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Returning to Civ after a long hiatus, tips?

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Strategy & Tips' started by Mike Hussey, Mar 4, 2010.

  1. Optional

    Optional Deity

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    I didn't even own a computer before 2007 and knew absolutely nada about games, well, board games like Catan I played, but I had never even heard of a single game for which you needed more than a solid wooden table to play it.
    So I came around a bit later. I think it goes for a lot of regular posters here at the moment that they discovered the game a bit later.
    For newer games I would need a better computer as well. Civ IV I can't run. :(

    Civ III I'm hardly playing anymore, as I'm sort of 'been there, done that', and I'm not looking to get back into it. If there are games I'm looking to get back into it are Heroes of Might and Magic III and Age of Wonders Shadow Magic. For those you can make maps and that's sort of a hobby of mine.
     
  2. Aabraxan

    Aabraxan Mid-level Micromanager

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    Mike, I'm curious about the little numbers next to your units in the military advisor screen. Are those HPs? If so, then I've got two more questions: (1) How did you get those; and (2) why are your warriors vets, but swords are regs?

    I got into C3C in 2006, IIRC. I'd been looking for a new game for a while and spotted it at Target for ~$20. Pretty much hooked during the first game.
     
  3. Spoonwood

    Spoonwood Grand Philosopher

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    I played Vanilla about 6 or so months after it first came out (summer/fall of 2002) just like three or four games maybe, then a few years later a few games, and then started in on Conquests back around when I joined here.
     
  4. TheOverseer714

    TheOverseer714 Overseer

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    Im the old codger here, I started playing Civ2 in the mid-90's, moved on to Call to Power, then Sid Meiers Alpha Centauri and its expansion before I bought Civ 3 in 2000-01. I really didn't get into it much until I got Conquests. My interest then waxed and waned until I found this site. I'm all 'waxed' since then.
     
  5. Spoonwood

    Spoonwood Grand Philosopher

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    Oh... I did play Civ I around when it first came out and I did play Civ II also.
     
  6. Mike Hussey

    Mike Hussey Cricketer

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    This is the graphics modpack thread, a lot of user interface enhancements can be found here:

    http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=46100

    And no those aren't unit HPs. To be honest I don't really know what they are, I thought they were going to be some unit statistic but I may have installed them wrongly.
     
  7. CKS

    CKS Deity

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    If you waited with the MGL, that was a mistake. Delaying the Heroic Epic isn't a such big deal, but having the MGL lying around is a problem, because you won't get another until you use the first. Make the army immediately. Just don't fill it until you get your Ansars.

    If you are going to be seriously leader-fishing, you want HE quickly, but there are lots of situations where other things are more urgent. An extra seven swords, for example, give you extra tries at a leader while helping you win your war. Knight-type units are pretty expensive, though, and if I'm balancing the HE against 3 Ansars, I'm likely to come down on the side of the HE.

    (Note, however, that I like 20K and don't like war, so I'd build the HE for culture if I ended up with a MGL and I wouldn't bother to invade Rome until they attacked me.)
     
  8. Mike Hussey

    Mike Hussey Cricketer

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    Yeah, I guess it's a judgement call with the Heroic Epic, but yes you're right about making the army immediately. But in my case the leader was created in enemy territory so I had to first take advantage of the 3 movement and get it to safety before forming the army.

    Just another question; what is the ratio of settlers to military units which is optimal at Emperor? Or just in general how many specialising in each do you need? e.g. 2 settler pumps to 1 barracks city etc
     
  9. Spoonwood

    Spoonwood Grand Philosopher

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    How many barbarians lie around and how aggressive of AIs do you have? On a Sid pangea map with minimal agression you can probably get away with only warrior scouts (if even that) until you have all the cities you can get. I've done this a few times before. That said, with most aggressive AIs you might want some more units while expanding... especially with barbies still around somewhere.
     
  10. Mike Hussey

    Mike Hussey Cricketer

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    My barb and aggression levels are always default, so normal aggression and barbs on level above sedentary. I'm scared if I dumb them down, then I'll get into bad habits and become too passive. I'm in disbelief about the Sid fact though, that's pretty insane, I thought they would be all over you even on least aggression.
     
  11. Mike Hussey

    Mike Hussey Cricketer

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    Pertaining to the Ottoman game I posted earlier, after a few marathons sessions of play, I'm quite close to victory.

    Right after I made the post, the empire was in disrray. I had overextended in expansion by overproducing settlers and workers to consolidate the land won by a relatively easy Egyptian war and my troops were both technologically inferior and stretched quite thin.

    Naturally, the 'smart' Emperor Roman AI sought to gain some of my gain by attacking me and I was caught by surprise (usually I'm not used to the AI declaring on me before I'm ready). An exchanging of cities ensued and over time, I was able to gain more than I lost and also upgrade my Swordsmen to MDIs which helped immensely.

    But by now, the war had taken it's toll on my vast, but stretched Ottoman and I also found myself an age behind in techs, once again. Basically I only had Feudalism, Monothesiem, Invention and Engineering whilst my non-Roman opponents had reached Physics. Naturally I panicked, but remembered one of the games posted on Civfanatics where a member (I think SirPleb) was playing on Sid and managed to gain a whole age of techs by capturing the Great Library before he had Education. So I went to the wonders page, to guess what? The city of Rome which was only a few cities away held this great treasure. This knowledge was enough to persuade me to fight on, capture the wonder, and tech all the way to just before the Industrial Age. But I kinda thought about it and got greedy, reloaded the save and played on deliberately not capturing Rome but all of the other Roman cities, so the other AIs could tech into the Industrial Age and then capture the Library. (Technically, I could have waited even longer, but then the gap in units would have started to show and I would've been a soft target).

