RBC13A - Middle Ages - Byzantium, Sid
- Thread starter T-hawk
- Start date
T-hawk
Transcend
Take it, Speaker. I'm coming up in the Norway game too, and I won't have time to play both games today.
Charis
Realms Beyond
Lol, you're both *CHICKEN*!! 
The longer the wait the more I fear how bad the Magyar onslaught will be in a few turns, though if they don't press 'quickly' we'll be golden.
Charis
PS@Speaker... sheesh I read your next post on "writing the report" and when you said you were up to 30 pages my eyes did this -->
I think I need more sleep!
The longer the wait the more I fear how bad the Magyar onslaught will be in a few turns, though if they don't press 'quickly' we'll be golden.
Charis
PS@Speaker... sheesh I read your next post on "writing the report" and when you said you were up to 30 pages my eyes did this -->
I think I need more sleep!
Phew, was up until 3am writing writing writing, then enjoyed a brief 4 hour nap and back to editing editing editing, but the final result is a compete 30 page first draft.
I have practice this afternoon and class in the early evening, but will be playing around 10pm.
Finally a chance to relax after weeks of constant thesising.
I have practice this afternoon and class in the early evening, but will be playing around 10pm.
Finally a chance to relax after weeks of constant thesising.
T-hawk
Transcend
Take it tomorrow if you can then. I'm still up in Norway which I didn't get to today.
T-hawk
Transcend
OK, I'm done with Norway, and I still have time to play this one so I'm going to do so. (Gonna be out tomorrow as it's my birthday.)
Got it, playing now.
Got it, playing now.
T-hawk
Transcend
First thought: Ye Gods, that's way too many Bulgar units. Good thing they made peace.
As for the Magyars, I think it best to go ahead and sign alliance with the Bulgars against them. Can't think of a better thing for either of their units to do than beat up on each other. We are not ready to attack the Abbasids anytime before Cataphracts and not for some time even then.
I go ahead and give Castle Building to the Bulgars for the alliance. Best to get the alliance clock started now. I also get the Kievan Rus in as well. I establish embassy with the Rus - their capital has 8 units in it already, and 10 shields/turn builds them a Berserk in 3 turns. Horseback Riding isn't enough for the alliance, so I just give that to them, then trade Castle Building plus 3gpt for the alliance.
Can also bring France in. An embassy shows their capital at size 10, building Wealth , with TWENTY-FOUR units in it, mostly spearmen. I can't think of a better thing for them to do with those units than attack the Magyars, so I give Early Siegecraft to France for an alliance.
Our economy looks very good, making 100 gpt income! Much better than the Norwegians.
England can pay 87 + 5/turn for Early Siegecraft, pretty close to market value; sold.
==========
963 AD: Norse Tradition has come in, and Seafaring is indeed out there. It would cost about 125 gold in trade, which is way cheaper than it should be. There's definitely something screwy with trading costs on the optional branches in this scenario. We can trade Early Siegecraft to any of the Viking civs for it; I pick Norway because they're probably the weakest.
Next research is a tough call. We could actually research Smithing or Lost Roman Secrets ourselves in 22 turns, or Code of Laws in 11, or Medieval Combat in 15. Well, Smithing is out as it should be a cheap trade. Medieval Combat is also out as the AIs will prioritize that and have had Siegecraft for a while.
So the question is whether to push to our Cataphracts, or push up the global tree and stay in the brokering loop. We could also run minimum and save up, maybe steal onto the Christian or Muslim branch. Too bad we have no shot at the Holy Roman Empire.
Final answer is to research Lost Roman Secrets at max. We would like our aqueducts soon, we do want to get our Cataphracts sometime this millennium, and we can probably eventually trade the tech to the Rus.
966 AD: Iron is hooked up - thank you Charis for using the Ctrl-R worker trick - and we upgrade three warriors. Little action on the Magyar front just yet. I realize now that one of the Dromons should be at home keeping an eye out for Magyar boats to hit for a Golden Age.
972 AD: Code of Laws is around but no good deals yet. (Good thing I didn't self-research that.) Looks like France was the one to get it and pocket everyone else's gold. Sweden has Smithing too, at monopoly for the moment.
The Magyars buy the Poles into alliance against us. I'm not worried.
975 AD: Lose two swordsmen and a horse attacking a lucky spear from hell. Now I realize that what we really need is Catapults, same as in the Fall of Rome game. Constant can build 'em every turn, conveniently enough, though they do cost unit maintenance...
