SGOTM 13 - Smurkz

[donsig]

Hmm, I would question why we're still at war with the Byzantines in the first place

I would save this peace treaty for just before we need to make peace with someone else, since the Byzantine peace should lower the next peace treaty cost. If we make peace too soon and they just ally against us later then we've gained nothing.

 

[CommandoBob]

That's an interesting French deal. I suggest that if we want to do that we give monotheism to the Byzantines first since that my drop the peace price across the board.

Interesting, yes, but, do we make the deal?

I think 'Yes', but only because I don't see any other options. This would give us (I hope) 20 turns of peace with France and the chance to make peace with someone else (anyone else, really). My hope is that peace with us will then become contagious and infect the other AIs.

I admit that it is a long shot, but it seems to be our only shot.

History Check
donsig, do you have any saves from the last turnset where you could check what France would have given for such a deal? I am curious to see if the final negotiated price has dropped any. That would give us some guidance on this deal.

EDIT:
I think that is allowed, right? To check what could have been?

 

[Niklas]

I think we should do the deal too.

 

[donsig]

History Check
donsig, do you have any saves from the last turnset where you could check what France would have given for such a deal? I am curious to see if the final negotiated price has dropped any. That would give us some guidance on this deal.

I just have the autosaves. In 1110 AD We could have gotten peace with France and an alliance against Egypt for our WM and 130g. The price has gone up (most likely) because on the last turn or two of the last turnset a couple more civs declared war on us. So if we give the Byzantines monotheism for peace then Joan's price might come down a bit.

I say we make the deals.

 

[CommandoBob]

0/1150 (Preflight)
Talk to Theodora of Byzantium. We offer Monotheism for peace. She agrees.
We have a photographer snap a picture so that we can remember this day.

Peace with Theodora

Spoiler :

Oh, Boy!

The trade embargo on us by Byzantium and America ends. One person dances in the street.

The trade embargo on us by Byzantium and Russia ends. One person dances in the street, another one claps his hands.

The excitement is, like, overwhelming, dude.

We talk to France.
We can get peace, and an MA vs. Egypt for our WM and 188 gold, a drop of 20 gold. I expected more.
I check our other peace options. The opening price for peace drops in 20 gold.
Go back to Joan of France and throw in ROP to maybe drop the price. That doesn't work. Agree to the original deal.

Peace with Joan

Spoiler :

See that our Foreign Advisor thinks that the French fear our Maces. We only have one.


Oh, Boy!

The trade embargo of France and Persia on us mysteriously disappears. One person says, 'Viva la France!'

The trade embargo of France and Russia on us also mysteriously disappears. One person says, 'Hey! Viva la France!'

The trade embargo of France and Mongolia on us disappears, too. One person stands up and says, 'Ah-ho! Viva la France!'

Otherwise, the reaction is .

We make the diplomatic rounds again, asking about peace.
We have 392 gold.

Diplomacy: War

1. Mongols: war (peace = Gojira)(same)
2. Russia: war (peace = Nibanme Smurkz)(same)
3. Hittites: war (peace = Kemuri)(same)
4. Korea: war (peace = Gojira )(same)
5. Persia: war (peace = Nibanme Smurkz)(same)
6. China: war (peace = Bahitsu)(same)
7. Netherlands: war (peace = Bahitsu)(same)
8. Scandanavia: war (peace = Gorija)
9. Sumeria: war (peace = Gojira)(same)
10. America: war (peace = Gojira)(same)
11. Arabia: war (peace = Bahitsu)(same)
12. England: war (peace = Nibanme Smurkz)
13. Celts: war (peace = Gojira)(same)
14. Babylon: war (peace = Gojira)
15. Rome: war (peace = Gojira)
16. Egypt: war (no peace; MA with Spain vs. Egypt)
17. India: war (peace = Gojira)(same)
18. Iroquois: war (peace = Gojira)(same)
19. Maya: war (peace = refuse envoy)
20. Portugal: war (peace = refuse envoy)
21. Aztecs: war (peace = refuse envoy)

Diplomacy: Peace

1. Inca
2. Spain
3. Bzyantines
4. France

So nice to know that they only want our money, if we have enough.

