SGOTM 16 - Fifth Element

[Shaandore]

I would prefer even more cities on lonely islands to gather resources. But they can be delayed some.

It would also be nice to know how many tiles we can get without triggering the domination victory. We definitely do not want to win by misstake.
We have 35.73% of land area, so we don't need to worry abut getting all our landmass. After that we might want to count tiles, but only land tiles are counted, so 1-2-3 tile islands don't raise our tile count significantly.

I think I would prefer pacifism during the golden age.

I agree with Blubmuz comments except that I'm willing to sell defunct techs cheaply.
I was even considering selling Philo for 70 gold. He might not get to 100 gold at all. Or he techs philo, and we get nothing.

Do not have any other GPs in the stack. I once tried to select the two units I wanted for a golden age and a third GP in the same square disappeared. =(

This GP thing means that I will have to manage their movement. I will put the GS on the Galley. This way if we pop a nonGS, they can meet on the Hill next to Elephantine, otherwise the GS lands on the roaded Jungle tile, and arrives just in time to start the golden age with the guy from Orelans.

Nobody commented on the Filler cities. Do you think that they are a good idea?

 

[BLubmuz]

Nobody commented on the Filler cities. Do you think that they are a good idea?

I forgot to ask for a SS with a dotmap of your proposals. All the new cities, possibly. So we avoid misunderstandigs.

 

[Shaandore]

Screenshots of 4 double sushi cities, copper city and fillers.

EDIT: I would be happy to play tonight if it's okay.

 

[Folket]

I would put three more cities in the south and four more in the north. But we do not need to hurry with them. As for our continent we should probably scram in as many cities as we can fit.

 

[Shaandore]

I would put three more cities in the south and four more in the north. But we do not need to hurry with them. As for our continent we should probably scram in as many cities as we can fit.

I will keep one or 2 cities on settler/military police production to get those spots settled before sushi.

 

[Shaandore]

Since we are a bit behind on schedule, I will play in 90 mins. A few green lights or any additions to the PPP are still welcome.

 

[Mastiff_of_Ar]

Since we are a bit behind on schedule, I will play in 90 mins. A few green lights or any additions to the PPP are still welcome.

Looks just fine to me, Shann! Rock on!

 

[Folket]

Good, beat that ram.

 

[Shaandore]

Playing now.

Will play until Thebes GP comes out since we don't really have a clear decesion about civics.

 

[BLubmuz]

New cities are OK. The crappiest is the full ice one. I'm thinking to give precedence to a city 1SW of the tundra horses (not dotmapped) and settle the 2 true fillers later. It's our land, we can do it as we please. Those last 2 cities can be settled complete of executives and missionaries.

 

[Shaandore]

@Blub:
I'm not sure why the full ice is a problem. They are pretty good with 2 sushi resources. If we don't settle them, the AI will.

@All:

3 settlers are in place, one more is on its ship. I'm trying to catch up with lbs and missonaries.

Good news: we got a great prophet from Thebes, so I started the golden age.

Bad news: After declaring 5 knights showed up in Ram's territory, all of them able to reach Thebes. had to adjust a bit. Sent 2 muskets to Thebes, and one guy back from the stack. I whipped Lbs in Elephantine and Memphis. The stack also stayed on the hill for a turn because I didn't want to get our cannons flanked on flatland. Since they didn't attack and kind of moved away, I could move in. So we should be able to take Heliopolis 2 turns from now. (we have to bombard first)

Byblos was took on turn 2 of the war with the loss of the first attacking cannon. The city is completely empty, so our workers will have a few things to do around that place.

Plans on moving forward:

Civics, GP:

Civics: Caste, Pacifism

Free Speech should wait since we get 42 commerce from Bureau multiplied by the buildings in Paris, and we only have 19 towns (=>FS would give us 38 commerce, some of that not in Paris). We will definitely want to switch to FS mid-golden age or before the end of the golden age. (I guess the latter: it will only get better than Bureau when Heliopolis comes out of revolt as ZPV said.)

I want to get the Orleans GP first, then the one from Thebes, and finally a GM from Gergovia. It seems that Gergovia can get a lot of GP if we starve it in the 2nd part of the GA, maybe even get a 3rd guy. What is our preference there? I guess an artist would come in handy.

We have a big chance of getting 2 prophets (Thebes and Orleans) but let's hope that it doesn't happen.

War:

Pretty much what I said earlier. I have some pikes and musket on a forest tile near Duro waiting for Byblos guys to heal a bit and move together on Pi-Ramesses.

Cities:

Finish levees, get the damn Lyons GE to Bibracte (yeah, I forgot to move him )

Try to support our new cities with MP and Missionaries.
We get Rail in 4 or 5 turns, so Mining Inc. will be established. I wonder if I should build an executive before finishing Wall street.
The management of Bibracte is far from trivial BTW. I'll make some calculations after this post is done.

Diplo:
I propose selling Philo for 110 gold to Qin.

