Another reason to build farms in the capital, which Dhoomstriker glossed over and called even, is that we currently have a library and a market in Delhi, so the multipliers for science and gold are even. We will have a university well before we have a grocer, and we'll have observatories way before getting a bank (if that ever happens). So Delhi will always have a +25% science advantage from basic buildings in addition to the Oxford bonus. It's still a close call, but the extra GPP, which are needed in this game, tip the scales toward building farms everywhere, including Delhi in my opinion. For an SE, it's all or nothing. I don't want to do it half-ASCII...
BTW, I was thinking that we are behind in getting our Specialist Economy going. However, on about the 4th hole (I played golf today), I realized that we're on track (obviously I was playing lousy at golf so my mind wandered to you clowns ). We just settled half of our cities in the last 10 turns. Two of our other five cities already have libraries and the other three have been busy building settlers, workers and such. I'm not sure when we would have fit in an earlier library anyway. Plus, we were cutting things close research wise in our push for the 'Mids, so we really needed the cottages in Riverdale, Bedrock and Delhi. I think we're in good shape. We just need to get our libraries built (after granaries but before lighthouses) and start hiring some scientists.
Dhoomstriker, can you build granaries, libraries and lighthouses and grow our cities to 5+ pops in the next 20 turns?
If we have 4 galleys, keep 2 east and 2 west. If we have 3, flip a coin... Actually, if we get into a war, it will likely (hopefully) be with someone to the east (e.g. Zara, Izza or AI6). I think it makes sense to keep 2 galleys east just in case. One galley in the west should be enough to shuttle a couple of missionaries to the mainland and a worker to Goldfish, right?
Another reason to build farms in the capital, which Dhoomstriker glossed over and called even, is that we currently have a library and a market in Delhi, so the multipliers for science and gold are even. We will have a university well before we have a grocer, and we'll have observatories way before getting a bank (if that ever happens). So Delhi will always have a +25% science advantage from basic buildings in addition to the Oxford bonus. It's still a close call, but the extra GPP, which are needed in this game, tip the scales toward building farms everywhere, including Delhi in my opinion. For an SE, it's all or nothing. I don't want to do it half-ASCII...
BTW, I was thinking that we are behind in getting our Specialist Economy going. However, on about the 4th hole (I played golf today), I realized that we're on track (obviously I was playing lousy at golf so my mind wandered to you clowns ). We just settled half of our cities in the last 10 turns. Two of our other five cities already have libraries and the other three have been busy building settlers, workers and such. I'm not sure when we would have fit in an earlier library anyway. Plus, we were cutting things close research wise in our push for the 'Mids, so we really needed the cottages in Riverdale, Bedrock and Delhi. I think we're in good shape. We just need to get our libraries built (after granaries but before lighthouses) and start hiring some scientists.
Dhoomstriker, can you build granaries, libraries and lighthouses and grow our cities to 5+ pops in the next 20 turns?
If we have 4 galleys, keep 2 east and 2 west. If we have 3, flip a coin... Actually, if we get into a war, it will likely (hopefully) be with someone to the east (e.g. Zara, Izza or AI6). I think it makes sense to keep 2 galleys east just in case. One galley in the west should be enough to shuttle a couple of missionaries to the mainland and a worker to Goldfish, right?
Part of the issue is whipping Work Boats and Galleys, which will indeed get us going faster towards those building goals. A lot of the overflow Hammers have been going into Granaries, which makes most of them whippable at Size 2 instead of at Size 4--a big bonus.
"Fine, fine, build some Work Boats. Galleys don't make Cities grow faster, though!"
Well, I would say that they do if their purpose is to keep our Work Boats and Fishing Nets (settled Work Boats) from being Pillaged, right?
If we have 4 galleys, keep 2 east and 2 west. If we have 3, flip a coin... Actually, if we get into a war, it will likely (hopefully) be with someone to the east (e.g. Zara, Izza or AI6). I think it makes sense to keep 2 galleys east just in case. One galley in the west should be enough to shuttle a couple of missionaries to the mainland and a worker to Goldfish, right?
Okay, I can follow that approach. Having 2 Galleys on the westside could shave a turn off of Missionary transportation, once Saladin gets off of his butt and makes a Missionary for us to start off the process.
Having 2 on either side would also give us a backup boat in case of a Barb Galley encounter that we lose.
Otherwise, out will come the coin (to see where to send the surviving boat after the northern Barb Galley encounter).
While I like the idea of going to war with Spain, I'm pretty sure we should just wait since I feel sure Izzy will DoW us soon enough. Though they do deserve it after that game!
