[NFP] Religious Victory Elimination Thread

[Leucarum]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [15]
Gandhi/India [21] (20+1) Extra faith is always good.
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [17]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [22]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [19]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [18]
Lautaro/Mapuche [12]
Mansa Musa/Mali [22]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [8]
Montezuma/Aztecs [17]
Pachacuti/Inca [13]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [14]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [15]
Saladin/Arabia [25]
Tamar/Georgia [21]
Tomyris/Scythia [2] (5-3) Wihout that combat boost Kurgans aren't enough to justify her staying around.
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [12]

 

[Republic of San Montuoso]

Outrageous to see Qin eliminated before Tomyris. I mean, I know it's conditional, but if the conditions are here (and they're easily here), he's unstoppable. While others... Yeah, too late, I'll just drink to forget.

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [15]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [17]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [22]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [19]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [18]
Lautaro/Mapuche [12]
Mansa Musa/Mali [22]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [8]
Montezuma/Aztecs [17]
Pachacuti/Inca [13]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [14]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [15]
Saladin/Arabia [26] (25+1) First of my upvotes for Saladin only because I think he's better than Peter. With Peter, some people said you can focus on Religion and use your trades routes to catch up in culture/science. For Saladin, culture and science goes with religion (especially science), and since you're assured to have a great prophet, you can focus on some things else, like early attacks or campuses. The guaranteed prophet make it deserve the first place.
Tamar/Georgia [21]
Tomyris/Scythia [2] (2-3 ELIMINATED) The faith from Kurgan is nothing but kind of irrelevant IMO, and she has not other bonuses. Plus faith is good, but she has nothing to gain or secure a great prophet, and without it, it's dead. So, buh-bye, Scythia.
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [12]

 

[bengalryan9]

There's been a little bit of discussion about when you should achieve RV... I saw one poster say it should be as quick as possible and that you don't want to wait too long, and another argue that sometimes it's better to go slower. I think it's an interesting discussion and I tend to side with the latter. While you'd love to convert everyone on your continent as quickly as possible, on most maps you can't actually *win* an RV until you discover Cartography, so taking some time to set things up before then isn't necessarily a negative IMO. Heck, on higher difficulty levels if you get a prophet and your neighbor already has a religion you may be better off waiting to found your religion until you have the infrastructure set up because he'll just swarm and eliminate your religion right away if you don't.

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [15]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [17]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [22]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [19]
John Curtin/Australia [13] As @JhGf_123 pointed out, you have control over the appeal of your tiles. It's not that hard to get +3, and appeal is certainly not completely out of your hands to manipulate.
Kupe/Maori [18]
Lautaro/Mapuche [12]
Mansa Musa/Mali [22]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [8]
Montezuma/Aztecs [17]
Pachacuti/Inca [13]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [14]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [12] (15-3) So I've been thinking about Philip a bit... I think he deserves a downvote. He has no bonus to getting a great prophet or to early faith production, and while he does have some nice CS boosts tied to religion (especially his conquistadors) I'm not sure that's enough to keep him around. He looks like he's built to use domination to help with religious victory, but I think it's the other way around - he's meant to use religion (and it doesn't even have to be his) to help chase domination victory, and that's why he gets no early bonuses to grabbing his own religion.
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [21]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [13] (12+1) Not to sound like a broken record here, but Wilfrid gets another upvote from me for all the reasons I said in my last post. I proved he can easily found a religion before anyone else can (on Deity!) and included the save game to back it up. Being immune to wars is so strong and makes him one of the easiest leaders to get a great prophet with... he needs to be much higher than this.

EDIT: Here's the save file AGAIN in case you want to see how wrong @enKage is a couple of posts after this one. One hill near the capital, low food, still easily found the first religion on deity because you don't have to waste any time/production on training troops.

