Then I'd say Optics for Music may need to give map also from Gandhi and Compass for Drama or HBR from Augustus. Next turn hopefully we will have Optics and Music to trade to Boudica for either Eng or Feud.
We should research Philo next (4 turns) then Lib and try to take astro from it.
Who to hit I'd say Boudica. Only worry is Charlie getting involved with his super pike things. I would defo change to Free Religion would improve diplo generally all round and give research boost. If we are to concentrate on units soon Org Religion is little use and expensive.
Gandhi and the Khmer seems to be those we want to hit first, they have the most wonders. (We haven't met the Khmer).
I agree with researching Philo and then Lib to take Astro.
Trading I'd do Gandhi: Optics for Music, Augustus: Compass for HBR and Archery, and next turn what we can get from Boudica.
When we really start building our army, I think we should switch to Theocracy for the extra experience. Should I do this now, or wait?
I'll start Uni of Sankore in Ulundi, and Maoi in ChokoCentral. Continue with building up our army, and tech and currency buildings in the cities that need them.
I suppose the million dollar question is what do we want to start warring with. Given teh AIs better performance in BtS at defending, I'd want to have grenadiers or rifles, coupled with trebuchets. Should we take something from Liberalism that helpd towards Rifling (Printing Press or Replaceable Parts). I haven't had a chance to look at the save (will try tonight), how close is everyone else from Liberalism?
All others have Philo but not yet Education that is why I would hold off trading that until we are nearer Lib. We should whatever get the gold off Joao to enable us to boost sci rate a little for a few turns. My choice of Boudica was based on being nearest and lowest in score to enable us to get foothold on new continent. If we go for Gandhi for score and wonder reasons he is further away. Which ever we choose we should be able to get some help from the other as they are worst enemies. I like Oz think we need rifles and grens to be able to start a winnable fight. I would take Astro from Lib as would allow us to trade routes and resources with other continent along with observatories to help push sci. Plus we will need the boats.
McArine - I think you have missed the fact we are the Khmer
I did the trades, but that made Boutica pissed on us :-( so no trades next turn.
I also got Engineering from Joao for our four low techs.
All the other opponents are gathered on the same continent.
At the end of turns, we are second on score.
Liberalism is in two turns, and everyone wants education. So time to decide what we want.
Silver is found in a Mine at Elephantastic
Pericles built University of Sankore, and Ghandi built Taj Mahal on the last turn, and thus starting a golden age.
Oh, and those Khmer guys built Maoi sculptures ;-D
Spoiler:
Turn 1: Education -> Philosophy. Chokocentral Mace -> Maoi. Yoda Market -> Monestary. Boudica wont trade anything. Everybody wants Education, I trade optics to Ceasar for Drama some gold and World map. All the other opponents are on the same continent.
Turn 2: Uni of Sankore is built by Pericles.
Turn 3: Gandhi wants education, we decline. Ulundi Maceman -> University. Carib Courthouse -> Forge. Got Engineering from Joao for HBR, Literature, Drama and Compass.
Turn 4: Elaphantastic Maceman -> University. CoCoMa Forge -> Market. Silver is found near Elephantastic
Turn 5: Philosophy -> Liberalism. Nobamba Maceman -> University. Yoda monestary -> University. Another Great Prophet in ChokoCentral.
Turn 6: Zzz
Turn 7: Chokocentral Maoi -> University.
Turn 8: Zzz
Turn 9: Zzz
Turn 10: chokocentral University -> Trebuchet. Ulundi University -> Trebuchet. CoCoMa Market -> Monestary. Carib Forge -> Granary. Ghandi completes The Taj Mahal and gets a golden age.
Postturn: Liberalism is in 2 turns. We're not that far behind Pericles and Ghandi on the Power Graph.
We're definitely getting close to war - who should we pick on? Since we're probably going domination and not conquest, we should target civs who have numerous wonders instead of just lowest on the food chain.
Our trades need to focus on getting us rifles and grenadiers. I'm guessing we're going to cool it on wonder building for a while. I would also agree about going off of organized religion when we start this build up.
I would leave Liberalism with one turn left in it and start teching Printing Press. If anyone gets Education then we pull the trigger and grab Astronomy, otherwise work towards Replaceable Parts. Start building trebuchets and maces (to upgrade to rifles).
