RNG GP production?

[lindsay40k]

Right now, Great People are born when a city accumulates 100GPP, then 200GPP, etc.

Is there a mod that instead makes each GPP cause a single turn 'roll' with 1% chance (then 0.5%, then 0.33%, etc) to pop a GP? If not, would such a rule be possible to code?

I've been musing over the effects this would have.

- There'd be no more 'wasted' GPP sitting in cities that will never overtake a GP farm to the next GP generation.

- There'd be no more 'dedicated' multiple GP farms with one city building all GE wonders, another building all GS wonders, etc. Wherever you build a wonder, it's going to have a chance of popping a GP every single turn.

- GP pollution could no longer be avoided; if you build the Parthenon in Osaka, you'll just have to accept that your Japan has an artistic tradition and may generate a genius sculptor, no matter how many Scientists work in Kyoto's GL.

- The above means the 'Oracle rush MC >Forge > GE > Pyramids' gambit would be nerfed. City A building Oracle and City B building a Forge will be no different to building both in the same city, in terms of chances of guaranteeing the first GP is a GE.

- Sushi would become more overpowered, as it'd support a lot of viable GPP. Meh, I prefer the more balanced Corporation mods anyway.

- If you absolutely need a certain GP (say, to found a Corporation, Religion, or to win a tech race), then instead of tinkering with a few cites to get, say, a GM farm to beat the GS farm in the race to next GP, you'd take an empire-wide focus on Merchants.

- The 'feel' of GP generation would be more organic and less 'spreadsheet'. (Some like to have a deterministic game, some like to feel like they're immersed in a world.)

- If you need to pop a GE, you can run an Engineer in every Forge and sack every Merchant and Scientist. And wait.

- Multiple GP's per turn are theoretically possible. Someone, somewhere, will pop ten in a city in one turn.

- OCC won't be affected much, but large empires will pop GP's more often.

 

[Mec AntiKythera]

Interesting idea. I'm not sure I feel a need for it but I do agree that it would make things feel more Real World, more organic as you state. It would increase the role of luck quite a bit, just the way that the start you roll is luck dependent the number and type of GP's would get would be out of your control to a greater extent than with the current system. A bit like the will-he-or-won't-he factor that AI DoWs have. Though I'm not sure I understand how it would work. Are there points involved? Is it a percentage chance per point per turn with the flavor being a second RNG roll?

 

[damerell]

It might be simpler for GPP to accumulate empire-wide, with perhaps the later GPs being more expensive to compensate.

 

[TheMulattoMaker]

Don't know of a mod like that but if you find one I'd like to check it out. That seems like it'd be more fun, and it's also more realistic.

 

[Mec AntiKythera]

- Multiple GP's per turn are theoretically possible. Someone, somewhere, will pop ten in a city in one turn.

So what you mean is that each and every specialist and wonder has a small percent chance per turn, every turn, to pop a GP? In that case someone, somewhere, will pop ten in a city in one turn, ten times in a row.

 

[lindsay40k]

So what you mean is that each and every specialist and wonder has a small percent chance per turn, every turn, to pop a GP? In that case someone, somewhere, will pop ten in a city in one turn, ten times in a row.

Yes, yes they will. And someone, somewhere, will kill ten fresh tanks with ten wounded spearmen, ten turns in a row.

I'm all in favour of a mod that would give control on the effects of RNG on combat to make it partly or wholly deterministic. I'd also like the option to make the birth of an Einstein, Cheops or Moses something that can be encouraged, but not something that can be planned and micromanged to the year.

 

[duckstab]

So what you mean is that each and every specialist and wonder has a small percent chance per turn, every turn, to pop a GP? In that case someone, somewhere, will pop ten in a city in one turn, ten times in a row.

Another way to do it might be to roll the dice for a GP once per turn, with the odds of birth related to an empire-wide GPP counter. If you reset the counter to zero after a GP was born you'd minimize the chance of them being born close together.

Overall, though, I like the idea.

 

[lindsay40k]

Hmm. Suppose two cities are at 99GPP and pip over 100 in the same turn. How does the game presently decide which city gets the GP? Does it totalise the cities in turn, presumably order of founding, and pop a GP in the first one to make the roll?

 

[Knightly_]

I don`t like the idea because it ultimately takes away a large portion of control from the player in terms of bulbing certain techs. With a small GP change every turn moves like math-bulb HA rush, early academy GS, medieval engineering bulb, double education bulb for fast liberalism etc. basically become gambles. There is already enough uncertainty in the GPP system in its current state.

Generally i think its a bad idea to include small percentage chances (that the player has no control over) with high impacts into strategy games (i know there are already a lot in Civ4).

 

[Mec AntiKythera]

Hmm. Suppose two cities are at 99GPP and pip over 100 in the same turn. How does the game presently decide which city gets the GP? Does it totalise the cities in turn, presumably order of founding, and pop a GP in the first one to make the roll?

I have no idea, unfortunately.

I don`t like the idea because it ultimately takes away a large portion of control from the player in terms of bulbing certain techs. With a small GP change every turn moves like math-bulb HA rush, early academy GS, medieval engineering bulb, double education bulb for fast liberalism etc. basically become gambles. There is already enough uncertainty in the GPP system in its current state.

Generally i think its a bad idea to include small percentage chances (that the player has no control over) with high impacts into strategy games (i know there are already a lot in Civ4).

I see what you mean, it inhibits, or rather complicates, the laying out of a grand strategy that is not dependent on luck. I do like making a plan and then trying to execute it but I also agree that the current GP system doesn't feel very natural. Engineering the traits of people to be born is a delicate subject anyway. It would feel more realistic if it concerned Research Projects established to obtain a certain result, with the chance that they would fail or reveal something completely different than what you were originally after, instead of birthing Great People.

I guess it is a question of how much you want to determine and how much you want to respond to things that happen. Is the game a world greater than yourself that overrides your plans and desires or are you greater than the game controlling every aspect of the world in detail?

Maybe you could have both, Grand Research Projects that are aimed at a particular goal and Great People who just happen along but do so proportionally, in the mean, to how focused a civilization is on creating the conditions for their happening. GRP can be budgeted and planned while GP cannot.