 

[Hans Castorp]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [15]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [17]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [23] [22+1] Not sure if I've already given Japan a point a few days back, but either way they deserve one - quick build HS and decent, reliable adjacency independent of pantheon or mountain starts.
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [19]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [18]
Lautaro/Mapuche [12]
Mansa Musa/Mali [22]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [8]
Montezuma/Aztecs [17]
Pachacuti/Inca [13]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11] 14-3 Pericles has the wildcard slot for GP, but it takes time for extra culture to kick in for him, and you need access to the policy card first. Once the culture starts coming, you move up to Theology, etc. quickly, but all the RV bonuses are indirectly derived from the culture output, and there is nothing to specifically benefit religious spread. He has his strengths for RV, but so do they all at this point.
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [12]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [21]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada

 

[fredrikslicer]

Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [15]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [17]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [23]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20] 19+1 Double victory path is rather good
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [18]
Lautaro/Mapuche [9] 12-3 Dom civ with little relevance to RV except maybe a few circumstances
Mansa Musa/Mali [22]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [8]
Montezuma/Aztecs [17]
Pachacuti/Inca [13]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [12]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [21]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [13]

 

[enKage]

Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [15]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18] 17+1 Wild card for guaranteed prophet and very efficient additional culture early, to progress civic tree
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [23]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [18]
Lautaro/Mapuche [9]
Mansa Musa/Mali [22]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [8]
Montezuma/Aztecs [17]
Pachacuti/Inca [13]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [12]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [21]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [10] 13-3 All this "dance of the aurora" doesn't justify staying so long here, everyone can settle tundra, everyone can pick this pantheon and some civs (except russian powerhouse) like Cree or even Indonesia are more effective in settling tundra than Canada. And because Wilfred is the worst leader to build holy site (usually low food, low hammers, no early faith = no choice of pantheon, low cash = no prophet from gold), and in fact Wilfried game is more RNG, based on city states met, he deserves to go now. Wilfried cannot even declare surprise war on a civ just to block their prophet progress by pillaging HS.
Every civ left has advantage over Canada

To @Hogimus, before I get convinced tundra bias is the best one and is more religious friendly than direct bonuses to faith, HS, apostles all other civs left have
Why Cree and Indonesia are better than Canada in tundra - you guessed, UI.

Wah? Russia, of course, but why the Cree and Indonesia? What makes them more effective? Do you mean housing? Indonesia doesn't get Kampung until shipbuilding. Mekewap in no way makes tundra better. Camps giving extra food does.

Wah? Camp giving extra food comparing to bonus food and hammers next to this camp is better?
Making 1 workable tile slighly better is superior to making 3 unworkable tiles workable with enough housing to work all these tiles?
Indonesia doesn't start in tundra, and when Gitarja is ready to settle for Aurora benefits, has already Kampung unlocked

And yes Canada does not spawn in the middle of tundra (usually) but on the border. Unless you play weird or modded mapscripts, tundra border is low food leading to low hammers, because it is usually plains. Nothing compared to juicy rainforest

How many tiles are you working in the first part of your game? While you're getting a religion like 2-4 tiles in your capital, maybe 2-3 in another city

That's right, if you play Canada. Not right with many other civs

 

[Josephias]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [15]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [23]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [18]
Lautaro/Mapuche [9]
Mansa Musa/Mali [22]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [8]
Montezuma/Aztecs [17]
Pachacuti/Inca [10] (13-3) If we are keeping Inca around just because the mountain bias start (and I only see other minor bonuses around as a light production plus that could help you build your first HS), maybe it's time for them to go. Note also you will also might want to build several other things around your mountains: terrace farms, aqueducts, campuses... so even if you have plenty (which is not guaranteed by the bias), and maybe you can use not-so-good Holy Site spots for the others (except campuses), you will still need to share.
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [12]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [22] (21+1) Tamar may have not the best bonuses towards, but she deserves an upvote nevertheless. As commented before, able to keep a streak of Exodus of the Evangelists. Also, while requiring more work, and depends on map layout, she has also the tools to keep suzerainty of useful religious city states, and some abilities helping she get more faith, even if not as good/reliable as others.
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [10]

 

[kryat]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12] (15-3) The Sphinx gives extra faith and culture, but I think it’s a little weak compared to some, but not all, left on this list.
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [23]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [18]
Lautaro/Mapuche [9]
Mansa Musa/Mali [22]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [8]
Montezuma/Aztecs [17]
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [13] (12+1) Not the strongest, not the weakest, but one of the most interesting. Philip offers a solid solution to getting your religion‘s foothold into a foreign continent by way of early armadas, conquistadors, inquisitors, and conversion on conquest. Usually by the time you’re crossing oceans to convert, populations in the midgame make missionaries less effective, and they may mop up whatever conversions you did by the time you can send another unit. Philip’s path says “forget that, I’ll convert by conquest”, and gives you an efficient path to nab a few cities, converting them without effort, that you can then spread from. He definitely lacks a fast way to founding a religion, but he’s no worse off than most others, and offers some unique tools later on. With holy site prayers though, founding usually isn’t a problem, even on high difficulty.
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [22]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [10]

 

[Francel]

Personal observation: The War Department (Tier 3 government building) affected my apostles in a recent game. Although this was before the latest patch, they did heal after eliminating a unit. I wonder if this has also changed now?