Summary of the Current Situation Diplomatic
Toku's Worst Enemy is still Zara
Isabella's Worst Enemy is us
No one else has a Worst Enemy
Saladin is Friendly towards Toku and now towards Justinian, too
No one else is Friendly towards anyone else at the moment
Resource Trading
Every AI wants Silver from us, but we currently need that Happiness for Delhi when we are running Police State instead of Representation
Isabella, Saladin, and Zara would all take Rice
No Resources are currently being offered to us on the trading table
Tech Trading
Saladin and Toku both know Construction and Feudalism, but neither will trade either one to us
Zara also knows Construction and won't trade it to us
Civics + Religion
We are currently running Police State, Bureaucracy, Slavery, Decentalization, and Organized Religion and can switch again in as few as 5 turns
We are currently running Confucianism and can switch again in as few as 0 turns
Research
Our Science Rate is currently at 0%
We are researching Aesthetics
Building part of the Shwedagon Paya also stops me from continuing my "whipping addiction" of constantly whipping Confucian Missionaries from here using overflow Hammers from the previously-whipped build item
Bedrock: Granary (it was just whipped) -> Galley -> Library
Wheaties: Granary (it was just whipped) -> Apostolic Palace (partially chopped, with Confucian Missionaries being whipped into it using overflow Hammers)
Grt Person Farm: Lighthouse (it was just whipped) -> Library -> National Epic (with Temples being whipped into it for overflow Hammers)
Risaia: Work Boat -> Granary -> Work Boat -> Library
Crabs: Work Boat (it was just whipped) -> Work Boat -> Granary -> Lighthouse
Three Clams: Galley -> Work Boat -> Granary
Sugar Daddy: Work Boat -> Granary
Please note that I listed the order of COMPLETION of build items; the order of STARTING these projects is not necessarily linear. For example, in many cases where I am building a Work Boat, I am whipping the overflow Hammers into a Granary, so that the Granary can accumulate enough Hammers to be whipped efficiently at City Size 2 instead of growing to City Size 4 without a Granary and without sufficient improved squares to grow to that Size within a reasonable time frame.
Worker Actions
Worker 1: 2S to the G (1W of the GPig) and Farm/Stop -> Move 1S Grassland (NW of Grt Person Farm) and Farm -> SE (GPF), S G and Farm -> N, NW (1SW of the GPig) and Road/Stop -> NW GFor and Chop the Forest into Crabs -> NE FP, NE FP Riv and Farm (SE + S of Risaia)
Worker 2: Chops the PHFor 1W of Wheaties into the Apostolic Palace -> 1N PH and Mine -> S PH (W of Wheaties) and Mine -> SW GFor (SW + W of Wheaties) and Chop -> Chop the GFor into Wheaties -> E Plains (SW of Wheaties) and Farm
Worker 3: NW (Silverado), NE GFor and Chop/Stop -> NE GRiv, NE GRiv (1E of Delhi) and Farm/Stop -> Move to the PH NE + N of Delhi and Mine -> Move S + S to GRiv (1E of Delhi) and Farm -> STOP Worker 3 (near Delhi) from Irrigating -> SW GRiv Cot (1S of Delhi) and Road (to complete it) -> NE GRiv (1E of Delhi) and Farm -> 1SE (SE + E of Delhi), Chop/Stop -> 1SW GRiv For and Chop -> Chops the GRiv For (SE + S of Delhi) into Delhi -> Farms on the GRiv (SE + S of Delhi)
Worker 4: 1N GJungle Sugar and Plantation
Worker 5: 1N onto the PFor (SE + E of Delhi) and Road (completes the Road here) -> 1E GRiv, 1E GRiv and Farm (W + W of Riverdale) -> STOP Worker 5 (near Riverdale) from Irrigating -> SE PRiv and Farm/Stop -> Stay on the PRiv (1SW of Riverdale) and Farm/Stop -> NW GRiv (W + W of Riverdale) and Farm -> SE PRiv and Farm/Stop -> 1S GH, Mine -> N PRiv (SW of Riverdale) and Farm
Worker 6: STOP Worker 6 from Farming -> SW G, NW G, W onto Galley 1 (heading to Goldfish) -> Unload 1W Des (1N of the DesH Gold outside of our borders) -> NW DesH Gold and Mine -> Builds a Road on the DesH Gold -> SE Des, Road
Please note that I left out dates because whether or not we will get The Hagia Sophia will affect the dates.
Non-worker Unit Movements
Warrior 1: Explores a bit of Saladin's lands on his way to Goldfish to guard the City
Warrior 6: Fortifies in Grt Person Farm
Settler 10: Founds Goldfish ASAP
Settler 11: Skips his turn and does not settle Ivory Towers unless an AI Settler Party lands nearby
Settler 12: Moves to the Fish + Incense location but does not settle Mystic within my turnset unless an AI Settler Party arrives nearby--Zara, anyone?