We have doubled the number of civs that are at peace with us.

[IBT 1150 AD]
Hittites hurt someone in Kemuri.
An orange rSpear invades on the Cow NE of Sensei!


Theodora keeps peace, but signs a Trade Embargo with Egypt on us. (grumble...No good backstabber...).
Joan is no better, signing a Trade Embargo with China. (...Women!...two-faced, no-good hussy...)
Spain and America join the Trade Embargo bandwagon.(...after we made peace with you...)
Joan signs a second TE, this time with Persia.(...you're mad at us because we joined your side against Cleopatra?...)

A Persian Destroyer (I think) shells Nibanme and then steams out of sight.

Yamamoto rPike -> rPike (trebuchet?) in 15.

The hills in the south around Gojira are cleared of damage. They can be mined and roaded.

The rSpear near Sensei is English.

01 1160 AD

Old Island
The vPike that should have been built in Sensei did not because the (insert colorful description here) English rSpear landed on a 4 food tile, which we no longer had access to, which in turn meant that Sensei starved to size 5 (no food in the food box) and then the game reassigned citizens and we end up netting 1 frigging shield! Now the Pike takes 2 turns to complete because the mined hill is not/was not worked, even though the governor is set to emphasize production!
How I wish we had Nukes!
And there are two more Limey Caravels off the north coast of the Old Island.
How I wish I did not like British Comedies!

Okay, now to fix the damage.

In Sensei, one citizen stops fishing and works the hill. The gives us a 1 sheild overrun on the Pike but we may need it. We don't fish the oysters; instead we fish the coastal tile 2SW of Sensei. If a Caravel parks on the Oysters I don't want us to have to reshuffle citizens in the dark again. We net +3 shields and +1 food with this arrangement; vPike this IBT.

Wake Warrior03 in Sushi, NW into sensei and fortifies.
Wake the warrior SE of Sushi, moves 2NW to the mined plains and fortifies.
Wake Warrior01, on the mountain NE of Sushi and move him 1NW to the mined hill and fortify.
Wake Warrior02 in Nibanme and move him to the mountain Warrior01 was protecting and fortify.
Wake the remaining warrior in Nibanme and move him 1N to the mined BG and fortify.

We have no offensive units on the Old Island, not even a rock thrower. Nor do we have an workers (at present) to repair any pillaging done by England.

We have one open tile, the mined BG south of Sensei. We have a Spear in Nibanme that has not yet been moved.

Big Island
Workers D and E begin to mine the hills they stand on, finish in 12. Thought about making roads first, for the extra commerce, but coastal tiles are much better and are being worked right now.
New rPike fortifies in Yamamoto.
BG NE of Ao is now cleared of damage. We have 2 workers and 1 slave in this tile. Both workers begin the mine (3 turns) and the slave begins the road (6 turns, but will get help once the mine is done).
WorkerB, NW of Saki City, begins to clear damage (12 turns).


International
Aztecs, Maya and Portugal refuse our envoys (still).
France and Spain each have an MA with Arabia vs. Egypt.

City Builds
I had some changes to make to the city builds that I forgot to do because I was too focused on Joan's peace deal.
Saki City: vSamurai in 5 -> vPike in 2.
Bahitsu: temple in 13 -> vMace in 18.
Gojira: vPike in 1.
Yamamoto: rPike in 15 -> rMace in 20.
Mothra: temple -> rMace in 9.
Satsuma: trebuchet in 9.
Sashimi: trebuchet in 1.
Sensei Smurkz: vPike in 1.
Ninbanme Smurkz: temple in 7 -> rMace in 12.
Sushi Smurkz: vCaravel in 12 -> rMace in 12.
Kemuri: vPike in 3.
Akichi: temple in 2 -> vPike in 2.
Ao: temple in 2 -> rMace in 5.
Kiiro: trebuchet in 2.