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12] (15-3)
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [23]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [18]
Lautaro/Mapuche [9]
Mansa Musa/Mali [23] (22+1) - Usually can get the first pantheon when settling in the desert. I have noticed the adjacency bonus pantheons are often among the first selected by the AI, so this is significant when going for desert folklore. It's usually easy to get +6 holy sites given the desert start bias. Also, faith purchase cost is reduced.
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [5] (8-3) - River holy sites are usually mediocre, and he would only get the production bonus if the holy sites were on the river (Pearl of the Danube). Thus, I am assuming any buff to holy site production is likely to be negligible. The extra envoys are nice, but not enough at this point.
Montezuma/Aztecs [17]
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [13]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [22]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [10]

 

[Dantesedge]

Tamar should be at 22 right now, not 23. She gained an unvoted point right before fredrickslicer.

Moderator Action: Corrected, thank you. leif

 

[Hogimus]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12] (15-3)
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [23]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [18]
Lautaro/Mapuche [9]
Mansa Musa/Mali [23]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [2] (5-3) Quicker holy sites and buildings would be nice, if you could reliably get it while also getting adjacency. Easier suzerainty of religious city states would also be helpful, but also, not reliable.
Montezuma/Aztecs [17]
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [13]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [23]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [11](10+1) @enKage "some civs (except russian powerhouse) like Cree or even Indonesia are more effective in settling tundra than Canada." Wah? Russia, of course, but why the Cree and Indonesia? What makes them more effective? Do you mean housing? Indonesia doesn't get Kampung until shipbuilding. Mekewap in no way makes tundra better. Camps giving extra food does. Do you just settle in the middle of tundra when you play Canada? You should be settling on the boundary where tundra meets grasslands or plain. I am always able to get a good start by doing that. "And because Wilfred is the worst leader to build holy site (usually low food, low hammers, no early faith = no choice of pantheon, low cash = no prophet from gold)," Again, do you think Canada spawns in the middle of tundra and snow? They always spawn on the boundary unless something weird happened. How many tiles are you working in the first part of your game? While you're getting a religion like 2-4 tiles in your capital, maybe 2-3 in another city. It's very easy to get that many good tiles as Canada especially if you build a mine or a camp.

 

[Kmart_Elvis]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [24] (23+1) Half-priced holy sites allow you to spam them as well as give you a leg up founding a religion. They also have Poland's adjacency bonus, but much better. Then there's half-priced theatre squares to help you get to the important civics. Cheap holy sites, faith bonuses via adjacency, and cheap, fast culture. All around, strong but not OP.
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [18]
Lautaro/Mapuche [9]
Mansa Musa/Mali [23]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [2]
Montezuma/Aztecs [14] (17-3) It's a shame the CS bonus doesn't work any more with them, otherwise they'd be a solid religious civ. They used to be able to get apostles that could go toe to toe with Mongolia. Now, they're left with rushing holy sites. Which isn't horrible, but I don't think they can be propped up much longer relying solely on that. Hungary also has fast holy sites (and even the buildings) going for it, but he's on the precipice of being eliminated. It's getting increasingly hard to justify Monty still being in this game.
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [13]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [23]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [11]

 

[monikernemo]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [24]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [19] (18 + 1) Missionaries and apostles that swim fast spread religion quickly too.
Lautaro/Mapuche [9]
Mansa Musa/Mali [23]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [2]
Montezuma/Aztecs [14]
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [13]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [23]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [8] (11 - 3)
The reason why Mali and Russia can go for desert folklore or dance of the aurora lies in the fact that they start generating faith from turn 1.
Issues with Canada is that they have no real faith generation bonus early and yet are heavily reliant on dance of the aurora for future faith generation, which spells doom.
If you fail to snag dance of the aurora there goes your entire religious game.The pantheon is much better spent on Goddess of the Hunt.

Even their unique unit is a substitute for naturalist that does not require faith.