Archer 1: Skips his turn repeatedly to give Settler 11 a second chance to spot AI Settler Parties
Galley 1: Transports a Worker to Goldfish, guards the waters around Goldfish, and eventually goes west to explore
Galley 2: Guards the water around Ivory Towers
Galleys 3 & 4: Fight off the Barb Galley to the north; any survivors go west to guard our Seafood on that side, allowing Galley 1 to explore westward
Work Boat 2: Explores the west
Work Boat 5: Creates Fishing Boats for Crabs' Crab
Work Boats 6 and onwards: Create Fishing Boats wherever they are most needed at the time
Confucian Missionaries: Attempt to spread in Silverado, followed by Three Clams
Build Orders + Citizen Allocation (which squares get worked in each City) + Tech Rate + Civics + Relgion + Whipping + Anything Else that Needs Doing
T175 (25 AD)
Trade Math to Isabella for her 20 Gold to get some positive Diplo Modifers with her, so that hopefully, we will stop being her Worst Enemy
T176 (40 AD)
Bedrock: Built a Granary -> Galley
Bedrock: work the SE Flood Plains Cot
Wheaties: Built a Granary -> Apostolic Palace
Grt Person Farm: Built a Lighthouse -> Settler (to capture the overflow Hammers)
Move Settler 10 1W and Sit down
Name the City Goldfish and Examine it
Goldfish: works the NE Coast
Goldfish: Builds a Granary
T177 (55 AD)
Grt Person Farm: Switch to building a Library until we grow in 2 turns
Riverdale: Whips the Taoist Temple
T178 (70 AD)
Riverdale: Built a Taoist Temple -> Confucian Missionary
T179 (85 AD)
Delhi: switch the NE GRiv Cot to the GRiv Irr and work 2 Corn, GCopper, GRiv Irr, 1S GRiv Cot, and 3 Riv Mines (growth in 1 turn)
Grt Person Farm: Switch the PFor to the 1E Lake
Grt Person Farm: Go back to building the Settler
Risaia: Build a Work Boat
Crabs: Build a Work Boat
Three Clams: Whip the Galley
Three Clams: work the Clam
T180 (100 AD)
Delhi: switch BOTH the PFor to the NE + N GH and the GRiv Irr to the NE GRiv Cot and work: 2 Corn, GCopper, 1S GRiv Cot, 1NE GRiv Cot, and 4 Mines
Riverdale: Whip the Confucian Missionary (growth in 1 turn)
Bedrock: Whip the Galley
Risaia: Whip the Work Boat
Risaia: work the S + S Flood Plains Irr
Crabs: Whip the Work Boat
Three Clams: select the Work Boat
Three Clams: Whip the Work Boat
Three Clams: Work the Clam
Civic Switch: Representation and Caste System
Sugar Daddy: Hire a Merchant in place of working the unimproved Fish
Goldfish: Hire an Artist in place of working the Coast
T181 (115 AD)
Riverdale: Built a Confucian Missionary -> Shwedagon Paya (for Failure Gold)
Bedrock: Built a Galley -> Library
T182 (130 AD)
Wheaties: Switch the N PIrr to the 1NW PHMine
T183 (145 AD)
Silverado: Kill the Courthouse from the build queue so that I don't forget to do so once the Lighthouse is complete--Moai first, remember?
Wheaties: Build a Confucian Missionary
Wheaties: Switch the NW PH Mine to the N PIrr
Sugar Daddy: Switch the Merchant to the Sugar
T184 (160 AD)
Delhi: Built The Hagia Sophia (hopefully, we will get The Hagia Sophia at this point; otherwise, I would have had to start on The Great Library sooner than now) -> The Great Library
Wheaties: Build The Apostolic Palace again
T185 (175 AD)
Riverdale: Switch the NW + W GRiv Cot for the W + W GRiv Irr (growth in 3 turns instead of in 4 turns)
Work Boat creates Fishing Boats at Goldfish
Goldfish switches from the Artist to the Fish
Civic Switch: Police State and Slavery
Wheaties: Switch to building the Confucian Missionary
Wheaties: Whip the Confucian Missionary
T186 (190 AD)
Delhi: Grew to Size 10: Switch the PFor to the GRiv Irr and work 2 Corn, GCopper, 2 GCots, 4 Mines, and a GRiv Irr
Risaia: Whip the Granary
T187 (205 AD)
Silverado: Built a Lighthouse -> Moai Statues
Risaia: Built a Granary -> Library
Cancel Stone to Toku for Gold
Bedrock: Switch the GRiv Horse to the S Flood Plains and work the SE and S Flood Plains
Crabs: Whip the Granary
Crabs: Work the Crab
Grt Person Farm: Switch the N Lake to the W + W Fish
Work Boat 6 sits down on Sugar Daddy's Fish
Sugar Daddy: Work the Fish instead of the Sugar
Grt Person Farm: Switch to building a Confucian Temple
T188 (220 AD)
Crabs built a Granary -> Lighthouse
Delhi: Switch the NE GRiv Cot to the E GRiv Irr and work 2 Corn, GCopper, 2 GRiv Irr, 4 Mines, and 1S GRiv Cot
Wheaties: Switch to building a Confucian Missionary
Wheaties: Switch the 1W PH Mine to the 1N PIrr
T189 (235 AD)
