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RB29a - Cultural Extermination

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession Games' started by Sullla, Mar 4, 2007.

  1. Sullla

    Sullla Patrician Roman Dictator

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    Welcome to any and all lurkers. You're about to see quite a few teams playing a very unorthodox variant! :lol:

    RB29: Cultural Extermination

    Civ: Catherine/Russia (Creative/Financial)
    Map Settings: Standard Pangaea, default sea level and shape
    Other Settings: Prince difficulty, Epic speed, No Barbs
    Opponents: 6 pre-chosen AIs (Tokugawa, Caesar, Napoleon, Temujin, Roosevelt, Bismarck)

    Variant Rules:
    1) Cities may not be captured or razed under any circumstances.
    2) Our units cannot enter enemy territory without Open Borders.

    The first is self-explanatory. The second takes a number of things off the table: no worker-stealing from the AI, no pillaging them into the ground, nothing like that. We can't even ENTER their territory to attack cities! :crazyeye: In order to knock out defenders serving as culture flip garrisons, our borders must expand to the point where they touch the enemy city. We can't ever enter enemy territory! (Although we can do so peacefully via Open Borders.)

    Our goal is to win by CONQUEST! :hammer:



    Team A
    Sullla
    darkwatcher
    LKendter
    dathon

    Team B
    Kylearan
    regoarrarr
    EricStratton
    Ruff_Hi

    Team C
    sooooo
    Quack
    Kodii
    sunrise089

    RB29: Team D
    uberfish
    blid
    pindicator
    mostly_harmless

    I will add links to the other team's threads as they are created. First turnset for the "A" team to follow this post! :)
     
  2. Sullla

    Sullla Patrician Roman Dictator

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    (0) 4000BC I see no reason to move the starting settler; this spot has two food bonuses, a freshwater lake for early commerce, and is on a river AND on the coast. Now... what to build in Moscow? I would usually build a worker, but we're going to be chasing religions initially, and we lack any worker techs beyond Mining. There's no point in having a worker who can't do anything, so let's start with a warrior while growing at max speed to size 2, at which point in time I'll start a worker. Research goes into Mysticism, natch. I am of course working the 3/0/1 cattle tile at Moscow.

    (1) 3970BC We get a map from the nearby hut. Wonder if anyone will get a tech there (?) It reveals mostly desert to the southeast.

    (2) 3940BC Ice and tundra to our north... looks like we're at the upper end of the pangaea.

    (3) 3910BC Hello!



    Americans to our east, so it would seem. Depending on the layout of the land, we may want to push early settlers in this direction. Need more map info still.

    (4) 3880BC Borders expand at Moscow. I am reminded that you need Fishing tech to work lake tiles (d'oh! forgot that one) Oh well, not a lot we can do about it now.

    (6) 3820BC Meet Temujin in the southeast. Looks like they're further past the Americans in that direction. Still seeing a lot of desert to our south.

    (7) 3790BC Meet Tokugawa to the south; we actually run into his capital's borders, not just a unit. Another fun guy to hang out with.

    (10) 3700BC Mysticism -> Meditation (13 turns). Moscow will grow to size 2 next turn. We spot a hut with our scout, let's hope for something good!

    (11) 3670BC Hut has 76 gold inside, blah. Moscow at size 2; since we still haven't popped any worker techs from huts, I'm going to finish our warrior and only then swap to a worker. That's only in 6 more turns. (There's an American warrior walking around outside undefended Moscow, but fortunately the AI is programmed not to attack this early!)

    (12) 3640BC Find Napoleon's borders CLOSE to the south. Just look:



    Wow, we're all pretty packed in together here! But that should be fun. ;) Still need more map info to think about placing first settler.

    (17) 3490BC Warrior -> SETTLER (changed my mind). There's no point in building a worker if we don't have the worker techs to do anything! Let's get another city out there ASAP instead, then backfill in workers afterwards. (Strange opening, but our tech choices dictated it!) Warrior heads out scouting to find out more of the local terrain.

    (23) 3310BC Meet Bismarck in the west. More importantly, we found Buddhism! :D



    Tough choice on what to research next; Fishing for work boats and to get the lake tile in play? AH for our cows? Polytheism for another religion? I opt for the long-term play and decide to chase Hinduism. Slow initial growth curve, but big eventual cultural payoff.

    (28) 3160BC Lot of land down on a peninsula to the south. It's a shame we don't have Napoleon's more central starting position, but you play the hand you're dealt!

