SGOTM 12 - Fifth Element

BLubmuz · Dec 18, 2010

I agree about workers. We need them, but the game is long. Also, in the tiles we have to clean just to satisfy the constraints of this competition, we can send 1 worker. We can build roads por railroads, the turn cost is the same only if those tiles are 2 tiles from a road.

We need to ferry some worker on the islands and we can ferry more than 1 if many tiles.

Good to know UT is in full shape now.

unclethrill · Dec 19, 2010

I figure playing on Monday night will be too soon for proper feedback so I'll shoot for feedback and a revision on monday night and playing on tuesday night.

I plan to play about 10 turns.

Troops:

Declare on Mao and head to Shanghai with a huge stack. Move most of the troops from British cities to the front leaving only antiquated troops behind.
Kill Mao's random troops in the south

Take Shanghai.

Move troops to Beijing and declare on Roos as soon as possible in hopes to hit it before the revolt ends.

Take Beijing then split stack and take xian and head into Roos-land with main stack.

Tech:

AL (4) -> Biology (3-5) -> Physics (3-5)

Cities:

Moscow: Wealth -> Factory
StP: Wealth -> Factory
CI: Frigate (1) ->Frigate (1) ->Frigate (1) ->Frigate (1) -> Wealth
Novo: Rifle (2) -> Wealth
Orleans: Finish Observ(2) -> Wealth -> Factory
Rostov: SoL (Use GE) (5) -> Factory -> Wealth
Rhiems: MI (1) -> MI/Wealth (as able to build MI)
Yaroslav: Finish Observ(1) -> Wealth -> Factory
Paris: Wealth -> Factory
Smolensk: Finish Observ(5) -> Factory
Orenburg: Wealth -> Factory
Krasnoyarsk: Finish Observ (7) -> Factory
Khabarovsk: Wealth -> Factory
Bryansk: Wealth -> Factory
Tver: Finish Forge (2) -> Lib (3) -> Observ (5)
Hangzhou: MI (2) -> Observ (4) -> Factory
Chengdu: CH (alot)
Novosibersk: Finish Gran (4) -> Forge (9)
York: CH (alot)
Magadan: CH(1) -> Forge (10)
Hastings: Wealth -> Factory
Murmansk: Granary (10) -> CH
London: Finish CH (7) -> Lib (3)
Canturbury: Finish Lib (4) -> Observ (10)
Coventry: CH (Forever)
Oxford: CH (forever)
Nottingham: Finish Lib (3) -> Wealth

Workers:

All finish current tasks.
Complete Rail Network (mostly done)
Island Workers finish improving resources and railroad then clear FO.
Mainland workers tasks:
1. Not die
2. Improve resources
3. Connect railrod for new cities
4. Clear FO

Trades:

Trade Iron from G for Deer.
Sell Lib to Roos for 210G. (Any thoughts on this? It is a dead end tech.)

Civics:

Caste/FM/FR/FS - T248 (after second draft in Bryansk)

City Micro:

Draft Smolensk (T247)
Draft Bryansk (T247, T248)

Move settler in Hastings to the ice at the bottom of the map 15S 2E of Hastings. Settle on first turn of no peace and gift to Church.

Fluroscent · Dec 19, 2010

Hey UT, just some general feedback as I don't have time right now to study the save.

-Every city with nothing better to build must build factory when possible. And all cities that complete factory must begin coal plant immediately after.

-Factory+plant take priority over anything but CH/forge at this point. Libraries+Observatories can wait.

-Whip former english cities pre civics revolt if possible. Especially courthouses.

-Due to possible unseen units, make sure to move all workers away from chinese front before DOW.

-We need more cities to build MI execs. Suggest the best island city (Orenburg?) build them for the other island cities.

-Don't forget the Roos knight up at Novogrod. If not killed, it could potentially wipe out the chinese iceball and off him ending our game right there.

-Agree with trades etc.

Oh and, we might want to consider combustion if it looks like Roosevelt has a big navy. Probably after biology then.

BLubmuz · Dec 20, 2010

I would build also some galleon: we need them to move on G. and probably to take the last English cities.

Physics can be better than Bio first, a couple airships can help.