Grt Person Farm: Remove the Confucian Temple from the build queue
Grt Person Farm: Whip the Library
Grt Person Farm: work the GPig, SE + S Fish, and the PCow
Crabs: work the Fish
Wheaties: Switch to building The Apostolic Palace
Wheaties: Switch the 1N PIrr to the 1W PH Mine
T190 (250 AD)
Grt Person Farm: Built a Library -> National Epic
Grt Person Farm: Switch the 1N Lake to the PFor and work the GPig, PCow, SE + S Fish, and the PFor (the Org Rel bonus lets the PFor count as a GH Mine for this one turn)
Risaia: Build a Work Boat
Sugar Daddy: Build a Work Boat
Grt Person Farm: Queue the Confucian Temple after the National Epic
T191 (265 AD)
Delhi: Switch PFor to the NE GRiv Cot (Grew to Size 11) and work 2 Corn, GCopper, 2 GRiv Cot, 4 Mines, S + S GRiv Irr, and E GRiv Irr
Wheaties: Switch to building the Confucian Missionary
Wheaties: Whip the Confucian Missionary
Grt Person Farm: Switch to building the Confucian Temple
Grt Person Farm: Whip the Confucian Temple
Risaia: Whip the Work Boat
Crabs: Whip the Lighthouse
Three Clams: Whip the Granary
Sugar Daddy: Whip the Work Boat
Switch Civics: Representation and Caste System
Sugar Daddy: work the Fish
T192
Delhi: Built The Great Library (or so we hope) -> Hindu Missionary (for Riverdale)
Crabs: Built a Lighthouse -> Library
Note that I am not going to list Science Rate switches, because that is one area that my test saved game is lacking in--the correct value of Trade Routes. The value is off by a considerable amount. I hope to see this issue corrected after my turnset in the next test saved game iteration, but for now, I'll just have to keep on top of when to switch Science Rate values as one of my responsibilities for the turnset.
The UP Player's Responsibilities for EACH TURN:
1. Check the Foreign Advisor (F4) screens for any notable changes. The screens to check are F4 -> GLANCE, F4 -> RESOURCES, and F4 -> TECHS. Be prepared to react to changes or to seek feedback from teammates if you see a change.
SpoilerSome quick advice about each screen :
F4 -> GLANCE: Watch for blue-coloured or red-coloured relations, as those indicate Annoyed and Furious relationships and can indicate a Worst Enemy situation. There is a little "head on red-coloured shoulders" icon to tell you which one of said players is that AI's Worst Enemy. We should avoid trading with anyone else's Worst Enemy and should only trade with a Worst Enemy after receiving team agreement on the issue. Also, watch for yellow-coloured Friendly relationships, as those indicate AIs that will IMMEDIATELY give away the techs that you trade to them, unless you also trade to the AIs that this AI is Friendly with.
F4 -> RESOURCES: Watch the "Will Trade" columns, particularly the Import's "Will Trade" column, to see what new Resources an AI offers up in trade.
F4 -> TECHS: It helps to take a screenshot of this screen regularly and then compare this screen to your screenshot. Why? Because the "Wants" column may change, which indicates that an AI learned a tech, but the BUFFY Log does not tell you about this fact. Either memorize the list or screenshot it and compare against your screenshot. The other important column to watch is the "Will Trade" column, which indicates the techs that we can get in trade. We shouldn't necessarily trade as soon as a tech appears in this column, if perhaps waiting a few turns would allow for multiple techs to appear in this column from multiple AIs, meaning that we could trade around 1 of our techs (or 2 of our techs together) to get multiple tech deals on the same turn, instead of just one tech deal.
2. Look at the list of Leaders on the main game screen (the screen where you can open Cities, move units, etc). Watch for an orange-coloured "fist" icon to appear to the right of the smiley faces and to the left of the right-side City-count numbers. If a fist appears, it means that an AI is at war or is planning to go to war. Here is where your paying attention to the F4 -> GLANCE screen pays off, as you can predict who they might be planning a war on. You can also check the F4 -> RELATIONS screen to see if they are already at war.
3. If you don't detail your Science Rate switches in your PPP, you must keep an eye on the Science Rate. Make sure that if we are low on Gold that we don't slip into a non-binary Science Rate, such as 80%, due to running out of Gold to fund 100% Science Rate Research.