France buys Burgundy in against the Magyars.
978 AD: The Magyar action is starting to heat up. Three spears just walked into our territory; we lose one horse in clearing them out. Getting a couple catapults up to the front line, though. Lose a couple spears between turns.
981 AD: Bulgar and Magyar forces are clashing resoundingly over in the west. Finally some luck for us as a defending horseman beats an attacking archer and goes elite. Next turn that horseman finally manages to pillage a road tile, that forces the Magyars through a stop-and-kill zone at Veliki.
984 AD: Some catapults arrive and the northern border is just about secure. Still no brokering to do...
BT: Oh great. A Swedish berserk moved up next to Sofia (our way far northeast city). Sneak-attacking or just exploring?
Poles complete Holy Roman Empire.
987 AD: Between turns, Sweden declares war on us and of course we lose Sofia.
And, oh great, the Bulgars dropped off an archer by boat right next to Constantinople. We have RoP so can't even demand that they withdraw.
And, oh GREAT, there are three Abbasid horsemen coming up next to our border. Embassy shows them at war with nobody (they've barely even contacted anybody), so it looks like we're the target. Jerusalem has 10 spears and is building an assassin.
This is getting UGLY with a capital UGH...
990 AD: At least there's brokering available. Germany and Cordova got Medieval Combat.
59 gpt goes to Cordova for Medieval Combat. Trading that plus 5g to Denmark gets us both Code of Laws and Smithing. (Yay!, but why is our one tech worth two of his?) Town Halls ordered up in many cities and a Blacksmith in Constantinople.
We can resell some of those techs around to everyone else for alliances, which I strongly recommend. I leave all of that for the next leader.
Since the Bulgars and Abbasids are about to sneak attack us, you can sign alliances with them against anyone you like without worrying about a 20-turn limitation.
Good luck to whoever goes next. Either Speaker or Arathorn, whoever can play can take it.
T-hawk << Just Played
Arathorn << Up Now
Jabah
Charis
Speaker << Up Now if he wants it, otherwise skipped
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/rbc13a-990ad.zip
As for the Magyars, I think it best to go ahead and sign alliance with the Bulgars against them. Can't think of a better thing for either of their units to do than beat up on each other. We are not ready to attack the Abbasids anytime before Cataphracts and not for some time even then.
I go ahead and give Castle Building to the Bulgars for the alliance. Best to get the alliance clock started now. I also get the Kievan Rus in as well. I establish embassy with the Rus - their capital has 8 units in it already, and 10 shields/turn builds them a Berserk in 3 turns. Horseback Riding isn't enough for the alliance, so I just give that to them, then trade Castle Building plus 3gpt for the alliance.
Can also bring France in. An embassy shows their capital at size 10, building Wealth
, with TWENTY-FOUR units in it, mostly spearmen. I can't think of a better thing for them to do with those units than attack the Magyars, so I give Early Siegecraft to France for an alliance.Our economy looks very good, making 100 gpt income! Much better than the Norwegians.
England can pay 87 + 5/turn for Early Siegecraft, pretty close to market value; sold.==========
963 AD: Norse Tradition has come in, and Seafaring is indeed out there. It would cost about 125 gold in trade, which is way cheaper than it should be. There's definitely something screwy with trading costs on the optional branches in this scenario. We can trade Early Siegecraft to any of the Viking civs for it; I pick Norway because they're probably the weakest.
Next research is a tough call. We could actually research Smithing or Lost Roman Secrets ourselves in 22 turns, or Code of Laws in 11, or Medieval Combat in 15. Well, Smithing is out as it should be a cheap trade. Medieval Combat is also out as the AIs will prioritize that and have had Siegecraft for a while.
So the question is whether to push to our Cataphracts, or push up the global tree and stay in the brokering loop. We could also run minimum and save up, maybe steal onto the Christian or Muslim branch. Too bad we have no shot at the Holy Roman Empire.
Final answer is to research Lost Roman Secrets at max. We would like our aqueducts soon, we do want to get our Cataphracts sometime this millennium, and we can probably eventually trade the tech to the Rus.
966 AD: Iron is hooked up - thank you Charis for using the Ctrl-R worker trick - and we upgrade three warriors. Little action on the Magyar front just yet. I realize now that one of the Dromons should be at home keeping an eye out for Magyar boats to hit for a Golden Age.