Agreed with Fluro variations/reminders.

pnp_dredd · Dec 20, 2010

I definitely think that we should whip hard before switching out of slavery. Here's some whipping suggestions:

These cities should almost certainly whip something:
Novosibirsk: Granary
York: Courthouse
Murmansk: Granary
London: Courthouse
Canturbury: Library

Possibles:
Krasnoyarsk: Observatory
Smolensk: observatory?
Tver: Library?
Hangzhao: MI exec? This city doesn't gain much from an Observatory, I would build just MI+wealth here. Our new English cities need MI spread asap, so be sure to fill all of the Exec spots each turn.

A few of other things:

-Be sure to allow the workers near Coventry to complete the railroad before moving troops back towards China.

-Move a military unit with the settler. I didn't see any units heading south, but we don't know what's there.

-CI could continue building cannons after the Frigates? We have around 20 cannons all up - is that sufficient?

-I should have been clearing fallout for our new English cities - sorry. Now that we have our rail network pretty well established we can move an army of workers around London, York Oxford etc.

-Orenburg's a good place to build Execs for the islands, but I would prioritise spread to the ex-English cities first. Try to build Execs only in cities which can do so in 2 turns: Building them elsewhere ties up a slot for too long. Orenburg can do them in 2 turns with some micro.

-The governor loves spies, so check specialist allocation in each city which grows.

pnp_dredd · Dec 20, 2010

Are we planning to turn Rostov into a proper GP farm? With biology Rostov could run 11 specialists if we farmed all of the grassland (105 GP points/turn). Of course, alternately it can make 120 gold/turn while building wealth.

I think that eventually the GP farm will be more valuable than the gold, and as such we should have a couple of workers there turning workshops into farms to assist Rostov's growth towards hugeness.

And of course we can always run 4 Engineers in the mix of specialists and get a bit of gold that way too.

Fluroscent · Dec 20, 2010

Some comments to comments.

Agree with most comments by dredd and blub.

BLubmuz said:
I would build also some galleon: we need them to move on G. and probably to take the last English cities.

pnp_dredd said:
-CI could continue building cannons after the Frigates? We have around 20 cannons all up - is that sufficient?

I don't see a reason to build any more galleons in the next 10. Better more frigates and otherwise infantry. There is a risk that Roosevelt will have infantry himself before we can finish him, since he only needs rifling+AL.
20 Cannons should be enough. Frigates can help bombarding the later cities.

Rostov: I think we should have it finish the GM, and then we can farm+grow and run as many specialists as possible to start some chain GA'ing. Engineers might be worth more gold than merchants if we build wealth, but we also need to make sure we get different GPs. We will get a scientist from Moscow. So three merchants, one for Cereal Mills, and one Engineer, along with the fusion engineer and we got two golden ages covered. Perhaps possible to get another, but it is hard to judge at this point.

unclethrill · Dec 20, 2010

Okay made all the suggested changes. I will plan to play late tomorrow night unless I get a stop message from someone.

Troops:

Declare on Mao and head to Shanghai with a huge stack. Move most of the troops from British cities to the front leaving only antiquated troops behind.
Kill Mao's random troops in the south

Take Shanghai.

Move troops to Beijing and declare on Roos as soon as possible in hopes to hit it before the revolt ends.

Take Beijing then split stack and take xian and head into Roos-land with main stack.

Tech:

AL (4) -> Physics (3-5)-> Biology (3-5)

Cities:

