Reversal of dominance and tribute has crippled the authority tree

[Gamewizard]

Good points...then why was it changed?

 

[Funak]

Good points...then why was it changed?

Well, first of all 1 point of culture was dropped from the culture policy, making it far less dominant. Then a bunch of base production was added to the tree, giving you the ability to actually build monuments in your cities, making keeping up in culture bearable.


If I had to guess why the policies were swapped however I'd say it was because someone pointed out the synergy between tribute and Imperium, where the free culture from Imperium makes your newly settled city trigger border-growth and get free tribute yields.
If I had to guess I'd say both sides are both fairly viable now, +2 culture and +1 happiness in all cities is still pretty bonkers, even if it has some anti-synergy with Dominance, one of the policies wants you to keep your soldiers in your cities and one wants you to go barbhunting.

 

[Aldebaran1997]

How about change on-kill bonus to on-train bonus or something like that?
I guess it would be more efficient when combined with authority tree scailing bonus.

 

[hokath]

If you had science on-train bonus at the start, you could just spam scouts or warriors (selling them for gold or gifting them to a CS) until you had writing. It's a bit of a perverse incentive.

 

[Daya]

Alternative to on-kill boni: Culture and/or Science per Army-Maintenance.
Honor-Players would be the ones with huge standing armies for their science/culture. However it would come at the cost of huge gold-issues.
Other Pros:
- Can be powerful early on, when single points of culture/science are worth a lot
- Scales semi-fine i guess
- Works well with gold-related acts of war like pillaging/plundering trade routes to maintain your armies
- Should probably be codeable without major issues (?)
- Wouldnt rely on how much barbs you can get (on high difficulty usually close to none)
- No Science/culture snowballing due to limit gold

Con:
- High-difficulty AIs would still be favored due to their starting army (possible solution: make ais free units maintenance free)

 

[Aldebaran1997]

If you had science on-train bonus at the start, you could just spam scouts or warriors (selling them for gold or gifting them to a CS) until you had writing. It's a bit of a perverse incentive.

I really don't think about that strategy.

Then, how about diversificate that kind of benefit?

For example, small science boost from training units and modest science boost from killing enemy units, or something like that. <- this is only an example, not my suggestion.

On-Kill Bonus : I think it's good while play early game barb-hunting period, but it FORCES player at war ever.

On-Train Bonus : Yeah, it can motivate players to grow their armies, but it's so deteriorateful if bonus values were too high.

On-Promote Bonus : Same with On-Kill.

Pillage Bonus : It has all pros & cons from On-Kill and On-Train.

 

[Fasteraubert]

I tend to pick up the authority opener and the right side border expand policy in every game I play. That + progress opener and right side food/culture on building policy. The order depends on map/civ I choose / speed but that combination of 4 policys is the only thing I've found that consistently let's me catchup and surpass the AI on deity. I had a recent Aztec game using the 3/09th version and then a more recent cultic game using the same version and strategy, taking the left side authority science on kill and for Celts taking the Morigan pantheon for more on kill bonuses. (Marathon deity 16 civs/40 city states / huge map pangea).Both AI and city state units seem to 1-2 shot barb camps which makes it VERY hard to get the culture/faith/ etc from barbs but the Aztec game I ended up attacking city states to kill units and steal workers and got into a ton of wars and my empire was basically funded and research he'd by murder (as it should be). The Celt game I ended up sending 3 of my unique units around as a group depending tribute......holy jeepus was that awesome. Several hundred culture each time in addition to the gold/ etc was amazing. Also in both games once city states start getting the barbarian invasion quests you can get 10 easy kills or more per city. 500+gold/culture/faith/science. There are 3 such city quests active at once in my cultic game relatively near it's other and its gotten me 3 Techs and 2000 gold already.

Also later in the game as the era multiplier increases the bonuses...... The authority +food/production on border growth and the progress food/culture on finishing a building combo rediculously. Alternating city pop growth and buildings finishing every 1-3 turns.

 

[Atlas627]

Alternative to on-kill boni: Culture and/or Science per Army-Maintenance.
Honor-Players would be the ones with huge standing armies for their science/culture. However it would come at the cost of huge gold-issues.
Other Pros:
- Can be powerful early on, when single points of culture/science are worth a lot
- Scales semi-fine i guess
- Works well with gold-related acts of war like pillaging/plundering trade routes to maintain your armies
- Should probably be codeable without major issues (?)
- Wouldnt rely on how much barbs you can get (on high difficulty usually close to none)
- No Science/culture snowballing due to limit gold

Con:
- High-difficulty AIs would still be favored due to their starting army (possible solution: make ais free units maintenance free)

There already is a sort of culture-per-maintenance ability in the garrison-for-1-happiness-2-culture ability. And I'm a big fan of this idea, because it doesn't get affected nearly as much by difficulty level or map size/type.

 

[Kolaris]

The change was necessary because it was ALWAYS go left side first, right side second. Now, you have to decide if that free settler is worth all that lost early science.

Huh. On Marathon + Immortal I always went right side. Tribute and whatever the culture from garrisons is called now was the core of Authority imo.

But that was a month ago, and the amount of changes since then have been extreme.

 

[Sendaf]

I've picked up authority first in my last few games and the right side of the tree is my usual go 2. Even when warmongering I try to build 1 or 2 wonders and without the +culture per garrison I have not been able to keep up culturally. I also usually suffer a lot of unhappiness without the happiness bonus.

I'm not to concerned if I fall a little behind scientifically early game as I know I'll make up for it later with science per kill.