    Unfortunately I lost the save which I was going to take the screenies off :(

    After the capture, things were pretty smooths sailing, just pumping out cannons and Siphahi, and mass irrigating to create specialist cities. That last part really helped get me out of a world of trouble as even after I got tech parity, I found IA techs to be really expensive and could only research them at 20-25 turns without specialists, but got it down to 8-9 turns with specialists. (Another thing I've learnt!). Fortunately I got a scientific great leader, researched down the path of Hoover Dam (a path which coincidentally the AI never goes down) pre-built the Theory of Evolution and instantly snagged the Dam making me a powerhouse.

    Which brings us to the present; about 10% of world area away from a domination victory:





    Late game I usually don't bother fully managing every single border city because I just can't be bothered, and it won't affect the outcome of the game.

    I think in this game particularly I've learnt a lesson in persistence in seemingly bad situations, (yes even though it was nothing compared to many of the other worse situations the games posted here on harder levels) and also a lesson in mass irrigation to create specialist cities. Before I would always switch to Communism late game, but now I have choices.

    It's also further cemented (in my head anyway) that hospitals are useless. Just space your cities closer, and they will yield the same number of specialists compared to that of higher 'quality' cities spaced further apart.

    Thanks again for all your help everyone!

    Still need to improve my game on archipelago map types though, where everything just doesn't flow as well and it's not smooth sailing.
     
  12. Optional

    Optional Deity

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    Yes, that's the way. I had overlooked an issue with my post.
    From this sentence it's not clear to me whether you used your scientific leader for a 'Scientific Golden Age' or for Hoover. I hope it was Hoover, because there's a bug with the science age; the feature doesn't work. It seems to work; research turns go down, but then start to lag, and you end up using the same amount of turns as without the scientific leader.
    Always use the scientific great leader for a wonder, spaceship part or maybe a city improvement.
    From your minimap I doubt whether you actually needed the Hoover Dam. For the Hoover Dam to be effective you first need a bunch of factories, which is a big shield investment. Sometimes, if you're already big, it's quicker to build Cavalry/Infantry/Artillery straight away, as that can be a quicker route to victory than waiting for factories.
    I can't know for sure if that was the case here, though, it depends on how strong your opposition still was in the early IA.
     
  13. Mike Hussey

    Mike Hussey Cricketer

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    Actually after reading your post and some minor thought I think you're right about the fact that Hoover's is not absolutely crucial or even necessary, especially considering these two factors: I'm not in Communism (so only a handful of decent shield producing cities) and that I'm not yet up to tanks or the more expensive units. Even with the capital it only went from 57 to 76 shields per turn which still builds Sipahi in 2 turns (although the small wonders and armies do take a shorter time).

    Also you don't need a factory to feel the effects of a hydro plant but yes the pooling bonuses are much more useful.

    And yes, I did use the SGL to rush the Hoover ;)
     
  14. vmxa

    vmxa Deity

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    That is news to me, so you are saying you get the shield boost anyway?
     
  15. Bucephalus

    Bucephalus Shooting from the lip....

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    Yep.

    A power plant increases shield output by 50%, irrespective of there being a factory present; of course, under most circumstances a factory is present since it is a requirement for building a power plant.
     
  16. Optional

    Optional Deity

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    Well, I never knew that either. I always trusted what the civilopedia says:



    So what is it then that gets boosted by 50% if the factory output is irrelevant? The total amount of shields before curroption and multiplier effect?
     
  17. Bucephalus

    Bucephalus Shooting from the lip....

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    You surprise me, Opional; I didn't think anyone took any notice of the 'pedia - it's full of errors like that. Obviously it should say "increases shield output by 50%".

    I've just ran up a quick demo in the Editor and (hopefully it will appear as an attachment, if I can remember how!). In it you can clearly see that the base shield output is doubled with a factory and a power plant.

    Edit: And now I have to eat humble pie; having removed the factory, the power plant has no effect on base shield output - sorry for the misinformation. :blush:

    Jeez, just 9 months away from the game and I'm talking like a newbie.
     

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  18. Aabraxan

    Aabraxan Mid-level Micromanager

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    Like Optional, I just assumed the pedia was correct, and that the pp boosted factory output, not shield output. But based on Buce's picture, it doesn't look like the pedia's quite correct, either. In Buce's picture, base shields = 9. Total shields = 18. If the pp were actually increasing factory output, rather than shield output, shouldn't shields be around ~15? Base shields (9) + 50% (4 for the factory, rounding down) + 2 (pp = 50% of factory output) = 15. Rather than Base (9) = 4.5 + 4.5 = 18. The pp increasing shield output, rather than factory output, seems to be more in line with the way all of the other multipliers work, AFAIK.

    So, it's an all-or-nothing gig, right? Either you have the factory and the pp, both of which actually increase base shields, and get bonuses from both, but if you remove the factory, the pp quits working?
     
  19. Bucephalus

    Bucephalus Shooting from the lip....

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    Yeah, that sums it up, Aabra.

    What's really irritating me is that having thought about it, I actually knew this (honest!) - I'm just rustier than I realized.
     
  20. Mike Hussey

    Mike Hussey Cricketer

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    Wow, dam! I always thought the Hydro plant worked without a factory! Now I won't be building or even rushing the Hoover most of the time.
     

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