​

Pause for discussion about the English Infestation on the Old Island.
One Trebuchet has not been moved.

Big Island 1160 AD

And the save is >>HERE<<.

 

[donsig]

Can we rush something (like MDI) instead of building that pike? How about rushing something in Nibanme? I doubt we can ferry any units from the new island - anything we send out will sure go down to Davy Jone's locker.

EDIT: We're 12 shields shy of a medieval infranty in Sensei. Is that 36g or 48g? We're 14 shields from a pike in both Nibanme and Sushi. That's 40 shields for two pikes and a medieval infantry. That's either 120g or 160g - a worthy investment at this time. We have 357g - but a 36gpt deficit, with 9 turs left to pay Isabella 140gpt. Joan is the only one at peace with us who has any gold. If we lower the lux rate to 20% and hire a mix of clowns, taxmen and one geek we can lower our deficit to 20gpt - thought the deficit increases as we build units. It's tight but we need to rush some units to contain this incursion.

The pike and spear in Nibanme (as well as the other units on the old island) can move. If we block the tile south of Sensei perhaps the Iroquois caravel and its escorts will leave. I suggest moving the warrior form the plains into Sensei, putting the pike on the plains and the spear south of Sensei. Next turn the better defensive units can garrison Sensei.

 

[CommandoBob]

Rushing cost: 4 gold per shield; 8 gold per shield if the production box is empty. Forty shields = 160 gold.

We can still move to block off the whole island; I don't think the Caravels can get there in one turn so I didn't worry too much about the empty tile for this turn.

Rush a Mace in Sensei to kill the Spear makes sense. Rush a Pike just in case the Spear survives seems good, too. But a second Pike? I'm not so sure it is needed right away (this IBT). Sensei can crank 4-turn Pikes. It nets 9 shields per turn right now, which we could get to 10 spt and have 3-turn Pikes. Would that be good enough?

 

[donsig]

That does sound good like a good balance.

One benefit of blocking all tiles is the AI will turn around and leave with any troop carriers. England won't do that just yet but if we kill off what they land...

 

[Othniel]

I would vote to rush a couple of units. I would also like to see all coastal tiles blocked if possible.

Lastly, I don't think we should be building regular units. If a town is not worthy of having a barracks, put it on trebuchet or caravel duty. We are going to need lots of artillery and boats to win this game.

 

[CommandoBob]

01A 1160 AD

The plan is to rush a vMace in Sensei, and an rPike in Sushi. We'll need to reassign workers so that we don't lose money as fast.
We'll have Sensei crank out some 3 turn vPikes for a while.

Need to portect the exposed mined BG south of Sensei.

We prefer no more Regular units, make Trebuchets or Caravels instead.

Downloaded the save and begin from Smurkz_SG013_AD1160_01.SAV.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Wake the rSpear in Nibanme and send it 1S of Sensei. He doesn't have any move left to fortify, but neither does anyone else we could move.

Sensei vPike -> vMace in 4, rush for 48 of 357 gold.
Sushi rMace -> rPike in 7, rush for 56 of 309 gold.
Now at 253 gold.

Cycle through the cities, looking for gold. Cycle through several times, actually.
Drop Saki City to a net of 10 shields (down from 12); can make 3 turn Pikes or 4 turn Maces. Most of our cities have harbors, so hiring taxmen reduces our cash flow (coast tiles bring in 3 commerce),
Satsuma does hire a taxman.
I forget all the other details.
I get it to -20 gpt.

International
Inca: 5 cities.
Byzantines: 6
Egypt: 21.
France: 14.
Spain: 20.
Save game again.

Space bar the Trebuchet and hit enter.
​

[IBT]
Iroquois destroy the Temple in Yamamoto.
They also reduce thie city to size 5.

English rSpear pillages the tile it was on. Two more rSpears land there also. Caravels sail away towards the east.

Byzantines and Persia sign a Trade Embargo on us.

Sensei vMace -> vPike in 30.
Sushi rPike -> Trebuchet in 30.
Gojira vPike -> vPike in 5.
Sashimi trebuchet -> trebuchet in 30.

