

 

[goraemon]

View attachment 113776

OK, turn 0 I don't do much except re-sign some resource deals with the AI for better profit, and revolt to State Property.

EOT Turn 0: Nothing. Cyrus doesn't dare counterattack

Turn 1: Our income is now positive at 60% science and 20% culture

We take Arbela with no casualties
We take Susa with no casualties. I see a barb maceman in range now

I start on the kremlin in capital

EOT Turn 1: The barb maceman attacks one of our cossacks and we win, nothing else

Turn 2:

We take Sidon with no casualties

Starting to moving onto Carib, the final city

The chinese and Egyptian are vying for the space where some of the razed cities used to be (Tarsus?) Chinese is on there already with a settler, and Egypt isn't far behind. We aren't going to beat them to it.

Got to be faster with the other land grab sites. Discontinue forbidden palace, start another settler

EOT Turn 2:
Biology comes in. Steel next. Caesar's golden age has begun. Sure enough the chinese settle their city 1 tile left of the razed city.

Turn 3:

So yeah we take Carib with uhh..no casualties

*Cyrus is no more!!!*

Going to focus on some infra for the rest of my turns now

EOT Turn 3:

Settler is cash-rushed in one of our cities
A barb archer attempts attacking our full-strength Cossack at Carib. Uh, like, we win

Turn 4: We found a new city. Krasno..something.

Going to rush another settler. Trade some older techs to some AI's for money. Now that war weariness is gone and we have biology, time to go through every city, switch productions appropriately, re-check their working tiles and plan out terraforming for the future.

Science temp down to 10% to gather up cash.

EOT Turn 4: We win a battle with a barb swordsman somewhere near the fog of war.

Eh..a barb warrior comes out of the darkness and captures one of our workers.

Turn 5: Warrior's dead

Going to speed things up a bit

Building bank in many established cities, granaries and other basic buildings in newer ones, settler makes his way to his new city site.

Turn 6: We found another city, I'm not even going to try to spell it out see the screenshots later

Turn 7: I can now afford to cash-rush the Kremlin

EOT Turn 7:



Turns 8-10: Rush built banks and working on other financial buildings like markets/grocers. Many of them will be built next turn. Suggest to rush these first because it'll fuel future rushes further. Suggested buildings next are uni/observatories and any wonders.

A picture of our newly conquered territory:



I am also in the process of scouting Caesar's cities; looks like they'll be relatively easy pickings for our Cossacks so if we want to grab the entire 2nd continent we should go for Caesar anytime we feel up to it.
A picture of Rome:



GL

 

[ThERat]

hmm this is a tricky question. Shall we wipe out Caesar first or go for Egypt. Since I won't be playing until late tonight, can the team give some input?

 

[goraemon]

Just remembered that we're playing for Conquest and not Domination right?

OK that may change things a bit.

I suggest we take a look at our current land size and assess our situation careully. The AI is usually quick and happy to place new cities on any available tile so in order to win by conquest we'll have to have good control of a majority of the continents (without going over) from which to stifle the other AIs from building new cities.

 

[ReccaSquirrel]

Lurker Advice: Take out Caesar. You aren't going to want to expand much beyond those two continents you control. You need to take him out sooner or later so you might as well get the entire continent under your control. That way you can have all of your cities built and in place for the rest of the game while you focus on conquest.

If you wait on Caesar, he could have some better units by the time you turn on him and as he shares land with your current cities, it could be a mess. Best take him out while you know it will go quickly.

 

[ThERat]

save

Pre-Turn
with usual high science we don't need so many banks, I rather have more unis or so.

I think we should simply kick Caesar off the Island. the other Islands are all occupied by only 1 Civ. that's easier for
conquest.
So, my goal is to get 15+ Cossacks and then attack

increase science again, we want RR as soon as possible
steel now in 4

1. 1712AD
Yaroslav goes back to produce Cossacks
decide to pillage the tiles around baoding, they will go to China anyway soon, might as well make some money there
get 33golf for a town for now

2. 1714AD
pillage another 27gold

3. 1716AD
nothing much happening, pillage a little

4. 1718AD
steel is in, steam power next in 5

5. 1720AD
zzz

6. 1722AD
uneventful

7. 1724AD
ship 3 more Cossacks over

8. 1726AD
srat drydocks in Novgorod, we need a city to produce naval units soon

9. 1728AD
steam is in, RR next in 6
for all the land we own, we have only 1 source of coal next to Yakutskovia

10. 1730AD
we have now 9 Cossacks next to Gordium, maybe wait for 1 or 2 more shipments of units and start war
overease cities will be productive soon, we have barracks going on there as well to support unit builds

we need to decide where to build the ironworks
maybe Rostov?