Checking the save Augutus has PP but will not trade for Education. I guess he may nearly have it. As Astro is more beakers and has trade benefits I think we should finish Lib and take this. Then we should hopefully be able to trade for PP.
Just a few points before I play. Will wait to see if any more replies or suggestions.
I have looked at the save and these are some comments/concerns/plans.
Diplo:
Jao and Charlie are WHEOORN so war is coming sooner than later to our world.
Jao can declare at pleased as far as I know so I would expect him to declare on us as he can't get to anyone else. Charlie will go for someone on his landmass I forget who is worst enemy is. I hate him coz he can go on a vassalizing run in the medieval/early renaissance era.
Techs:
I think we should go ahead with lib maybe delay two turns to put some beakers in PP for trade purposes but i would like to see if we are in agreement on this. I guess I would prefer to just go straight for it.
Astro will obsolete colussus and we are working a ton of coast and even the odd ocean tile. We are near happy/health caps on the next growth in most cities.
Military:
Given diplo situation I will try to locate a SOD in Jao's land and will have to hope charlie doesn't get traction on his continent.
Health/Happy
As forest come down health cap will drop. Ulundi is about to lose a health when the current cottage completes. Also, once war starts happy will become a bit of a problem so I don't think we want to grow too much more.
I would like to whip the uni's being worked in various cities as soon as astro is in. Then do we build oxford in Yoda or do we focus completely on milatary.
Cocoma: could stop growth from now and work a plains mine and get 20 hammers for units or 24 for buildings. It is food poor so not a good place to whip IMHO. In hindsight sacrificing either copper or marble for the grassland hill and fish might have been better. Regardless this has good production at a low pop which is not a bad thing. There is no barracks so i could first build barracks and then maces or pump a few three turn workers as we are working a few marginal tiles accross the empire and need some cottages/workshops. Given Jao situation I think i would go barracks here.
GPP:
We get a great person in 6 turns at Yoda
GP-16% keep
GS- settle ?
GE-keep?
GSPY-settle? Yard in capital?
Ok will play tomorrow morning so comments/suggestions welcome.
Sorry about the delay. Holiday season always makes gaming harder for me.
I went straight for lib, then put beakers into nationalism and PP so that I could trade with ai without giving up too much cash. I build barracks in cocoma and the other city with floodplains. Pretty much build units-trebs, maces, and a couple of long bows for cities.
Traded lib for some gold, Ceasers world map and PP
Traded paper and music to Jao for feud + map + 200 gold
Traded lib and 235 gold to ghandi for guilds. Could have researched guilds a bit to reduce cost but wanted to go to gunpowder to open up banking trade with ghandi.
Pericles came looking for astronomy but i told him to leg it.
Charlie dowed ghandi as expected.
Checked Jao out and he is building carracks and gallyes like crazy. I didn't see too many troops yet but plenty of boats. WTH
There are about 8 boats at evora. Would have preferred if boats were stacked on other side. Jao had a scouting crossbow all the way in our east.
Helped us out by taking out a barb approaching our worker.
He is now friendly but could already have chosen us as a target. Can't tell what he is upto though.
I reseached gunpowder after a few turns in the PP and Nationalism.
We can get Banking from Ghandi and his world map for gunpowder.
THat would let us go straight to RP.
I am trying to avoid trading for astro but can get
We are now third in score.
We got a great engineer a good outcome as so many things we can do with him. Any ideas? I don't know the situation with the Taj so that is probably out as we could get pipped in the inter turn. Maybe save for Mining corp.
No one seems to hate ceaser so i did a trade for his sugar for one of our fish.
Have not revolted to free religion yet. We can change two civics at once so should decide to revolt when we have to civ changes IMHO. What do you guys think?
Oh i also built a settler at central. I figure we should take the close by (low maintenence) site in the south west. I sent a longbow over there but the settler is still not moved and sitting in central.
edit:
we could colonize an island instead with the settler.
Spoiler:
Turn 200, 1400 AD: The thoroughly religious Celtic state is dealing with an outbreak of heresy in some segments of its population.
Turn 200, 1400 AD: Holy Roman authorities are rumored to have captured a fugitive fleeing from Celtic justice. No confirmation is available.
