RFC Europe playtesting feedback thread

[kbk]

The problem is that you cannot raze these cities due to your culture there. If you play in Emperor and allow the Arabians to survive, they'll rapidly outtech you and it will be impossible to recapture Aleppo or Antioch.
What exactly does the Byzantine core consist of? (I thought Iconium was part of it and therefore starting to build walls/church there)

You can raze them usually after the second time they declare independence. So far, I'm pretty sure the core area is the part marked by the Byzantine spawn zone in the reference folder. Your starting cities in Greece, Thrace, Constantinople, and the two Western most cities in Anatolia.

In a recent build I was able to capture Antioch, and about 2 turns shy of Aleppo, so it is certainly possible with catapracts and bombards. With Byzantium your upkeep costs are so high, any city of your core area you need to shed ASAP or it will bring down your research even without reaching point where your techs cost more.

 

[AnotherPacifist]

You can raze them usually after the second time they declare independence.

I've recaptured all 4 of eastern-most cities at least 6 times now, usually I wait at least 3-4 turns before I capture them, and I still can't raze them.

 

[3Miro]

I've recaptured all 4 of eastern-most cities at least 6 times now, usually I wait at least 3-4 turns before I capture them, and I still can't raze them.

Let them be independent. Capture them only once for the UHV shortly before the due date.

 

[General Toad]

I think that the Hungarian UHV is bugged (No Ottomon Cities in Europe in 1526)- The year is 1596, and no Ottomon cities are in Europe, but on the Victory Screen, it's still marked as "Not Yet."

 

[AnotherPacifist]

Let them be independent. Capture them only once for the UHV shortly before the due date.

I'm talking about being the Byzantine emperor (i.e. worse than Deity with the penalties). I cannot research anything above swordsmen or lancers, let alone catapults, and even if you have the techs, it'll take FOREVER to build them. (Nicaea with Heroic Epic builds a measly spearman in 4-5 turns, let alone a lancer which took 10)

 

[operafantom]

I don't know if it's too late or not, but on the map (I know that should be on the map thread but I didn't find it) next to the river Tisza there is a honey resource, somewhere where Tokaj is. Can that be changed to wine? The wine of Tokaj is pretty famous, I don't really know about the honey of Tokaj .
Most of Transylvania is dense forests, what about reducing it, so Hungarian settling territory would become bigger a little bit. In fact Transylvania wasn't uninhabited, and on the current version of the map it normally is. (I will attach a picture about how I imagined it) I would also find it better if Hungary would have a lot of gold. In the medieval times, the biggest amount of gold was mined in Hungary, and the second most of silver after Bohemia. Maybe Transylvania should be the place where these resources could be found, in fact Bulgarians also possessed them before the arrival of Magyars.
Sorry that I come up with these ideas that late
EDIT: pictures

 

[3Miro]

I don't know if it's too late or not, but on the map (I know that should be on the map thread but I didn't find it) next to the river Tisza there is a honey resource, somewhere where Tokaj is. Can that be changed to wine? The wine of Tokaj is pretty famous, I don't really know about the honey of Tokaj .
Most of Transylvania is dense forests, what about reducing it, so Hungarian settling territory would become bigger a little bit. In fact Transylvania wasn't uninhabited, and on the current version of the map it normally is. (I will attach a picture about how I imagined it) I would also find it better if Hungary would have a lot of gold. In the medieval times, the biggest amount of gold was mined in Hungary, and the second most of silver after Bohemia. Maybe Transylvania should be the place where these resources could be found, in fact Bulgarians also possessed them before the arrival of Magyars.
Sorry that I come up with these ideas that late
EDIT: pictures

We are not changing the size of othe map or what it generally covers, but the specifics of the terrain are still to be worked out. Hungary does need a lot of improvement, particularly since they get virtually no resources.

When I get back I will ask you to post a WB save with the proposed changes. You will have to start a game with Burgundy and without moving any units, go to WB and make the changes.

 

[merijn_v1]

Something very strange:

939: Germany spawns
942: Germany collapsed
945: Germany respawned (I think because of the spawn zone)

 

[operafantom]

Okay, so can I send other changes as well? I mean that I will look at resource maps of the middle ages, and then I try to be as accurate as it is possible.

 

[3Miro]

Okay, so can I send other changes as well? I mean that I will look at resource maps of the middle ages, and then I try to be as accurate as it is possible.

