Separate Gold and Science cities?

[ModernKnight]

Hi folks,

I want to make Wall Street and Oxford in the best city(s), but I'm not sure I understand the mechanics well enough, to know which they should be. This is if my civ tries to keep its research percent high (usually 70% early game, 80% mid game, 100% end game).

With research being so high, shouldn't Wall Street depend heavily on which which city has the most money after base money, like from shrines? (Assuming one has spread their religion) Whereas Oxford is base gold plus non-base gold? For yet another wrinkle, though, one of your starting cities is likely to have the most non-base gold and have a pretty high base gold, meaning, it's entirely possible that one of your starting cities should get both WS and OU?

Related question: What are the best additional wonders to pair with WS and OU and/or your best base and non-base gold cities?

Thanks if you can help!!

RK​

P.S. I like to win by Space Race; I don't like combat so much. (Not yet anyway... it'll be Yet Another Thing to play with some day!)

 

[Tatran]

Holy city -> Wall Street
Bureaucracy -> Oxford University
If your capital is a holy city you can build both national wonders here,
but I doubt you'll have enough food to support all those specialists.

 

[JackOfClubs]

You are entirely correct that Oxford and Wall Street calculate their benefits differently but don't worry so much about "base" and "non-base" gold. Oxford should go in the city that has the highest rating and Wall Street should go in the city with the hightest gold. You can look in the domestic advisor and sort on the relevant column by clicking the little icon at the top.

These will almost always be different cities so I don't think I've ever placed them together. They are also usually not production cities so you want to avoid placing things like Ironworks or the Heroic Epic.

If Oxford is in your GP Farm (which is usually the case with me) then placing the National Epic there would be good. Also, the Globe Theater has a good synergy with lots of specialists because it removes the happiness limit, but you may have other plans for it. On the other hand, both of those wonders generate Artist GPP, so if you are worried about diluting your scientists Scotland Yard and Red Cross both generate Scientist GPP. But they are not really suitable for a non-productions city so take that into account.

Frankly I've never really thought about Wall Street synergies with other wonders. I usually just throw it at my biggest gold city and forget about it.

 

[ModernKnight]

Tatran, you're saying use Beauracracy at the capital city? I get Beauracracy when it first appears, but then usually get Free Speech when it first appears. You keep Beau. permanently? Do you move your palace to a city with lots of cottages?

(Can one super gold capitol make up for a lot of towns not getting +2?)

Jack, Right I use F1 but was worried about complications like, research rate changing, towns growing, civics changing. But I guess I can review the few top cities and project how things will go.

Er - What's a GP farm - gold piece farm city, with lots of cottages and gold specials? (Is there a "dictionary" for Civ abbreviations somewhere?)

Thanks! - MK

 

[Tatran]

I keep running Bureaucracy until the end if,
a) Capital is production heavy -> Wonder building + expensive SS parts

b) Capital is coastal + commerce heavy -> trade routes are also affected
by 50% from Bureaucracy + harbor, you'll need a lot of towns running
Free Speech to compensate the 50% commerce loss.

 

[Gryman]

@ ModernKnight

Oxford University - put Oxford in your highest city, I assume you are playing with cottages. This should also usually be your capital so you can take advantage of Bureaucracy since its +50% bonus is applied to before any other or multipliers. Prioritize Library, Academy, University, Monestary, Observitory and Research Lab.

Remember that , not or , is the product of cottages. The sliders turn the commerce into science and gold respectively.

Wall Street - That being said, if you intend to run the slider near 100% then won't play a big part for Wall Street. Place Wall Street in a Shrine city that is creating without . To fully utilize the Wonder; farm all of the tiles and run Merchant Specialists to provide an additional 3 base each at 100% science slider, as well as 3 with Representation. Prioritize Market, Grocer, Bank, Shrine and spreading the Shrine's Religion.

I will often leave these Wonders standing alone in their respective cities. These are the two most powerful economic National Wonders in the game. Let their cities focus on creating beakers and gold rather than sinking hammers into additional wonders.

 

[Admiral Kutzov]

A GP farm is for Great people. there's a list of abbreviations somewhere, but I'm too lazy to find the link.