Moscow: Wealth -> Factory
StP: Wealth -> Factory
CI: Frigate (1) ->Frigate (1) ->Frigate (1) ->Frigate (1) -> Wealth
Novo: Rifle (2)***To take out knight*** -> Wealth
Orleans: Finish Observ(2) -> Wealth -> Factory
Rostov: SoL (Use GE) (5) -> Factory -> Wealth
Rhiems: MI (1) -> MI/Wealth (as able to build MI)
Yaroslav: Finish Observ(1) -> Wealth -> Factory
Paris: Wealth->MI -> Factory
Smolensk: Finish Observ(Whip) -> Factory
Orenburg: MI-> MI -> Factory-> MI
Krasnoyarsk: Observ (Whip) -> Factory-> Plant -> Finish Observe (1)
Khabarovsk: Wealth -> Factory
Bryansk: Wealth -> Factory
Tver: Finish Forge (2) -> Lib (3) -> Factory
Hangzhou: MI (2) -> MI(2) -> Factory -> MI
Chengdu: CH (alot)
Novosibersk: Finish Gran (4((Whip))) -> Forge (9)
York: CH (Whip)
Magadan: CH(1) -> Forge (10)
Hastings: Wealth -> Factory
Murmansk: CH (Whip)-> Forge
London: Finish CH (Whip) -> Factory
Canturbury: Finish Lib (Whip) -> Factory
Coventry: CH (Whip if possible)
Oxford: CH (Whip if possible)
Nottingham: Finish Lib (Whip) -> Wealth -> Factory

If any factories finish in this TS then start Plants.

Be sure to fill in MI queue when each new one is built in a city that can build it in 2 turns or less.

Squeeze in a couple airships where possible.

Workers:

All finish current tasks.
Complete Rail Network (mostly done)
Island Workers finish improving resources and railroad then clear FO.
Mainland workers tasks:
1. Not die
2. Improve resources
3. Connect railroad for new cities
4. Clear FO
***Be sure to move all workers from chinese borders before DoW***
***Be sure to allow the workers near Coventry to complete the railroad before moving troops back towards China***

Trades:

Trade Iron from G for Deer.
Sell Lib to Roos for 210G. (Any thoughts on this? It is a dead end tech.)

Civics:

Caste/FM/FR/FS - T248 (after second draft in Bryansk)

City Micro:

Draft Smolensk (T247)
Draft Bryansk (T247, T248)

Move settler in Hastings to the ice at the bottom of the map 15S 2E of Hastings. Settle on first turn of no peace and gift to Church. **Be sure to take protection**

Of course, check cities after every turn to be sure the right squares are worked and no spies have been

BLubmuz · Dec 20, 2010

Your revised PPP seems good.
You forgot to mention the knight "imprisoned" near Novgorod. Try to not forget it in game.

Go ahead, Good luck!

pnp_dredd · Dec 20, 2010

Looks good. I'll be on only sporadically for the rest of the year, so I'd like to wish everyone a great Christmas and an inebriated New Year's.

BLubmuz · Dec 20, 2010

Merry Xmas to you, Dredd!

And a great 2011! Have a nice vacation, see ya next year.

Fluroscent · Dec 20, 2010

Seems good.
A few notes, but good to go either way.

CI: Frigate (1) ->Frigate (1) ->Frigate (1) ->Frigate (1) -> Wealth

Keep building military in CI. Some more frigates are probably a good idea, and then some infantry, or some galleons which we do need eventually.

AL (4) -> Physics (3-5)-> Biology (3-5)

I don't really see the great benefit of physics, since we probably won't have any problems finishing off Roosevelt with our army as it stands, so would prefer biology first as it gives us a lot of extra food immediately.

Caste/FM/FR/FS - T248 (after second draft in Bryansk)

After revolt: MM various specialists to merchants instead of scientists now we have caste. Only Moscow gets to run scientists still.

beestar · Dec 21, 2010

Hey gang, I'm still here and keeping tabs on things, but busy until Thursday when I fly out of Heathrow back to Canada. If I'm lucky and the airport chaos has cleared up ...

unclethrill · Dec 21, 2010

unclethrill said:
Novo: Rifle (2)***To take out knight*** -> Wealth

BLubmuz said:
Your revised PPP seems good.
You forgot to mention the knight "imprisoned" near Novgorod. Try to not forget it in game.

Go ahead, Good luck!

Not sure if I wasn't clear enough!

I'll play in a couple hours.

unclethrill · Dec 21, 2010

Okay. Quick update.

We were short handed at work so of course it was extra busy. Thus, I was not able to complete my TS. I finished 4 turns (Now at 251).
Here are some highlights though:

1. Took Shanghai.
2. Took Beijing.
3. Killed a huge Roos Stack outside of the cities.
4. Finished AL and started factories in almost all cities.