972 AD: Code of Laws is around but no good deals yet. (Good thing I didn't self-research that.) Looks like France was the one to get it and pocket everyone else's gold. Sweden has Smithing too, at monopoly for the moment.
The Magyars buy the Poles into alliance against us. I'm not worried.
975 AD: Lose two swordsmen and a horse attacking a lucky spear from hell. Now I realize that what we really need is Catapults, same as in the Fall of Rome game. Constant can build 'em every turn, conveniently enough, though they do cost unit maintenance...
France buys Burgundy in against the Magyars.
978 AD: The Magyar action is starting to heat up. Three spears just walked into our territory; we lose one horse in clearing them out. Getting a couple catapults up to the front line, though. Lose a couple spears between turns.
981 AD: Bulgar and Magyar forces are clashing resoundingly over in the west. Finally some luck for us as a defending horseman beats an attacking archer and goes elite. Next turn that horseman finally manages to pillage a road tile, that forces the Magyars through a stop-and-kill zone at Veliki.
984 AD: Some catapults arrive and the northern border is just about secure. Still no brokering to do...
BT: Oh great. A Swedish berserk moved up next to Sofia (our way far northeast city). Sneak-attacking or just exploring?
Poles complete Holy Roman Empire.
987 AD: Between turns, Sweden declares war on us and of course we lose Sofia.
And, oh great, the Bulgars dropped off an archer by boat right next to Constantinople. We have RoP so can't even demand that they withdraw.
And, oh GREAT, there are three Abbasid horsemen coming up next to our border. Embassy shows them at war with nobody (they've barely even contacted anybody), so it looks like we're the target. Jerusalem has 10 spears and is building an assassin.
This is getting UGLY with a capital UGH...
990 AD: At least there's brokering available. Germany and Cordova got Medieval Combat.
59 gpt goes to Cordova for Medieval Combat. Trading that plus 5g to Denmark gets us both Code of Laws and Smithing. (Yay!, but why is our one tech worth two of his?) Town Halls ordered up in many cities and a Blacksmith in Constantinople.
We can resell some of those techs around to everyone else for alliances, which I strongly recommend. I leave all of that for the next leader.
Since the Bulgars and Abbasids are about to sneak attack us, you can sign alliances with them against anyone you like without worrying about a 20-turn limitation.
Good luck to whoever goes next. Either Speaker or Arathorn, whoever can play can take it.
T-hawk << Just Played
Arathorn << Up Now
Jabah
Charis
Speaker << Up Now if he wants it, otherwise skipped
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads6/rbc13a-990ad.zip
T-hawk
Transcend
Remember we can upgrade to Medieval Infantry now. Also try very hard to knock off that Bulgar boat to get our Golden Age going - we could REALLY use that.
Good luck!
Jabah
Emperor
Not 100% sure that Abbasid is going to sneak attack us, they already came that close before with archer and might be on their way to Europe...
It should be safer to close the gate between Europe and Middle-East with a worker/king/anythink next to Constantinople, therefore removing all AIs temptation to go through our land to fight someone else.
We probably should do it anyway EVEN if we ally and RoP with Abbasids to avoid the sneak tentation.
Jabah
It should be safer to close the gate between Europe and Middle-East with a worker/king/anythink next to Constantinople, therefore removing all AIs temptation to go through our land to fight someone else.
We probably should do it anyway EVEN if we ally and RoP with Abbasids to avoid the sneak tentation.
Jabah
T-hawk
Transcend
Good idea, Jabah. This turn, all the military units need to stay in Constantinople and Adrianople to make sure the archer doesn't capture either city, but the Theodora king unit is still in Constant and can move one square SE which does seal the border.
My money is still on the Abbasids attacking us, though. The AI doesn't use a stack of three horsemen to explore. The Abbasids only have contact with about three other civs, and going through us is certainly not a sneak attack vector against the Fatimids or Turks. I think we're still a couple techs up on the Abbasids, and hopefully they'll take that for peace before hurting us too badly. We can absorb the loss of a few border cities like Attalea.
May have to rush a barracks somewhere in the area to upgrade a few warriors, though 90g per MDI is tough. All the military build orders are up to the next leader.
Oh, and I forgot to even note in the screenshot that we're also at war with Poland as well, although they should be about ready to talk to us.
It's the Fall of Rome all over again....