Yamamoto rebounds to size 6.

Only bombarded by 4 civs: Iroquois, Hittites, America and Persia.

02 1170 AD

230 gold, -25 gpt.

vMace vs. Limey vSpear, Mace wins, but is yellowed (1 of 1).

Mine NW of Mothra is complete, send the worker to NW of Saki City, to assist with the clean up of damage, 11 turns to go right now. This tile is/was a mined BG.
New rPike fortifes in Sushi.
rSpear fortifies South of Sensei.
New vPike in Gojira moves towards Bahitsu. Will arrive next turn. Send rWarrior to Gojira. The two units basically swapped places.

Sensei works the mined hill; vPike in 10 and -25 gpt. We can get it down to 5 turns, but that loses 2 more gpt, down to -27. Right now we have 8 more turns left to pay Spain; 8 x -25 = -200 gold of 230 gold. I want at better cushion than 30 gold.

Starting from Sensei, cycle through the cities.
Kemuri, farmer becomes a fisher man, vPIke still in 2, +1 gold.
Ao works a coastal tile, +0 gold.
Mothra rMace -> vCaravel in 8.

International
Inca: 5 cities.
Byzantines: 6
Egypt: 18 (-3).
France: 15 (+1).
Spain: 20.
Aztecs, Portugal and Maya all ignore our envoys.
Rome, who wanted a little more gold than France for peace earlier, still wants Gojira.

Gold Tracking
230 gold, -24 gpt, Gunpowder in 45.
​

[IBT]
Wow!

Something finally expires that hurts us.

Back to Normal

But the Dutch and Byzantines are so quick to rain on our parade.

English vSpear attacks our wounded vMace 2/4 in Sensei. We win and promote to Elite, now 3/5 (2 of 2).

See an open spot on the coast NW of Mothra that needs to be filled.

Byzantines and Russia sign a Trade Embargo on us.

Kiiro trebuchet -> vCaravel in 20.
Saki City vPike -> vMace in 4.

The AI's vessels sailing through our waters really interferes with our ability to make money from fishing.

03 1180 AD

Two trebuchets damage an Iroquois Caravel and Frigate.

Worker NW of Saki City helps to clear damage, both will finish in 5.

VPike arrives in Bahitsu' fortify; send the rChariot to Gojira, which was the focus of American bombardments; Chariot fortifes. Redlined rWarrior walks to where he was last turn to guard the grassland SE of Bahitsu, will slowly heal.
eMace 3/5 vs. rSpear of England? No. We'll heal, then kill it.
New Trebuchet in Kiiro moves east and misses an Iroquois frigate.
New vPike in Saki moves to NW of Mothra; fortifies to protect the grassland.

International
Inca: 5 cities.
Byzantines: 6
Egypt: 17 (-1).
France: 15.
Spain: 21 (+1).
Aztecs, Portugal and Maya all ignore our envoys.
Rome wants Gojira.

Gold Tracking
We start with -34 gpt, I get it down to -26 gpt.

200 gold, -26 gpt, Gundpowder in 44, Spanish Deal: 7 more turns (7x26 = 182)
​

[IBT]
Noo!

France and Egypt make peace?


Same Song, Next Verse

That's just dandy. Frogeaters.

Inca and Hittites sign another Trade Embargo on us. Like, we're worried.

Barracks and Harbor in Kemuri are destroyed.
Barracks in Gojira are destroyed.
Nibanme takes a population hit.

Persian Cruiser shows up.
Indian Frigates appear, too.

Kemuri rPike -> harbor in 5.
Akichi vPike -> vMace in 20.

04 1190 AD

vMace vs. rSpear, Mace wins but does not promote (3 of 3).
We ping an Indian Frigate.
Wounded Warrior heals.
New rPike in Kemuri goes to Gojira to help protect the Harbor.
Mine completes NW of Ao, workers help complete the road.
Portuguese slaves fortifies in that tile.
New vPike in Akichi fortifies.
Move a treb into Ao and Mothra.