^^what jack said.

re synergy for WS, build it in a city with the big bulb and colossus.

you're playing monarch or lower right? never play much above monarch myself. it seems you have too much time on your hands and should move up a level...

 

[ModernKnight]

Thanks everybody, I'm seeing things better now. Your comments make a lot more sense Jack, knowing GP is Great People, not gold pieces.

Right, I've been at Monarch highest... taking it down a notch or two sometimes to remember the good old days, laugh. Maybe I can move up with some of these tips.

I see a lot of people tweak Specialists a lot. I would hate to have to do that for every city. It's already enough hassle just to keep cities from outgrowing themselves (i.e., catching Stop Growth at the right time). I could handle a couple of cities watching their specialists (Oxford and WS city)... but all of them? Yuck.

 

[Khanate]

Tatran, you're saying use Beauracracy at the capital city? I get Beauracracy when it first appears, but then usually get Free Speech when it first appears. You keep Beau. permanently? Do you move your palace to a city with lots of cottages?

Cottages + Trade Routes + Gold Buildings + Science Buildings + Wall Street + Oxford Univercity + Beauracracy = one hell of a capital. If you have a smaller empire, with fewer cities than you opponents, always stick with beau. and maximize everything in capital.

 

[oyzar]

oxford can also go in your GP farm together with NE assuming you want to generate loads of GS.

 

[xanadux]

Something for long term planning ... If you've generated a great artist or 2 that you don't have much use for, consider settling them in the future wall street city (shrine city if you have it). Having a settled great artist or 2 can really help keep the early midgame research going.

 

[ModernKnight]

Thanks guys, these are all great ideas to play with.

I see Jack's guide to an SE economy. Is there one to a CE economy, or is it as simple as building all the cottages you can?

 

[pigswill]

If you're planning on running high research slider then it can make sense to have your shrine city as a production centre and build your gold multipliers (market,grocer, bank,wall st) more quickly.

 

[Cookie Crumbs]

Ideally, you want your shrine city and commerce city to be the same one so that you can build Oxford and Wall Street in it. That way, you get maximum money/beakers regardless of the slider position, and is generally preferable since you don't normally run 0 or 100% science.

 

[sugerdady87]

I build all science and gold building in any type of economy. (SE or CE)

 

[ModernKnight]

Would you guys even build Towns on grass hills?

I guess it all depends. Let me re-phrase:

If you were hard pressed for both gold and for production in a crappy city, and/or the city mainly had grass hills around it, what would you make many or any towns on grass hills?

 

[Lord Chambers]

I generally mine everything I have the food to work. If that adds up to so much production that its commerce is pathetic it is a "production city." If there are only a couple of hills around then they'll just help the city make buildings. If I run out of buildings to build or have the ability to cash rush the hills are remade into cottages and windmills.

 

[GoodGame]

double post

 

[GoodGame]

Pretty much you want to build Wall Street in the city with the highest base tile commerce (simply the gold on the tiles, but also the gold of any Great People that were settled in the city, and any specialists that you're running in that ). If you build Oxford there as well AND run a high research slider, then you'll have good synergy. If you run say 50% research and 50% gold, the 50% gold ISN'T fed to the Oxford, but simply goes to the treasury. In such a city, I'd build an academy, and run merchants to further settle great merchants, or I'd cottage spam.

Hi folks,

I want to make Wall Street and Oxford in the best city(s), but I'm not sure I understand the mechanics well enough, to know which they should be. This is if my civ tries to keep its research percent high (usually 70% early game, 80% mid game, 100% end game).

RK​

P.S. I like to win by Space Race; I don't like combat so much. (Not yet anyway... it'll be Yet Another Thing to play with some day!)

 

[ModernKnight]

Thanks everyone...

gg, that makes sense - and is an easier way to handle it mentally. At least for folks of small mental capabilities like me, laugh.

I guess that's why some on this thread have differed about having WS and OU in the same city - if you're science isn't high most of the time, it might not be a good idea.

And of course I've never tried a deliberate SE. I bet that changes a lot.

It's amazing how much there is to learn and experiment with, given a "few" special concepts. I still can't believe they got the AI to consider so many things - even though it still, of course, makes dumb mistakes relative to a human.