 

[Noble Zarkon]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [19]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [24]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [19]
Lautaro/Mapuche [6] 9-3 One of the weakest civs left for this type of victory, no great boosts for it.
Mansa Musa/Mali [24]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [2]
Montezuma/Aztecs [14]
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [13]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [23]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [9] (8 + 1) They're not a top 10 religious civ but stronger than a few left on this list, the opportunity cost of Holy Sites is less with them as they won't be fighting any surprise wars (for or against)

 

[Dantesedge]

Tamar is supposed to be at 22. She keeps getting a ghost point for some reason. Moderator, if I'm wrong, please step in.

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [20] (19+1) Before this thread I would have never though Mongolia would be effective in religion. Yes, they don't have any bonus faith generation like the others which I think is important (their biggest negative in religion) but good grief those are some strong apostles!
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [24]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [19]
Lautaro/Mapuche [3] (6-3) The mountain bias gives strong adjacency bonuses but what else does Lautaro offer? +10 CS for apostles - yes, but it is highly situational, completely outside of your control, and hard to plan a victory around (I have the same problem with their domination game). They can be effective in religion but only if everyone else is in a Golden Age at the right moments. The other civs here are better (except Matthias but I'm still spreading my votes).
Mansa Musa/Mali [24]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [2]
Montezuma/Aztecs [14]
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [13]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [22]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [9]

 

[Drivingrevilo]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [20]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [24]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [19]
Lautaro/Mapuche [3]
Mansa Musa/Mali [24]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [2]
Montezuma/Aztecs [14]
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [10] (13-3) I'd 100% eliminate him before Canada. As someone said earlier, Spain's bonuses function as religion propping up domination, not vice versa. He doesn't get any bonuses to great prophets, he doesn't get any bonuses to faith generation – indeed, it actively sets him back to chase a religion early on, because that means he isn't building military infrastructure or campuses. But conversely, even though Canada doesn't receive any bonuses to great prophets, he can afford to dedicate 100% of his resources to earning one, at little opportunity cost, because he has near certainty that he's safe from being murdered.
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [22]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [10] (9+1) Also, regarding 'Dance of the Aurora', I'll make three additional points. First, you're only likely to miss out on it if Peter spawns in the game, and that's just bad luck in general vis-a-vis a religious victory. Second, if you do miss out on 'DotA', other good pantheon options exist for Canada (e.g. 'Earth Goddess'). And third, despite what people repeatedly say, Canada is not dependent on tundra like, say, Mali is dependent on desert, or Indonesia is dependent on the coast. I've had games as Wilfrid where I spawned in rainforest right next to a desert, and I did absolutely fine. The point about Canada is that they can settle in tundra, not that they have to; and since he can settle wherever he wants to, 'DotA' is not actually a fundamental requirement for him to do well at RV.

 

[Lily_Lancer]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [21=20+1] This one is much better than anyone else except Aztec and Russia.
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [24]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [19]
Lautaro/Mapuche [3]
Mansa Musa/Mali [24]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [2]
Montezuma/Aztecs [14]
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [10]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [22]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [7=10-3] Not be able to declare war on CS makes it harder to get a pantheon than any other Civ, that's a real malus.

 

[TCBB]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [21]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [24]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [19]
Lautaro/Mapuche [0] (ELIMINATED) I’ll finish him off. Mountain starts are good for religion, but everything else is kinda tangential - plus, a good holy site spot is probably ruining a good Chemamul spot.
Mansa Musa/Mali [24]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [2]
Montezuma/Aztecs [14]
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [10]
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [22]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [8] (7+1) I don’t even care that much about Canada. But what on Earth are you talking about LilyLancer? Why would killing city states have anything to do with grabbing a good pantheon? I was running it over in my head, trying to give you the benefit of the doubt; but I can’t think of a single way that declaring surprise wars on city states is related to pantheons. Looking at your posts on here and other threads, I’m forced to the conclusion that you’re someone who enjoys being contrarian for the sake of contrariety. So please, don’t, it’s just tedious.
Anyway, like I said, not hugely invested about Wilfrid. I just don’t like seeing Civs voted down for no reason at all, especially when others have eloquently explained Canada’s strengths in a lot of detail. You can disagree with them, sure, but only if you back it up with actual arguments of your own.