International
Inca: 5 cities.
Byzantines: 6
Egypt: 15 (-2).
France: .
Spain: 21.
Aztecs, Portugal, Maya and now France all ignore our envoys.
England still wants Nibanme for peace, after we whacked her mighty Spears.
Rome wants Gojira.

Gold Tracking
We start with -30 gpt, I get it down to -27 gpt.

Sushi trebuchet -> worker in 8.

173 gold, -27 gpt, Gundpowder in 43, Spanish Deal: 6 more turns (6x27 = 162)
​

[IBT]
Iroqois frigates are behaving strangely. Sailing away without firing a shot.

Byzantines and Mongols sign a Trade Embargo on us.

Slightly Good News

More Slightly Good News

The good feelings don't last long. Inca and Portugal sign a Trade Embargo on us.

We see 4 motorized Hittite ships.

Spain and Arabia sign a Trade Embargo on us.

A Russian destroyer appears.

05 1200 AD

We ping an Iroquois Frigate.
Two workers NW of Ao head towards Saki City to help clean up damage. They cannot reach any damaged tile this turn.
Wounded Warrior heals.
eMace enters Sensei, rWarrior moves onto that tile.

International
Inca: 5 cities.
Byzantines: 6
Egypt: 14 (-1).
Spain: 22.
Aztecs, Portugal, Maya and France all ignore our envoys.
England wants Nibanme.
Rome wants Gojira.


Gold Tracking
We start with -31 gpt, I get it down to -27 gpt.
Bahitsu and Mothra grow next turn.
Slow down the Pike build in AO; hire a taxman.

142 gold, -27 gpt, Gundpowder in 42, Spanish Deal: 5 more turns (5x27 = 135)
​

[IBT]


And the save is >>HERE<<.

 

[CommandoBob]

I'm going to hand off the game at this point. It is just taking me too long to get these turns done.

France has betrayed us, made peace with Egypt and then declared war on us.

Egypt is slowly decreasing in size.

Our cash situation is critical. We can get stabilized at -27 gpt and then the enemy frigates move in through tiles we want to work and our arrangement is shot to pieces. We may need to disband a Warrior or two this turn to ensure we have at least a 10 gold cushion in 5 more turns. I'm not too familiar with the IBT order of things. If the treaty ends before we figure our income, we should be fine on the last turn. If the treaty ends after our costs are calculated, we are going to lose an improvement somewhere.

 

[Othniel]

Good work pinging the enemy boats with trebs.

I'm up next. However, I am still on the RL bullet train and won't be able to play until middle of next week at the earliest. If donsig wants to swap me, that's cool.

 

[donsig]

I thought I might be able to play over the weekend but it didn't happen, so the next set it still yours Othniel.

 

[Othniel]

I got it then. It'll probably be the weekend before I can play.

 

[Othniel]

I just submitted COTM 49 just a couple of hours before the deadline. Now that that is completed (priorities...), I'll get cracking on this SG. Probably take most of the week for me to get it done.

 

[CommandoBob]

I think only us and Team Veteran are active right now.

Team/Turn/YearScore/Last Saved Game:
Ivan /Turn 238/1230 AD/45/May 11, 2008
klarius Turn 270/1400 AD/558/March 28, 2008
Smurkz /Turn 235/12 AD/66/June 26, 2008
Spooks /Turn 209/940 AD/56/May 26, 2008
tao /Turn 215/1000 AD/62/May 23, 2008
Veteran /Turn 275/1425 AD/116/June 17, 2008

 

[donsig]

I think only us and Team Veteran are active right now.

Not sure we're still in the active category. Anyone care to play a set?

 

[Othniel]

I may be slow but I'm still playing.

 

[donsig]

You didn't even lay out a plan for us. Glad to hear you're playing though!

 

[Othniel]

You didn't even lay out a plan for us.

True, I didn't lay out a plan...

Give me a little bit and I'll post some thoughts. I'm still in the preliminary playing stages.