    (29) 3130BC Moscow's borders expand to level 3. Being Creative + Buddhist founder sure is nice!

    (30) 3100BC That's 30 turns; usually I would stop here, but we have 10 turns until finding out whether or not we land Hinduism. I HAVE to know that, so I'll play 40 to start. (Executive privilege has its advantages! :lol: ) Besides, not a whole lot going on right now anyway.

    (31) 3070BC Meet Caesar in the extreme southwest. That's everyone then. Napoleon (south), Tokugawa (southeast), and Roosevelt (east) are our close neighbors. The others are more distant.

    (39) 2830BC Looks like the gamble will pay off...

    (40) 2800BC We land Hinduism, woohoo! :cool:



    That gives us the first two religions, excellent. Now it's time to go back and start catching up on our growth curve, so I select Fishing next (Moscow's next build after the settler should be a work boat).

    Situation: That was a bizarre opening, but this is a bizarre game. We don't have any workers, but we don't have any worker TECHS so that doesn't really hurt us too much, does it? We did get both of the early religions, and we've met all 6 AIs so we get discounts on techs they already know (such as Fishing, which will only take 7 turns to research). There is a settler due in 9 more turns; let's look at potential spots to put him:



    The terrain around our start is not the best. In an ordinary game, the floodplains to the southwest might be the place to go, but for this variant we need to put pressure on the AIs immediately. (And we'll have to be careful, because they might not like that very much!) My preferred spot is the red dot above; only 4 tiles from Paris, grabbing ivory, stone, and dyes. (Don't discount those dyes; as a Creative civ, we'll be building half-cost theatres everywhere!) The one downside is a lack of food bonuses, but it would be a strong production center where we could possibly build some of the wonders we need. Green dot is another possibility, with a corn resource and a floodplains tile, but I think the location is weaker overall (too many desert tiles). I'm bringing our scout back east to get some further info over there, because the next settler will probably have to go in that direction. The warrior is also being recalled, and should guard our new city, wherever we put it.

    I'd probably research Fishing, then Animal Husbandry for our cows, and then Masonry -> Monotheism. We don't want to delay chasing Judaism too long, or someone else will found it! (We want the religion to pop in city #2 if at all possible.) Let's have everyone play 20 turns for this first turnset, and then we'll go to 10 each on the second go-around.

    Sullla
    darkwatcher <<< UP NOW
    LKendter <<< on deck
    dathon

    http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/12069/RB29a-BC-2800.zip
     
  3. Sullla

    Sullla Patrician Roman Dictator

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    Anyone on my team who hasn't played this variant before really would benefit from looking at the writeup I did on my website:

    http://www.garath.net/Sullla/pahatty_1.html

    I'm not trying to advertise here, just point out that I laid out the model for how to attack enemy civs culturally in that report. It would definitely be good if everyone was familiar with some of the tricks before we get started! :)
     
  4. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

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    Checking in, and giving an official GACK for how crowded this map is.
     
  5. Galileo44

    Galileo44 Great Scientist

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    Looking forward to lurking all of these games. My CIV4 vanilla CD has disapeared as of now, so I am stuck with only Warlords. :mad:

    Good Luck
     
  6. Swein Forkbeard

    Swein Forkbeard Nintendo Fan

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    Hello, Sir!
    Sullla has returned back to civilization![party]

    You founded BudHinduism as a non-Spiritual civ.:eek:

    Well, I once founded Buddhism with Mao (on Warlords) with ISABELLA as an AI rival (and Wang Kon too).

    By the way, did you know that when you reply to my posts, you are replying to a Hindu's posts?:cool:
     
  7. darkwatcher

    darkwatcher blue eyes fanatic

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    Checking in and got it. will try to play tomorow or early the day after that.:)
     
  8. dathon78

    dathon78 Amateur Expert

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    Checking in. Looking forward to my first SG, and hopefully, not too much of the pungent weed! :)

    dathon
     
  9. Clovis

    Clovis Charlemagne's Grandfather

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    A question on religion:

    Does each religion in your city add culture, or is it only a cultural advantage as far as the religious buildings go? In other words, does having Hinduism in a city give it extra culture, or is the cultural advantage the fact that you can then build a Hindu Temple/Monastery/Mandir?
     
  10. Cosmichail

    Cosmichail Dark Lord of The Sith

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    lurking here

    Clovis.