 

[Leucarum]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [21]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [24]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [19]
Mansa Musa/Mali [24]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [2]
Montezuma/Aztecs [14]
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [7] (10-7) Philip could use a boost to scoring a religion in the first instance. As it is he's usually better off spreading someone else's religion to claim a domination victory.
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [22]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [9] (8+1) I didn't want to throw a vote here but I will. I'm guessing the reference to declaring on a CS to score a pantheon was related to pillaging for faith. Doing that to a CS is certainly an order of magnitude more effective than running God King. I don't think the bulk of people here are treating this as a min-max problem though, I'm going to treat this as who is best if you play a non-exploity game (Which is why I'm ignoring religious victory through domination also). On that basis I'm going to throw a vote here to keep some parity.

 

[bengalryan9]

Amanitore/Nubia [10]
Chandragupta/India [16]
Cleopatra/Egypt [12]
Gandhi/India [21]
Genghis Khan/Mongolia [21]
Gitarja/Indonesia [20]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Harald Hardrada/Norway [4]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [24]
Jadwiga/Poland [21]
Jayavarman/Khmer [20]
John Curtin/Australia [13]
Kupe/Maori [19]
Mansa Musa/Mali [24]
Matthias Corvinus/Hungary [2]
Montezuma/Aztecs [14]
Pachacuti/Inca [10]
Pedro/Brazil [21]
Pericles/Greece [11]
Peter/Russia [29]
Philip/Spain [4] (7-3) I just think he's got such an uphill battle to even get a religion that it's hard for him to compete. I think if he had some tiny little buff in that area he'd be pretty good, but as it is...
Saladin/Arabia [26]
Tamar/Georgia [22]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [10] (9+1) Some of you are just flat wrong about Canada. I'll address some of these "reasons" point by point below (and then you won't read them and state the exact same incorrect reasoning when you downvote Canada again as soon as you can, but whatever):
1) Regarding the supposed lack of food and production (EDIT: and look, there's someone rolling out this exact same excuse AGAIN), I posted a saved game multiple times where I showed it's a non factor. A lack of production isn't a huge deal when you're not required to produce the same amount of things everyone else does (since you can skip training an army to defend yourself). A lack of food isn't going to rear it's head this early in the game (it's not like you're improving tiles yet anyways!) and can be easily helped by grabbing a religion, which you can do quite easily. I provided proof of this by giving you a saved game with a very mediocre start. Try starting a game for yourself, do exactly what I said to do (research Astrology first, build a couple of units while you wait which are more than enough to handle barbarians, and then as soon as it's done build a holy site and spam prayers), and enjoy an easy religion. If you're so convinced that this isn't the case, start up a game, follow these directions, post the save file, and prove it.
2) Regarding civs with inherent faith production from turn 1, that's what... 3 civs in the game out of 45? Mali's only getting their's if they're surrounded by desert (so they're definitely not taking Dance of the Aurora) and Indonesia only gets their's on the coast (most likely taking Earth Goddess). Peter definitely has an advantage at getting Auroras before Wilfrid does, but the odds of this ONE leader being in any ONE game are low. And even if you miss out on Dance of the Auroras, it's not the end of the world because...
3) Dance of the Auroras isn't the main advantage of Canada's religion game, it's just a very nice cherry on top. Even if you miss out on it there are plenty of other pantheons you can benefit from (free settler, improved camps, divine spark, etc). While missing out on Auroras means you can't take advantage of Work Ethic, Canada can make great use of things like Feed the World, Choral Music, or Jesuit Education, and if you're really concerned about the lost faith there are beliefs you can take to boost that as well. You'll have your pick of the litter here, because...
4) Even if you don't grab the first pantheon, you will almost certainly build the first holy site which sets you up to get one of the first religions (you may get beat to Stonehenge). You start building this Holy Site while everyone else is still training troops, and then you're running prayers while everyone else is still building their holy sites. This is Canada's big advantage - they get a head start at building whatever type of infrastructure they want, and that's a big plus in chasing RV.
5) Finally, Lily has made a lot of really bad arguments in these threads over the years, but that may be one of the very worst. There was never any doubt that he'd downvote Canada again - it's all he ever does - but he could at least *try* to provide an actual reason.

Getting a Pantheon quickly is nice and all, but GETTING A GREAT PROPHET ASAP IS WHAT IS REALLY IMPORTANT. You can't win an RV without one!