Foreign Policies Isabella
We can consider making a Tech Trade with Isabella as long as she is no one's Worst Enemy at the time. We can consider Open Borders with Isabella if we decide that Opening Borders for exploration is worth the risk of her collecting multiple Religions and thus switching into Free Religion later on.
We can accept Resource Trades with Zara, Saladin, Toku, and Justinian under these conditions:
1. We will aim to give away Health Resources first, even our only source of such a Resource. If an AI does not want those Resources, will can trade Happiness Resources but only if we have extras (such as when we get two Sugars connected). After Dhoomstriker's turnset, we shouldn't trade away Stone, as we'll start needing to use it, starting during his turnset (Moai Statues, University of Sankore, and Oxford University, to name a few)
2. We will accept Happiness Resources as a priority trade, followed by Gold per Turn trades of 3 Gold per Turn or more, followed by Health Resources.
Trading Techs to Saladin and Tokugawa
If we trade a tech to Saladin, we should also be prepared to trade it to Toku on the same turn, even if we only get 20 Gold or so from Toku, otherwise the two will trade with each other and will become even more advanced than before.
Code of Laws, Theology, Civil Service, Philosophy, and Paper
We should avoid trading Code of Laws and Theology for as long as possible. We should only consider trading away these techs once two AIs have learned them, as at that point 3 players (counting us) will know said techs and the AIs may just start trading them around anyway. We might as well get some benefit out of trading them in such a scenario.
Other techs to add to this list of techs to avoid trading away until at least 2 AIs know them are Civil Service, Philosophy, and Paper. Even then, we should still consult the team before trading them away, particularly Paper and Philosophy, which both directly lead towards Liberalism. Civil Service gives a massive Science boost to any AI that gets it, so in the interests of keeping the AIs less educated, we'll hang onto this tech monopoly for as long as we can.
AI Demands for Techs
If someone demands a tech other than Code of Laws, Theology, Civil Service, Philosophy, or Paper we should give into that demand as long as that AI does not have a Worst Enemy. If you're not sure about who is who's Worst Enemy or if you just want some help in deciding about these other techs, then please consult with the team.
If someone asks for Code of Laws, Theology, Civil Service, Philosophy, or Paper, the team should be consulted on the situation before deciding.
AI Demands for Gold
If an AI demands a quantity of Gold of 200 Gold or less, and the AI making the Demand is not the Worst Enemy of anyone (you are keeping track of who is who's Worst Enemy, right?), then you can give into the Demand.
In any other situation, such as if you're not sure about Worst Enemy status or if the Gold Demand is larger, then the team should be consluted on the situation before deciding.
Comments about this Partial PPP
We are settling Goldfish ASAP.
We will wait on settling the Ivory City (currenly stlated to be called "Ivory Towers") and the Fish + Incense City (currently slated to be called "Mystic"). We'll wait to settle either until an AI Settler Party shows up or until we feel that our economy can take the hit of an additional City, whichever comes first.
I don't foresee the benefits to our economy being positive during my turnset, so I won't be settling these Cities unless an AI forces my hand.
The hope is to use Delhi's Copper + 4 Mines to our advantage to try and manually pump out The Hagia Sophia and The Great Library. Other teams that moved to the PH square have 3 Mines (counting the Silver) plus the Iron (call it equivalent to another PH Mine), so they're short the GCopper compared to us. We missed out early on due to the Silver's placement, but now is our time to shine with our larger production with a big-sized Delhi.
Delhi shouldn't be needing to whip again in the future (doing so is relatively inefficient at large City Sizes) unless a drastric emergency arises (such as an AI declaring war on us and landing a horde of troops on our island) or if we need a critical building (possibly whipping a University into Oxford, for example). Hopefully, with our good Diplo practices, we'll avoid this kind of a massive-enemy-troop-landing war situation and at most will get a casual war declaration where the AI does it more out of passing a random number check than due to a planned revenge for refusing their Demands and will thus not make a serious attempt at invading us.
Grt Person will finally get a start on the National Epic, but that National Wonder won't be completed in my turnset. For the next player, we will require that buildings get their overflow Hammers whipped into the National Epic. Temples would be the best choice, to counter the effects of whipping and because Temples are half-priced for us, making for good 2-population point whipping candidates if we don't invest TOO many Hammers into them.
As expected, the Apostolic Palace is going to be a huge investment, but I'm doing what I can to whip overflow Hammers from other projects into it, as well as chopping Forests into it. The good part is that no AI can get a "bonus" on its production, since there are no Resources that give it a Hammer boost. Also, AIs do not get a production discount when building a Wonder. So, even if an AI picks up Theology, we'll have a really good head-start on them. That's about all that I can offer.