    No state religion will give +1 culture on all religions
    state religion will give +1c+1happy
    free religion will give +1culture and +1happy for each religion
    A founding city will give +5 culture if in no state religion and free religion.

    When in a state religion founding cities of other religions get no culture as well the other religons that spread to you. Although your state religion founding city gets 5 culture.

    So if you have the hydra at first 3 x 5 culture is better then 1 x 5 (state religion)

    This is I what I recall and on the founding cities (hydra) need to check again but that's what I recall.

    There are benefits to having a religion or even better religions for the culture push at first but definitely in the long run are the temples/monasteries and cathedrals.
     
  11. Sullla

    Sullla Patrician Roman Dictator

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    That's much less impressive when you realize that we rigged the map so that none of the other AIs started with Mysticism either! ;)

    Cosmichail pretty much summed it up above. Any city with your state religion will produce 1 culture/turn; if you have no state religion, you gain 1 culture/turn for EACH religion in that city! Of course, the tradeoff is that you can't make use of any of the civics in the Religious column (no Organized Religion, Theocracy, etc.) For this game, we're almost certainly never going to declare any state religion and spread our (many) religions far and wide. Ideally we'll land the first five holy cities (Buddhism, Hinduism, Judaism, Confucianism, Christianity); if we get the other two, great, if not, no big deal. Controlling the early ones will be big, however. :)
     
  12. Swein Forkbeard

    Swein Forkbeard Nintendo Fan

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    Hello, Sir!
    @Sullla: What do you think of me founding Buddhism with Mao on Warlords on Noble difficulty with Isabella and Wang Kon as rival AIs?
     
  13. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

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    What does this have to do with THIS GAME? If you want to talk about this type of stuff please go Civ4 - Strategy & Tips
    http://forums.civfanatics.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=-1&f=155

    This is totally irrevalent to this game, and qualifies as SPAM IMHO.
     
  14. Swein Forkbeard

    Swein Forkbeard Nintendo Fan

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    Hello, Sir!
    Sorry, LKendter, I just really want to talk to Sullla about those things.:crazyeye:

    @Sullla and team: You're just going to push for settlers, heh? Aren't you forgetting about Stonehenge?
     
  15. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

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    Well that is what the private message system is for...
     
  16. darkwatcher

    darkwatcher blue eyes fanatic

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    Ok sorry about no screenies and dull report. I didn't have much time.(" = dito)
    IT-nothing
    T1-scout and send warior torward red dot
    T2-"
    T3-"
    T4-"
    T5-start AH
    T6- see turn 2
    T7-start work boat and send settler torward red dot
    T8-see turn 2
    T9-we're the most cultured civilization in the world according to tacitus :dance: [party] :bday: :cheers:
    T10-found St. pete start on a obelisk
    T11-see turn 2
    T12-"
    T13-Start masonry for monotheism.
    T14-St. pete's borders expand
    T15-scout
    T16-start worker in Moscow
    T17-start mono. due in 15 turns
    T18-scout
    T19-"
    T20-"
     

    Attached Files:

  17. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

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    Got it to play tonight.
     
  18. Swein Forkbeard

    Swein Forkbeard Nintendo Fan

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    Hello, Sir!
    Build as many obelisks as you can before building Stonehenge (you are going to build that stone circle that I've seen before, right?).
     
  19. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

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    http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/1898/RB29_-_Cultural_Extermination_BC-1300.Civ4SavedGame


    1870 BC
    I am not sure why the scout still needs to be moved. SG tradition is everything moved except one or two units if a critical decision. I don't see that here.

    We are at turn 71, and yet we lack slavery. I can tell we went with a really different opening.

    I swap to working the lake to increase the odds of being Jewish. I remove the Hindu Monastery from the build queue, and add a warrior. I know it is only prince, but Napoleons attitude is going to get ugly fast. I don't want to play the naked city gambit to long.


    1690 BC
    (IT)


    I start research on the wheel. Connecting the stone for wonders looks really good for the long-term plan.


    1630 BC
    Our new worker arrives, and goes to work on the cattle spot. I love gaining food and shields.


    1540 BC
    (IT) Our next research project is bronze working. I would like to crack the whip soon.

    =======================

    Summary:
    We got another religion, and tripled our military to three warriors. Bronze working complete soon, and a settler is on the way. I hope city number 3 can gain some copper.
     
  20. dathon78

    dathon78 Amateur Expert

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    I see it, but it will be Wednesday evening before I can play.

    dathon
     

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