My money is still on the Abbasids attacking us, though. The AI doesn't use a stack of three horsemen to explore. The Abbasids only have contact with about three other civs, and going through us is certainly not a sneak attack vector against the Fatimids or Turks. I think we're still a couple techs up on the Abbasids, and hopefully they'll take that for peace before hurting us too badly. We can absorb the loss of a few border cities like Attalea.
May have to rush a barracks somewhere in the area to upgrade a few warriors, though 90g per MDI is tough. All the military build orders are up to the next leader.
Oh, and I forgot to even note in the screenshot that we're also at war with Poland as well, although they should be about ready to talk to us.
It's the Fall of Rome all over again....
I see this, but there's no way I could play before tomorrow evening. Happy birthday T-hawk. My son's birthday is today, too -- just turned *5* and he's excited about it. Not so excited about spending his birthday in a car, but, well....
Anyway, I might be able to play tomorrow -- Friday for sure, but no earlier. Speaker, if you can take it before then, please do. Else, I'll survive this mini-feast once I've had some sleep.
Arathorn
Anyway, I might be able to play tomorrow -- Friday for sure, but no earlier. Speaker, if you can take it before then, please do. Else, I'll survive this mini-feast once I've had some sleep.
Arathorn
Jabah
Emperor
I will be away skiing next week starting tomorrow, so auto-skip me until Sunday 4th.
Jabah
Jabah
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
This is creeping through several games here, and needs to be corrected:
Warriors/ Swords *DO NOT* upgrade to MDI in this Conquest. They upgrade to Crusaders (4/3/1), but honestly, who aside the Christians will research that Tech?
Also (not really important in this game, but related): Knights are 5/3/2, so why would anyone build Crusaders instead?
T-hawk
Transcend
Thanks for the correction, Doc. 
In that case, I mean "remember that we can *build* MDI." 
Knights are 5/3/2, so why would anyone build Crusaders instead?
I suppose anyone who had some warriors or swordsmen might upgrade them
In that case, I mean "remember that we can *build* MDI." Knights are 5/3/2, so why would anyone build Crusaders instead?
I suppose anyone who had some warriors or swordsmen might upgrade them
Earliest I can get this is Saturday night. I don't know why I thought I could get it tonight. I'm taking the wife to see "Phantom of the Opera" for her birthday.
Just an FYI. Speaker, can you get it? T-hawk, do I need a skip? Does the deadline for epic ## matter?
Arathorn
Just an FYI. Speaker, can you get it? T-hawk, do I need a skip? Does the deadline for epic ## matter?
Arathorn
T-hawk
Transcend
Well, if we skip both Speaker and you, and Jabah is also away, that would put us right back to Charis who just played only one turn ago. And I know Charis wants to finish up Epic 39 this weekend.
I'm in no rush. Take your time and get it when you can. Speaker, if you're available, feel free to jump in and play too. Just make sure whoever's playing posts a got-it.
I'm in no rush. Take your time and get it when you can. Speaker, if you're available, feel free to jump in and play too. Just make sure whoever's playing posts a got-it.
Charis
Realms Beyond
Good deal on the wife B-day and the Phantom, I'll bet she loves that 
I agree, take your time - players like armies in enemy territory sometimes need a brief turn or two to rest up before continuing the onslaught!
Charis
I agree, take your time - players like armies in enemy territory sometimes need a brief turn or two to rest up before continuing the onslaught!
Charis
T-hawk
Transcend
Ack, you're right! Yes, Chalcedon can be defended, but Nicaea can't. Can only hope that the AI isn't smart enough to realize that and retarget its sneak attack; it may or may not be. At least there's a horseman in Adrianople that could probably retake the city.
Losing Nicaea would also cut off our Dromon from reaching that Bulgar boat for the Golden Age. Although we could rush one somewhere in Greece if we needed.
Actually, we could move the Theodora king unit from Constant to the one square that would block the archer from Nicaea, and guarantee not losing any cities. The archer would use up its movement if it were to attack Theodora. I think I'd do this if it were my call, but it's up to Arathorn. (Theodora is actually useless to us, and she's just costing maintenance...)
Losing Nicaea would also cut off our Dromon from reaching that Bulgar boat for the Golden Age. Although we could rush one somewhere in Greece if we needed.
Actually, we could move the Theodora king unit from Constant to the one square that would block the archer from Nicaea, and guarantee not losing any cities. The archer would use up its movement if it were to attack Theodora. I think I'd do this if it were my call, but it's up to Arathorn. (Theodora is actually useless to us, and she's just costing maintenance...)
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