In the worst case, a Buddhist AI builds the Apostolic Palace and the world world votes for us to join in a war. Since we haven't used up our war declarations yet, that scenario is something that we can survive. Plus, we'd get a bunch of war allies and positive Shared War Diplo modifiers in such a scenario. We still WANT to build the Apostolic Palace ourselves, so as to limit its effects in helping out the AIs build up massive armies (due to the bonus Hammers that they would get), but since it will only be about half done by the time that my turnset is up, I wanted to give some realistic perspective on the possibility of us missing it.
The partial PPP ends at the point where I will either have built The Hagia Sophia and The Great Library or will have lost them to AIs while trying to build them.
The Forward Outlook
After this turnset, we should expect to be the first to Paper. We can probably squeeze out a couple of Missionaries in Delhi
Spoiler:
starting with a Hindu one for Riverdale, so that Riverdale can go back to building Monastaries and Temples
while we wait for Paper to be ready.
Once Paper is in, we can choose whether to build a couple of more Missionaries in Delhi or else to immeidately start building The University of Sankore in Delhi, using our head-start to hopefully complete it.
We'll probably also shortly switch into Pacifism in the next turnset, hiring Scientists where it is applicable to do so during that time period.
I would say that sometime in the next turnset, we'll probably want to consider switching between Pacifism and Organized Religion every 5 turns, since Organized Religion is required to build Missionaries, while we also want to start reaping the benefits of running Pacifism. Assuming that Saladin will eventually spread Buddhism to us with a Missionary, we'll need to be in Slavery + Organized Religion once we have grown Goldfish a bit, but then we can switch back to Pacifism for 5 turns while Goldfish regrows its whipping population.
Obviously, if we get Buddhism in one of our cities, the plan is to start building a Buddhist missionary in that city as soon as possible, right? The first place to spread Buddhism should be Delhi since it can quickly build a Buudhist monastery so that it can pump missionaries whether we're in Organized Religion or not.
Whew, read it all (ok not the turn by turn plan, taking your word for that). Looks good.
Some non-plan-change-requiring comments:
* When an AI makes a demand, you can see whether they're a worst enemy of someone in the info that buffy gives when you put the cursor over them. Maybe you don't want to rely on it, but it's a good extra check.
* We shouldn't have to worry about demands for 200+ gold if we avoid having 200+ gold. I'm sure you know that though.
* Do we have an active resource trade to each AI? These are important for the sharing resources diplo bonus. I gather we do though, I know we have a lot of active trades already anyway.
* Are we worried about a DOW from Izzy? We don't seem to have any military, and she's going to be hard to please for a while to come.
Also, I gather we'll easily be the first to Liberalism, what are we planning to take from it? One option is to research all but the last little bit, then only take it when we see one of the AIs getting close (i.e. with Philosophy and Education). That way we can get the best possible thing for it. Of course there is some risk of AI6 getting it, and it's potentially a bit awkward if we're halfway through something. Don't need to decide all that yet though.
Sorry if some of these comments have been answered already and I missed them somewhere in the last 109 pages Feel free to just say we're on top of it without re-explaining things.
* When an AI makes a demand, you can see whether they're a worst enemy of someone in the info that buffy gives when you put the cursor over them. Maybe you don't want to rely on it, but it's a good extra check.
Great tip! I've been relying on the Worst Enemy icons on the F4 -> GLANCE screen, the attitudes of AIs towards other players on that same screen (if an AI treats everyone as Cautious or above in attitude, that AI will have no Worst Enemy), and on reading the "hover text" (aka "tool tip" aka "alt text") when hovering the mouse over top of the attitudes listed on the F4 -> GLANCE screen.
While all of these items are important, it is nice to know that you might also see one half of this info when you talk with an AI just by reading the hover text over the AI's "in your face" animated picture of themselves.
I will caution you, though, that it is just as important to know whether an AI is someone else's Worst Enemy as it is to know who their Worst Enemy is. You can read a bit more on the subject below.
Gold Demands and Science Rate Toggling
* We shouldn't have to worry about demands for 200+ gold if we avoid having 200+ gold. I'm sure you know that though.
While true, we lose about 80 to 100 Gold per turn and make about 40 to 65 Gold per turn, so there's a lot of toggling required to avoid going over 200. Plus, it helps to maintain somewhere just above 200 but below 300 Gold in case a nice tech trading option comes up that can be topped-up with Gold. So, I can aim to keep our Gold level just below 300, and depending upon the timing of an AI's demand, we may or may not be asked for more than 200 Gold.
Resource Trades
* Do we have an active resource trade to each AI? These are important for the sharing resources diplo bonus. I gather we do though, I know we have a lot of active trades already anyway.
