SGOTM 09 - Xteam

[ShannonCT]

When settling on the corn, there were little micro-manages (new word?) that only occurred to me after practicing. Suspect this is the same for settling 1S and would encourage you to go additional turns to get past some of those if needed and thus take advantage of all your testing.

The first moves are pretty obvious. Research Agri-Mining-BW-Wheel. Build worker. Farm both corn. Start warrior but build 2nd worker at Pop2. Build 2 windmills, because BW is not done yet. From there, the MMing decisions increase exponentially. First settler at Pop2, or Pop3, or Pop4? Chop forest and then build mill OR build mill straight away to delay chop a few turns? Chop settlers aggressively or save more forests for Oracle? Skip pottery or AH or both until after preisthood? You get the point.

I definitely want to pause after the second border pop to redo the practice map, so we can game the the next 30 turns with perfect knowledge of the surrounding area. If the team wants me to take more turns, I will.

 

[ShannonCT]

Unless something unusual happens, would like to see you play about 20 turns.

Are we set on tech path and builds? Read the details in post 80 but thought there was some tweaking to do? Perhaps it has been done through several posts and I am lost again? Would appreciate a summary of what we are planning to do.

As our border expansion is fairly rapid, where do we want the Scout headed next? North to check on a second city site, further south or west?

Thanks.

I'm not using post 80 as a guide. That practice game showed me that Oracle needs to be expedited. See my previous post for my plan for the first 20 turns. But I want to stop at turn 14 for a more exact plan for the run-up to Oracle.

I think the scout needs to look for a city site to the south and west and find as many AI as possible. The 2N site for a 2nd or 3rd city is already money in the bank. Whether there's more seafood up there or not, I think there's only one good place to put that city. Athens's second border pop will reveal all anyway.

 

[leif erikson]

Sounds good.
Just crossin' my t's and dottin' my i's.

Good luck.

 

[Cactus Pete]

The first moves are pretty obvious. Research Agri-Mining-BW-Wheel. Build worker. Farm both corn. Start warrior but build 2nd worker at Pop2. Build 2 windmills, because BW is not done yet. Once a windmill is built (or will be next turn) and BW is in, don't forget to revolt. From there, the MMing decisions increase exponentially. First settler at Pop2, or Pop3, or Pop4? Chop forest and then build mill OR build mill straight away to delay chop a few turns? Chop settlers aggressively or save more forests for Oracle? Skip pottery or AH or both until after preisthood? You get the point.

I definitely want to pause after the second border pop to redo the practice map, so we can game the the next 30 turns with perfect knowledge of the surrounding area. If the team wants me to take more turns, I will.

Sounds good to me.

 

[rrau]

Do we want to wait until the settler is out to revolt so we don't lose a turn getting the settler out? Then revolt the turn the settler is on the move? Definitely want to revolt before the second city is settled.

 

[Cactus Pete]

Do we want to wait until the settler is out to revolt so we don't lose a turn getting the settler out? Then revolt the turn the settler is on the move? Definitely want to revolt before the second city is settled.

Normally that would be optimal, but in this Back-To-The-Future scenario we can revolt to Environmentalism (increasing yields from windmills) and Police State (25% bonus hammers for military units), as well as Slavery.

 

[PaulisKhan]

I'm reading all posts but I don't have much to add to the plan in motion.

I do like settling 1S on turn 1 and the 2nd or 3rd city to share the corn and pick up the fish.
I suspect I'll probably be making a case for more workers later, but that can wait =)

 

[ShannonCT]

Do we want to wait until the settler is out to revolt so we don't lose a turn getting the settler out? Then revolt the turn the settler is on the move? Definitely want to revolt before the second city is settled.

Good question. It depends on how big we are (and how many windmills we're working) when we start the first settler. I will be stopping before we come to that point, so let's continue to give this thought.

I have a busy day today. I can start my turnset in about 15 hours.

 

[leif erikson]

I
I do like settling 1S on turn 1 and the 2nd or 3rd city to share the corn and pick up the fish.

Yes, unless Copper is near! Then we have a decision to make...

EDIT - Looks like CFR and CRC are playing one game while Wonder Bumpkins and Misfits are playing another.

 

[Frederiksberg]

I'm fine with settling 1S. Seems like a safe bet no matter what the rest of the map looks like.

Second border pop will come 13 turns after settling. Maybe that's where my turn set should end. We can redo the practice map with the new info.

Stopping for a review of our plans after 13 turns seems like a good idea. Then we can discuss issues like this:

First settler at Pop2, or Pop3, or Pop4? Chop forest and then build mill OR build mill straight away to delay chop a few turns? Chop settlers aggressively or save more forests for Oracle? Skip pottery or AH or both until after priesthood?

 

[leif erikson]

Just a quick note, a reminder from Alan in the Maintenance Thread.

Happy Hunting SCT!