Couple questions:

1. We got a general. What should we do with him?
2. Should I build a factory even if there is no forge or should I build the forge first?

I'll finish the rest of my 6 turns in the first half tonight at work.

BLubmuz · Dec 22, 2010

unclethrill said:
Okay. Quick update.

We were short handed at work so of course it was extra busy. Thus, I was not able to complete my TS. I finished 4 turns (Now at 251).
Here are some highlights though:

1. Took Shanghai.
2. Took Beijing.
3. Killed a huge Roos Stack outside of the cities.
4. Finished AL and started factories in almost all cities.

Everything went smooth for 2 cities in 4 turns! Good! Also the huge stack gone is a good new.

Couple questions:

1. We got a general. What should we do with him?
2. Should I build a factory even if there is no forge or should I build the forge first?

I'll finish the rest of my 6 turns in the first half tonight at work.

I think the general can be settled in Moscow, mostly for the OU. We already have 11 XP from CI, we do nothing with 13.

Forge before Factory, of course. It's cheaper and it gives happy benefits.

What about SoL?

Better prepare also a settler for Roos.

Fluroscent · Dec 22, 2010

Good news.
Assume the rest of the plan went as expected then, including SoL being almost done.
Agree with blub on the general+forges questions.

How do we do on economy after the civics switch and back out of GA?
Did we see any Roosevelt navy yet?
Has he got rifling yet? Or something else?
Has he got any new island cities?

unclethrill · Dec 22, 2010

BLubmuz said:
Everything went smooth for 2 cities in 4 turns! Good! Also the huge stack gone is a good new.I think the general can be settled in Moscow, mostly for the OU. We already have 11 XP from CI, we do nothing with 13.

Forge before Factory, of course. It's cheaper and it gives happy benefits.

What about SoL?

Better prepare also a settler for Roos.

I figured forges first but I thought I would ask since to build the plants we need the factory first.
I GE'ed the SoL on T247. It had 5 turns so it should finish next turn.

I'll work a settler in soon but we have a little while. Roos has a bunch of cities.

Fluroscent said:
Good news.
Assume the rest of the plan went as expected then, including SoL being almost done.
Agree with blub on the general+forges questions.

How do we do on economy after the civics switch and back out of GA?
Did we see any Roosevelt navy yet?
Has he got rifling yet? Or something else?
Has he got any new island cities?

With the GA, we had an increase of ~200 beakers and a reduction of cost of about 150 at 100%. I'll have to open the save to get the current numbers. Right now with no cities building wealth (all factories and such), we can sustain about 50% or so.

Just a couple of ships but our frigates have to circumnavigate the globe so they are a ways away.

No rifling.

Not sure about island cities. Didn't think to check.

Gonna play in a little bit and finish out my 10 turns.

unclethrill · Dec 22, 2010

The save is attached for review.

In general all went as expected.

Here are the highlights:
1. Took 5 cities and am prepared to take another on the next turn.
2. Completed AL, Bio and have 2 turns left on Physics.
3. Traded Deer and Ivory for Iron with G
4. Hooked up several more metal resources. MI is yielding +20 hammers
5. Finished most factories and several Coal Plants.
6. Spread MI to all but 1 former British city and the farthest island away from the mainland.
7. Got peace with China. He only has the iceball.
8. Declared on Roos and took 3 of his cities (included in the 5 count)
9. Sold lib to Roos for 210g
10. Sold Lib to G for 150g
11. Drafted as planned.
12. Completed RR to all cities and most of the newly acquired cities
13. Connected all available resources
14. Cleared a good chunk of the fallout in former British territory
15. Killed 1 American frigate but lost 2 to sneak attacks
16. Lost forge in Hangzou to a terrorist attack.
17. Finished SoL.

I left movement points on many of the troops because I am still debating a couple of plans that I can still perform on T257.

I'll see about a PPP for the next 10 turns ASAP.

Autolog:

Spoiler :

unclethrill · Dec 22, 2010

Second half of the auto log

Spoiler :

SGOTM 12 - Fifth Element

HoF Quattromaster

Why am I up right now?

Emperor

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Why am I up right now?

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