We have Resource Trades going on with everybody but Isabella. She didn't have much to offer us and I was afraid that with her Religious-differences-hating default behaviour plus being in a conflicting Religion that she might become a lot of AIs' Worst Enemy or vice versa. However, that situation has yet to pan out and it seems that she and the other AIs are remaining at a Cautious level or higher with each other.
Still, it is easy to forecast that she will hate Saladin (right now -2 for Religion) and Justinian (right now -2) by 1 more negative Diplo point each, to match how much she hates Zara (-3).
Justinian hates her as much as he hates Zara (-3), so I think that we're done there, but Saladin hates Zara a bit more (-4) than he currently hates Isabella (-3), so he still has one more level of hating to drop to.
As a result, there is still a chance of someone becoming someone else's Worst Enemy.
Note that Toku and Isabella have not met each other yet.
So, I suppose that if a good trading opportunity comes up with her, we can consider taking it if at the time no one treats her as their Worst Enemy. However, we can't take the attitude seen on a previous turn for granted and we must check on the turn that the trade is going to be made.
Sure, if she hates SOMEONE ELSE as their Worst Enemy, it would SEEM LIKE it would be fine to trade with HER. But, the AI seems to treat trading with them as an "excuse" for them to ask you to stop trading with others. If you don't trade with them, they tend to focus on first getting you to trade with them instead of whining about how you're trading with others.
Declaration of War
* Are we worried about a DOW from Izzy? We don't seem to have any military, and she's going to be hard to please for a while to come.
Isabella only has 4 Cities and unless there is some really crazy map shape, she is on a different continent. While she'd be able to land troops by Wheaties if she made a sneak attack on us, we'd still have a buffer turn to whip a unit there, since it's not a Coastal City. I don't foresee her attacking any other City (until we found Ivory Towers) due to AI pathing issues, so even if she does launch an assault, our initial losses will be minimal.
The goal, of course, would be to take the war to her, grab back our stolen City (should we be unable to defend it successfully--she only has a 25% chance of razing a City upon capture) or rebuild it, if required, and then take at least one, perhaps two of her core Cities.
So, should such a war happen, we'll come out as the victor.
Liberalism
Also, I gather we'll easily be the first to Liberalism, what are we planning to take from it? One option is to research all but the last little bit, then only take it when we see one of the AIs getting close (i.e. with Philosophy and Education).
Indeed, it is the strategy to:
a) Research most but not all of Liberalism
AND
b) Avoid trading away the techs that lead to Liberalism until at least two AIs have learned such a tech themselves
Part a) will happen outside of my turnset. If the UP player at the time feels safer researching Liberalism up until "2 turns" before it is completed, so as to not accidentally research it, I'm fine with that approach, but I do agree that we should at least partially pre-research it.
That way we can get the best possible thing for it.
If an when an AI learns Paper, we'll need to start planning on which tech to take, based on our Science Rate at the time (the number of turns at 0% vs 100%), with the goal of taking the most expensive tech that we can risk taking on the path to Mass Media. Philosophy might or might not be researched ahead of time, but once an AI grabs Paper, the race is on!
Scheduling of the Playtime
Do you have any thoughts on the timing of when I should play?
More and more as the game progresses from this point, with so many AIs being known, our turnsets may require team interaction.
If you want to give feedback on when is a good time or a bad time, please review the suggested schedule options: Scenarios 1, 2, 3, and 4 Scenario 1a
Did the last time's schedule work for you? Last time we went with Scenario 2. Would this timing work for you on a weekday?
If not, maybe you can list your order of preference of the Scenarios for both a weekday and a weekend (we had some feedback previously on which times work, but it is not clear if that info applies to both weekdays and weekends or not), so that we can get a schedule semi-planned for future turnsets. People always have events in life that may "come up" and disrupt their normal schedule, so we can always make comments to that effect, but if we can agree upon a couple of acceptable schedules, we can make the future turnsets get played faster. That way, if you know that you'll have something coming up around the time that the next playtime is scheduled, you'll know if it is relevant to share the fact that "something has come up that will keep you busy" with the team (for example, we don't need to know about every time that leave your house! ).
Feel free to suggest another timing Scenario to add to the list, as well. Technically, we have 24 possibilities, if we always aim to start on the hour, while we only listed 5 options so far.
At this point I say just play. You know more about what we need to do to have a shot at winning than anyone else on the team. Play ASAP and if you have something really odd come up like a DoW then stop and ask for input. Otherwise just play it out. It is what it is at this point and you are likely the best person to deal with all eventualities.
Tech Trading
Saladin and Toku both know Construction and Feudalism, but neither will trade either one to us
Zara also knows Construction and won't trade it to us
Since neither Construction nor Feudalism are on the Mass Media beeline and we don't need either tech right now, I assume that you'll wait until we can get a needed tech (like Metal Casting), before trading away our monopoly on Aesthetics, right? Especially since we can't trade any of our other techs at the moment.