 

[Cactus Pete]

Good question. It depends on how big we are (and how many windmills we're working) when we start the first settler. I will be stopping before we come to that point, so let's continue to give this thought. Depends on number of turns between time when revolt is useful [windmill(s) completed, warrior being built] and arrival of settler. One turn of production in a new city won't equal several turns of 2-4 extra commerce and perhaps a few extra hammers until many turns into the game (when the new city has grown large). Loss of production and growth in capital is temporary (and we actually lose more when the city is larger during revolt). A turn could be critical if we were going to build the Oracle in our second city or were desperate to get a military unit built, but neither seems likely to apply, so probably want to leverage the short-term gains.

I have a busy day today. I can start my turnset in about 15 hours.

Whenever you are ready.

 

[DJMGator13]

Just a quick note, a reminder from Alan in the Maintenance Thread.

Happy Hunting SCT!

I good option to avoid mixing up the saves is to go into the globe view and place a label in the practice game.

 

[ShannonCT]

Turn Report for turns 0 - 14 (4000BC - 3160BC)

T0) Scout S-SE
Settler South

T1) Settle Athens -> worker
Start agriculture
Scout 2W

T2) Scout SW

T3) Borders expand
Scout 2W
I see borders to the SE. Maybe barbs?

T4) Scout W-SW

T5) Scout S-SW

T6) Scout NW-SW

T7) Agriculture -> Mining
We meet Hammurabi's bowman in the west. No phalanx rush that way.
Scout 2SE

T8) Scout 2SE

T9) Scout N-NE

T10) Scout survives wolf attack with 0.8 strength, stops to heal

T11) Scout N-E
Athens worker->warrior
Start corn farm

T12) Mining -> BW
Scout S-SE

T13) Barb galley sails into view of scout
Scout S-SE

T14) Borders expand, confirming barb borders
Scout 2SW

The southlands:

The northlands:

Save has not been uploaded to the server.

 

[leif erikson]

Lots of screenies.

Inland doesn't look too hospitable.

We have our city site to the north and, perhaps, one to the south either on the Cow near the Rice and Clams or one tile north?

Looks like an early Work Boat for scouting might get caught by a Barb Galley.
But it would be helpful to have a look east.

Had to be Bowmen...

 

[ShannonCT]

After I moved the settler south on T0, I played around with the shift-right-click trick to see what tiles the computer thought were good places to settle. I checked every tile within a 27x27 square around Athens. Let Athens's tile be the coordinate (0,0). Here are the tiles where the settle button lit up:

On the eastern landmass: (4,1) , (5,3) , (6,2) , (6,3) , (6,4) , (7,2) , (7,3) , (7,5) , (7,6) , (8,3) , (8,4) , (8,5) , (9,3) , (9,4)

Further in the Southeast fog: (10,-10) , (12,-10) , (13,-8) , (13,-9) , (13,-10)

South of Athens: (1,-4) , (1,-5) , (0,-5) , (0,-6) , (-1,-6) , (-1,-7) , (0,-8) , (-1,-8) , (-1,-9) , (-2,-9) , (-2,-10) , (-3,-10) , (-3,-11) , (-2,-12) , (-3,-12) , (-1,-13) , (-2,-13) , (-4,-13)

West of Athens: (-1,3) , (-3,-4) , (-5,-3) ----> (-14,3) , (-10,4) , (-14,4)

Southwest of Athens: (-13,-5) , (-12,-5) , (-11,-6)


Now the interesting thing is that when the settler made its way down south of Athens, the tiles that had lit up in the fog before coincided perfectly with the coastal tiles down there. So it seem that we can predict where other coastlines are.

 

[ShannonCT]

Here's a map of where the settle button lit up:

Spoiler :

 

[leif erikson]

Very interesting that it should light up along the coast line?

I don't really trust those darn blue circles most of the time.

EDIT - Perhaps those settlers are looking for beach front property, or a nice vacation?

 

[rrau]

Settle on the cow and lose the hammers from it or settle north of it by the river and lose a watermill but get freshwater health benefits. Neither of those sites would be able to share forest preserves with the capital, but if we settle one N of the cow, a city E of the rice would get the fish also (unless barb culture gets it) and there would be some forests to share for the preserves.

If we settle NW of the clams, the city would have cows and clams and be able to share a forest with the capital and the city E of the rice could share the cows and potentially have 3 food sources and could be a good GP site.

 

[Cactus Pete]

Settle on the cow and lose the hammers from it or settle north of it by the river and lose a watermill but get freshwater health benefits. Neither of those sites would be able to share forest preserves with the capital, but if we settle one N of the cow, a city E of the rice would get the fish also (unless barb culture gets it) and there would be some forests to share for the preserves.

If we settle NW of the clams, the city would have cows and clams and be able to share a forest with the capital and the city E of the rice could share the cows and potentially have 3 food sources and could be a good GP site.

Until we have Sailing and galleys, not sure any of those sites are desirable, as the barbs will surely destroy our fishnets. (Hopefully there are no barbs on the eastern island chain, and the ice barier will allow us to operate a GP farm 3N of capital as planned.)