Compromise
Emperor
- Joined
- Apr 17, 2006
- Messages
- 1,601
I'll post a summary of my city investigations here for anyone interested. (Feel free to ignore this post if you like.)
I started a custom archipelago/archipelago game with 17 AI opponents plus me as Peter. I used worldbuilder to isolate myself so that I wouldn't have any wandering AI units finding me and messing up the tech path (in case they start with fishing or research BW right away and give us a "civ knows the tech" bonus).
I also edited it so that I started on one of 2 floodplains, had a grass forest across the river, had a spicy forest in the second city ring, and had 2 clam resources (the nearest would be one distant from the initial site, 2 distant from the across-the-river site). I figured that would be enough to simulate the first 30 turns.
As a sidenote before everyone loses interest, I also tried this start by going Mysticism->Polytheism and I *was* able to get Hinduism. (Though I still think it will be best to get a religion from a neighbor.)
I ran the following cases (I tried to have roughly the same worked-tile assignments, but there is some room for variation in these results):
1) Settle start spot, start with fishing, start a warrior, pause warrior & switch to workboat (3760BC), grow asap to size 2 (3250BC). When the boat finishes, the warrior is at 2/22H. Get to size 3 in 3190BC. Get BW in 3160BC. Revolt to slavery.
On turn 30 (3100BC), this case finds us in slavery, with netted clams, at size 3 (10/39F), warrior at 10/22 and 22B into next tech (I chose The Wheel in all cases; it has no prereq.).
2) Same as (1) exceptafter growing, I worked the spicy forest instead of maximizing growth. This had us at size 2 in 3400BC, a workboat in 3340BC (w/warrior down to 5/22H). Grew to size 3 and got BW in same turn: 3160BC.
On turn 30 (3100BC), we are in slavery, have netted clams, are at size 3 (6/39F), have warrior at 13/22) and have 19B toward The Wheel
3) Again with Fishing->BW, start warrior, interrupt for boat, except this time, move across the river to settle on the grass forest (one-turn capital founding delay). Grow to size 2 in 3460 (and then work both floodplains). Boat in 3310, warrior lost 3H and is at 5/22H. BW and size 3 both in 3130BC. Warrior to 11/22
On turn 30 (3100BC), we're in slavery, have netted clams, are at size 3 (0/39F), have 11/22H into warrior and have 5B into The Wheel
4) Settle across the river, bronzeworking first: Size 2 in 3640BC, BW & size 3 in 3370BC. Finish warrior 3340BC. Fishing comes in in 3130 when 2nd warrior is at 14/22H. Revolt in 3100 (turn 30!) to slavery (could have done it 1 turn earlier, but we need a turn into the boat before whipping it). 3070 whip boat.
On turn 30 (3100BC) , we're 3 turns from whipped boat, have 1 warrior complete, have 2nd warrior at 14/22H and are at size 3 (32/39F) (but we need to whip a pop to get the boat).
5) Settle across the river, BW first, worker first: BW in 3340, worker in 3280, forest couple be chopped in 3130 (then halted for fishing to finish). But the chop in 3100BC yields only 30H.
On turn 30: At size 1 (18/33F), Boat still 5 turns away, first warrior at 8/22, have worker (he's either bored or chopping).
Bottom line: Settling across the river is, as expected, about a 1 turn delay in city productivity. (This was before Iainuki's post about preferring to plantation rather than cottage the spices.) Starting with a worker and bronzeworking would be nice, except that other than chopping, there's nothing for this worker to do.
So, my conclusion was: start with fishing, then bronzeworking. Get the boat out quickly while concentrating on growing the city, and feel free to cross the river if we think that's a better spot to settle.
I started a custom archipelago/archipelago game with 17 AI opponents plus me as Peter. I used worldbuilder to isolate myself so that I wouldn't have any wandering AI units finding me and messing up the tech path (in case they start with fishing or research BW right away and give us a "civ knows the tech" bonus).
I also edited it so that I started on one of 2 floodplains, had a grass forest across the river, had a spicy forest in the second city ring, and had 2 clam resources (the nearest would be one distant from the initial site, 2 distant from the across-the-river site). I figured that would be enough to simulate the first 30 turns.
As a sidenote before everyone loses interest, I also tried this start by going Mysticism->Polytheism and I *was* able to get Hinduism. (Though I still think it will be best to get a religion from a neighbor.)
I ran the following cases (I tried to have roughly the same worked-tile assignments, but there is some room for variation in these results):
1) Settle start spot, start with fishing, start a warrior, pause warrior & switch to workboat (3760BC), grow asap to size 2 (3250BC). When the boat finishes, the warrior is at 2/22H. Get to size 3 in 3190BC. Get BW in 3160BC. Revolt to slavery.
On turn 30 (3100BC), this case finds us in slavery, with netted clams, at size 3 (10/39F), warrior at 10/22 and 22B into next tech (I chose The Wheel in all cases; it has no prereq.).
2) Same as (1) exceptafter growing, I worked the spicy forest instead of maximizing growth. This had us at size 2 in 3400BC, a workboat in 3340BC (w/warrior down to 5/22H). Grew to size 3 and got BW in same turn: 3160BC.
On turn 30 (3100BC), we are in slavery, have netted clams, are at size 3 (6/39F), have warrior at 13/22) and have 19B toward The Wheel
3) Again with Fishing->BW, start warrior, interrupt for boat, except this time, move across the river to settle on the grass forest (one-turn capital founding delay). Grow to size 2 in 3460 (and then work both floodplains). Boat in 3310, warrior lost 3H and is at 5/22H. BW and size 3 both in 3130BC. Warrior to 11/22
On turn 30 (3100BC), we're in slavery, have netted clams, are at size 3 (0/39F), have 11/22H into warrior and have 5B into The Wheel
4) Settle across the river, bronzeworking first: Size 2 in 3640BC, BW & size 3 in 3370BC. Finish warrior 3340BC. Fishing comes in in 3130 when 2nd warrior is at 14/22H. Revolt in 3100 (turn 30!) to slavery (could have done it 1 turn earlier, but we need a turn into the boat before whipping it). 3070 whip boat.
On turn 30 (3100BC) , we're 3 turns from whipped boat, have 1 warrior complete, have 2nd warrior at 14/22H and are at size 3 (32/39F) (but we need to whip a pop to get the boat).
5) Settle across the river, BW first, worker first: BW in 3340, worker in 3280, forest couple be chopped in 3130 (then halted for fishing to finish). But the chop in 3100BC yields only 30H.
On turn 30: At size 1 (18/33F), Boat still 5 turns away, first warrior at 8/22, have worker (he's either bored or chopping).
Bottom line: Settling across the river is, as expected, about a 1 turn delay in city productivity. (This was before Iainuki's post about preferring to plantation rather than cottage the spices.) Starting with a worker and bronzeworking would be nice, except that other than chopping, there's nothing for this worker to do.
So, my conclusion was: start with fishing, then bronzeworking. Get the boat out quickly while concentrating on growing the city, and feel free to cross the river if we think that's a better spot to settle.