Is there any reason why you're hiring a Merchant and not a Scientist? I would rather have 0 Great Merchant gpp in a city that will eventually spawn a great person. Plus, our limiting factor is science, not gold. If you're worried about beaker bonuses, you can be sure that you're running the science slider at 100% during the time you're hiring this scientist.
Days ago (i won't bother to look for my post) i said that we need 4 days/TS, assuming 15 turns/TS.
I think it was right after i posted my save.
Now:
- i posted my save on 06/29
- Dhoom played until turn 175 on 07/06
- we're at 07/12, almost 13 (here, at least)
so, we're 40 days to go, with a great finish date on turn 330 as target, thus with 155 turns to go.
This will make 3.875 turns/day. Useless to count the TS/day, since we'll be surely forced to longer TSs.
Now, i trusted Dhoom as our strategist and i gave him the steer of the game. And of the team for this game.
I'm starting regretting this decision.
I understand the need to test and to optimize every small action, but we can't finish on time at this pace.
Thus, i say this: Dhoom, play and play ASAP.
I don't wanna enter the fact that you proposed a double TS for yourself and that i haven't authorized it, since i think that from now on, every TS *must* be doubled if we wanna arrive to submit a completed game.
Now, can you please enlighten us on your proposed time scheduling for all of us to finish on time? Hoping everyone of us won't face RL problems when their turn arrive.
For what is worth, there're only 2 teams still in the BC's, us and Who Dat.
I would like to see this scheduling along with your TS report.
BTW, since it's summer, so vacation season, can anyone please post his vacation scheduling?
I agree that we need to get this game moving. I will be on vacation from 21-July through 31-July, which is probably about when my next turnset will come up. So I'll have to ask to be skipped or swap with someone else.
Is there any reason why you're hiring a Merchant and not a Scientist? I would rather have 0 Great Merchant gpp in a city that will eventually spawn a great person. Plus, our limiting factor is science, not gold. If you're worried about beaker bonuses, you can be sure that you're running the science slider at 100% during the time you're hiring this scientist.
Merchants are more efficient than scientists when the science/gold exchange rate in that city favours science less than the average for the rest of the empire. Are we expecting to get a great person out of it before education is finished? If not, I wouldn't be worried about a few merchant GPP, merchants are quite good to get later on.
I agree to get the game moving. With all the complicated conditions in this game (on top of the complicated conditions to keep on top of for a diplo game in general) we'll have a lot of decisions to make in the late game, we need the time for it.
For what it's worth I'm around browsing the forums most of the daytime (22:00GMT->08:00GMT) during the weekdays, and I'm just plain unpredictable on the weekends, although usually free Saturday morning (from Friday 22:00(GMT) to Saturday 04:00(GMT). I'm happy for the turnset to be played when I'm not around though.
It's winter here, and we're not going skiing this year (for the first time since I was 2 years old!) so no vacations for me.
I'd like to be able to play at least most of my turnset on Saturday morning, with most of the planning done the couple of days before.
Okay, I will make some time to play tomorrow. I don't know when that will be as I've already spent a ton of time optimizing this turnset and spending the time to write the PPPs. The ultimate goal was to make future turnsets easier for the rest of you. As a result, some pressing real life concerns that have been put on hold will be to be juggled just for me to fit in the executing of this partial turnset. Was the time invested worth it? Maybe, maybe not.
But, rather than just asking you to trust my abilities, I gave you the PPPs. If you don't find them to be useful, that is your loss.
In the meantime, here's the test saved game that I played to get to where we are at the end of Partial PPP3.
Although some things won't be accurate, it should be useful for Irgy to download it and start planning out Worker moves.
Build orders can also be tentatively planned, although minor things may change if we get Buddhism to spread around or if something else unexpected happens, like an AI declaring war on us or us missing out on a Wonder.
If nothing else, there should be no "delay" in getting started on the next turnset, as we have a relatively accurate test saved game to work from that matches at least how I PLAN to play.
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
). We just settled half of our cities in the last 10 turns. Two of our other five cities already have libraries and the other three have been busy building settlers, workers and such. I'm not sure when we would have fit in an earlier library anyway. Plus, we were cutting things close research wise in our push for the 'Mids, so we really needed the cottages in Riverdale, Bedrock and Delhi. I think we're in good shape. We just need to get our libraries built (after granaries but before lighthouses) and start hiring some scientists. 
Actually, if we get into a war, it will likely (hopefully) be with someone to the east (e.g. Zara, Izza or AI6). I think it makes sense to keep 2 galleys east just in case. One galley in the west should be enough to shuttle a couple of missionaries to the mainland and a worker to Goldfish, right?
).