Turn 200, 1400 AD: A tragic mining accident near the Indian city of Varanasi has claimed the lives of hundreds of their miners.
Turn 200, 1400 AD: Pericles adopts Representation!
Turn 201, 1410 AD: Suryavarman II is the first to discover Liberalism!
Turn 201, 1410 AD: You have discovered Liberalism!
Turn 201, 1410 AD: The borders of Yoda have expanded!
Turn 201, 1410 AD: Shah Jahan (Great Merchant) has been born in Bibracte (Boudica)!
Turn 202, 1420 AD: You have discovered Astronomy!
Turn 202, 1420 AD: James Cook (Great Merchant) has been born in Bibracte (Boudica)!
Turn 204, 1440 AD: You have discovered Nationalism!
Turn 204, 1440 AD: Boudica adopts Mercantilism!
Turn 204, 1440 AD: Boudica adopts Organized Religion!
Turn 204, 1440 AD: "Running With the Bulls", an annual ritual practiced by the people of Augsburg, is gaining worldwide renown.
Turn 205, 1450 AD: You have discovered Printing Press!
Turn 205, 1450 AD: You have discovered Feudalism!
Turn 207, 1470 AD: You have discovered Guilds!
Turn 207, 1470 AD: You have trained a Longbowman in Chokocentral. Work has now begun on a Settler.
Turn 207, 1470 AD: The borders of Carib have expanded!
Turn 207, 1470 AD: Tipu Sultan (Great Prophet) has been born in Vijayanagara (Gandhi)!
Turn 207, 1470 AD: Gandhi's Golden Age has ended...
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Alexander Graham Bell (Great Engineer) has been born in Yoda (Suryavarman II)!
Turn 208, 1480 AD: William T. G. Morton (Great Engineer) has been born in Aachen (Charlemagne)!
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Gandhi's Golden Age has begun!!!
Turn 209, 1490 AD: You have discovered Gunpowder!
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Enterprising Celtic grocers in Gergovia have struck a deal to import surplus food from rural farmers outside the normal range of city business.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Charlemagne has declared war on Gandhi!
Can trade astro for constitution as well as the gunpowder banking trade.
But this seems less urgent although it will allow a three civ change
rep/free/merc as opposed to free/merc.
I prefer the latter.
edit:
We still have to decide about the GG. I had fogotten all about him till the end of my set.
Hey cubbies hope alls well. Its been quiet in here.
Looking at the messages i see ghandi's golden age started so he must have completed TAJ so I am glad i didnt go for it with GE. I think founding mining will end up being best use or rushing a wonder like the Kremlin.
Ghandi seems to be the man with the wonders plus he is at war so we get diplo points with charlie if we attack him
We could also harass Jao with privateers as he has lots of boats and we could do a lot of damage.
I've never used the carack but i am guessing privateers can take them out.
I think Oz is up.
It has been real quite out here...I'll give Oz until the weekend. If he hasn't jumped in by then, I'll play again.
I'll have to look at the save, but you're probably right about going after Gandhi first. I'm hesitant to start messing with Joao since he is our 1 friend right now. Plus, he doesn't really have many wonders that would help our score, but we would still be getting closer to domination. Our attacks have to gain us something and I don't see him as a big gain.
Obviously rushing a wonder with the GE will be the best use at this point in the game - but which wonder do we really need the most? Or do we rush IronWorks to help build more wonders?
Lookibng at the save, Gandhi indeed seems the one to attack. He's got all teh wonders and three holy cities, any city that doesn't have a wonder gets razed and we keep the good ones. Rome seems the best to attack after that. We don't seem to have any spies or galleons though!
The Great General should be merged in the Heroic Epic city (which we haven't built ), the other saved for shrines or corporations.
We are three techs from Rifling, which is when we can attack but if the free GM from Economics is available, we should chase it first. After Rifling, we should chase the free GS from Physics.
I'll probably play tonight (about 12 hours) so get your thoughts in now.
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a good outcome as so many things we can do with him. Any ideas? I don't know the situation with the Taj so that is probably out as we could get pipped in the inter turn. Maybe save for Mining corp.
), the other saved for shrines or corporations.