Yaroslavl should eventually build west point

telling stats

 

[ThERat]

Roster:
ThERat
Xarathas - up
Dimy - having crash issues with 1.52
Greebley - on deck
goraemon

 

[goraemon]

Reason for banks/financial buildings is that it helps you rush-buy other stuff, like uni/observatories/laboratories/wonders/units for the rest of the game. We've got Kremlin so abuse it! We're so far ahead in tech we can even afford to run 0% science for a few turns then jack it up after we've rush-built science buildings, etc. F1 is your friend here for prioritizing what to build.

About our war options...I'm thinking that in order to win via conquest, we're going to probably have to take over like 2 other continents, taking out 2 other civs in the process, and hold those continents so they cannot be re-settled before proceeding to raze everything else to the ground in a blitz of sorts. I don't think taking over 2 more continents is going to put us over the domination limit but I could be wrong.

Taking out Caesar, THEN taking over 2 more continents though? That might put us over.

Caesar and we are on good terms atm, no? And he's like, what, last in score? He just isn't a big threat to us and I think there is a point to saving him for last or next-to-last for the final razing spree.

This game is in the bag as far as I'm concerned so in the end, it probably won't matter too much to take out Caesar first as long as we're careful about exceeding land size. Still, it's a matter of fine-tuning and efficiency in execution now. Focusing on the other couple continents first might save us some more time over the long term, but I have no doubt that whatever path we choose, we'll win.

 

[ThERat]

Actually during my turns I got several requests to stop dealing with Egypt, seems Hatty isn't really well liked.

We can attack her instead first, but we might need another 10 turns at least to prepare.
We can send our cossacks east on the other continent and then pick them up and ship over, no issues.

I agree on cash rushing, we do have the capability, however I wanted to get RR as soon as possible so we can squeeze out more shields from our empire because we are generally shield poor.

And one more thing, there is some money around for trading, we can use that to cash rush things. Pillaging in other lands will also help us a lot to fuel cash rushes.

 

[Xarathas]

Sorry for the delay, this weekend was Chinese new year

Anyhow, I agree with some points of rat's and some points of Gora's. I think this is going to be the outline of what I'm going to do in the next 10 turns unless someone can convince me otherwise -

Diplomacy -

I agree, that if we're in good terms with Caesar, we should just leave a few rifles and cossacks on this continent and take out Hatty, Mao, and Monty first. Maybe we can even convince him to declare war on someone to keep him stagnant in tech. Caesar lost so many troops vs the Persians he shouldn't be much of a threat with only 5~6 productive cities... just make sure you don't underdefend the borders on the south continent and I really doubt he'll declare. So, plan - Declare on hatty, and with some luck people will dogpile on her... assuming they have astronomy by now, heh. Otherwise we got ourselves a bunch of cheerleaders. Monty's the only one that we have to watch ou for probably, since he's nowhere near her and right next to us.

GP -

Could use a great prophet for Persepolis (I think that was the judaism holy city, right?). That would help our financial problems a good deal. I'll have to figure out how to go about doing that. Need a city with multiple temples...

Religion - with some of our less than stellar production cities, I'm going to make some jewish missionaries (monasteries first) and spread that religion to our mainland.

Infrastructures - FP needs to be built ASAP. 7 universities if we don't already have it. Oxford -> Capital (unless we have a better science city that I'm not aware of). Markets & Banks, and we'll need 7 banks eventually for Wall Street. Hopefully we'll have our prophet not too far down the line. I assume we have 7 forges by now.

Rest of the cities, barring the new ones that needs basic infras, will make units (and westpoint).

Trade - only sell techs to Mongols, and maybe Romans depending on the tech and how far they are behind.

 

[Dimy]

Hi guys,

Some news from me... this morning I finally discovered why Civ 4 kept crashing on my pc... My pc had now completely died on me and wouldn't boot up, just a black screen. Here's the pictures (young viewers, keep on reading at your own risk):

 

[knupp715]

Hi guys,

Some news from me... this morning I finally discovered why Civ 4 kept crashing on my pc... My pc had now completely died on me and wouldn't boot up, just a black screen. Here's the pictures (young viewers, keep on reading at your own risk):

Looks like you spent a few too many late nights playing Civ. Hopefully you can get that fixed soon.

BTW guys, great game. You're doing good

 

[Xarathas]

Hey Greeb.. can you switch order with me for this round pls? I won't have access to civ until probably wednesday =/ Sorry about this guys, things came up in a hurry.