Hungary is the one that needs a lot of work and maybe couple of others. Some areas have been carefully considered and sometimes we have historically inaccurate placement, but useful for gameplay purposes. Other than that, yes you can submit a map with changes, just make sure you follow my instructions (i.e. start a game with Burgundy....)

 

[Wessel V1]

At the moment, I'm playing Hungary. The strategy was to get Islam, Orthodoxy and Catholicism ASAP and then convert to Catholicism. Luckily, I had all three religions by 936 AD. Now, I'm going to convert all my cities to all religions, thus maximizing my use of the UP. Of course I didn't want to waste hammers and time on Catholic missionaries, since they would come from the Pope.

And so they came. The missionary SW of Varad will do it's job the next turn, but the missionary NW of Varad is standing there for some turns already, and won't go away the next few turns. Possible bug or just a bad accident?

 

[rob-art1985]

Some Viking Barbs attack the Norse. I suppose, it should be abort.

And please check the Citynames again. Poland founds "Lwo;w"...

 

[3Miro]

At the moment, I'm playing Hungary. The strategy was to get Islam, Orthodoxy and Catholicism ASAP and then convert to Catholicism. Luckily, I had all three religions by 936 AD. Now, I'm going to convert all my cities to all religions, thus maximizing my use of the UP. Of course I didn't want to waste hammers and time on Catholic missionaries, since they would come from the Pope.

And so they came. The missionary SW of Varad will do it's job the next turn, but the missionary NW of Varad is standing there for some turns already, and won't go away the next few turns. Possible bug or just a bad accident?

Once Varad is converted, you have Catholicism in all of your cities. The Pope is probably trying to find another target for his Missionary and if all the countries that have OB with the Pope are completely Catholic, there will be no new target. The AI would then flag the unit as useless and disband it (so that it doesn't drain the economy).

 

[3Miro]

Some Viking Barbs attack the Norse. I suppose, it should be abort.

And please check the Citynames again. Poland founds "Lwo;w"...

Did the Viking came with a ship or did it just spawn there?

 

[Wessel V1]

Once Varad is converted, you have Catholicism in all of your cities. The Pope is probably trying to find another target for his Missionary and if all the countries that have OB with the Pope are completely Catholic, there will be no new target. The AI would then flag the unit as useless and disband it (so that it doesn't drain the economy).

I only discovered the second missionary when I saved the game, the first was already standing there for 3 or 4 turns I think. Also, there has been another one wandering near Raguza, perhaps to convert a Byzantine city, and the one near Varad is still standing there for no good reason.

 

[jessiecat]

Did the Viking came with a ship or did it just spawn there?

I had the same thing. Three shiploads arrived and landed 6 beserkers W of Tonsberg. My 2 archers held them off though. Also more barb triremes than before.

 

[3Miro]

I had the same thing. Three shiploads arrived and landed 6 beserkers W of Tonsberg. My 2 archers held them off though. Also more barb triremes than before.

We should stop the spawn of Viking Barbs after the spawn of the Norse.

We can also along those lines add some Barbs near the Byzantine borders representing the pre-Bulgaria Bulgarians and Slavs as well as the pre-Muslim Arabs.

 

[AnotherPacifist]

Oh, the poor Byzantines. Is it enough that they start with no workers and now they are even more expensive to make for them, and for proto-Bulgars to come and pillage? If so can we at least give them 1 worker to start?

On the same note, can you fix the perennial German collapse due to capturing by barbs of their poorly fortified cities when they spawn? After all, in the 800's there should be no more "barbs" from Germany to Poland, which is where the majority of the barbs hide currently.

 

[3Miro]

Oh, the poor Byzantines. Is it enough that they start with no workers and now they are even more expensive to make for them, and for proto-Bulgars to come and pillage? If so can we at least give them 1 worker to start?

On the same note, can you fix the perennial German collapse due to capturing by barbs of their poorly fortified cities when they spawn? After all, in the 800's there should be no more "barbs" from Germany to Poland, which is where the majority of the barbs hide currently.

I will work on the barbs, however, the workers for the Byzantines are cheaper in Alpha 4.

 

[jessiecat]

I will work on the barbs, however, the workers for the Byzantines are cheaper in Alpha 4.

What happened to the barbs in Morocco? The barb rush on Tangier hasn't happened at all in Alpha 3 or 4. I'd also like to have the Barbary pirates operating from Algiers and Tunis from about 1200 to 1800. They could use the Xebec warship (replaces the privateer?) for which there's some nice art. See below.