 

[Shaandore]

There is nothing to calculate, we have to whip Bibracte now cause we are switching to Caste. It will grow back 1 size immediately. I propose working the 3 mines, the 2 riverside farms and the pig at size 6, then the spice to grow faster. We will obviously want an executive before finishing Wall street to start spreading. Unfortunately that is another 100 hammers and we don't get multipliers on that one... But mining inc itself will give us more than 11 raw hammers in Bib, so that will help a lot.

I will have to set up as many trades as possible. It seems that we can get 4 mining resources from the other continent.

I'm considering to settle the copper city on top of copper. (faster access.) Or shall I wait for a worker there and settle on the dotmapped tile? I can get a worker there in 3 turns.

 

[BLubmuz]

@Blub:
I'm not sure why the full ice is a problem. They are pretty good with 2 sushi resources. If we don't settle them, the AI will.

Did i said i don't want it? i just said it's crappy. But 2 fish are worth it, i think.

Instead, look at the other part of the post about new cities.

Diplo:
I propose selling Philo for 110 gold to Qin.

It's useful only for Lib. Nationalism maybe, but the AI often uses DR to open it. Better than nothing, i presume.

 

[ZPV]

We don't have very long in Caste System - we'll need to revolt back to Slavery to whip executives, since 2 turns is the maximum time we want to spend building any one.
Thus Gergovia should pop its GP next.

 

[BLubmuz]

I'm considering to settle the copper city on top of copper. (faster access.) Or shall I wait for a worker there and settle on the dotmapped tile? I can get a worker there in 3 turns.

No damn, it's the only good tile of that island. Don't be hasty. If it was on plains it could have made some sense, but it'son grass. No, wait. 7 turns won't kill us.

 

[Shaandore]

Modified PPP:

New cities:
3 settlers are in place, one more is on its ship. I'm trying to catch up with lbs and missonaries.

After the 4 sushi cities and the copper city (which won't be on top of copper), we settle 1SW of the tundra horse. The other filler cities should wait until after Sushi. Keep on producing more settlers in one or 2 cities for the 1-resource fishing village spots and settle them.

Civics, GP:

Civics: Caste, Pacifism

Free Speech should wait since we get 42 commerce from Bureau multiplied by the buildings in Paris, and we only have 19 towns (=>FS would give us 38 commerce, some of that not in Paris). We will definitely want to switch to FS mid-golden age or before the end of the golden age. (I guess the latter: it will only get better than Bureau when Heliopolis comes out of revolt as ZPV said.)

I attached a spreadsheet that shows GP generation. First will come from Orleans in 1(!) turn (I will hire artists), then the one from Gergovia. We will even get the Thebes guy before the GA ends.

We have a big chance of getting 2 prophets (Thebes and Orleans) but let's hope that it doesn't happen.

War:

Pretty much what I said earlier. I have some pikes and musket on a forest tile near Duro waiting for Byblos guys to heal a bit and move together on Pi-Ramesses.

Cities:

Finish levees, get the damn Lyons GE to Bibracte (yeah, I forgot to move him )
Whip levee in Apache. Set Isca to work water.

Try to support our new cities with MP and Missionaries.
Whip levee now in Bibracte.
We get Rail in 4 or 5 turns, so Mining Inc. will be established. Build an executive as soon as we get it.


Diplo:
Sell Philo for 110 gold to Qin.
Get all Mining Inc. resources that we can trade for.

Stop when the Gergovia Great Person is out or Mining Inc is established.

 

[BLubmuz]

We don't have very long in Caste System - we'll need to revolt back to Slavery to whip executives, since 2 turns is the maximum time we want to spend building any one.
Thus Gergovia should pop its GP next.

I don't remember to have ever needed more than 2 turns for a MI executive. Continuing running Caste can be a problem in GA generation.

 

[ZPV]

On GP generation: looks good. Which specialist will you hire in Orleans?

Civics:
I think we'll want three switches during the golden age:
1) to Caste+Pacifism
2) to Slavery+FreeMarket
3) to Free Speech+OrgRel. If you're not going to use Pacifism much before now, then you could consider moving OrgRel into revolt #2.

Cities:
Apache should also whip its levee. It will grow back onto the mines quickly.
Isca should either go for maximum growth or maximum golden-age-moai-enhanced- coast tiles.

 

[ZPV]

I don't remember to have ever needed more than 2 turns for a MI executive. Continuing running Caste can be a problem in GA generation.

We'll need to switch back to Caste at some point, definitely. Maybe at the end of this golden age, maybe not.

We'll just about have the 40 base hammers/turn needed in a few of our cities (after the 16 or 17 from Mining Inc) but even then, if we can save a turn on the second executive by whipping-and-overflowing the first one, (or similarly speeding up Wall Street that way), we should do that.

 

[Shaandore]

On GP generation: looks good. Which specialist will you hire in Orleans?

Civics:
I think we'll want three switches during the golden age:
1) to Caste+Pacifism
2) to Slavery+FreeMarket
3) to Free Speech+OrgRel. If you're not going to use Pacifism much before now, then you could consider moving OrgRel into revolt #2.

Cities:
Apache should also whip its levee. It will grow back onto the mines quickly.
Isca should either go for maximum growth or maximum golden-age-moai-enhanced- coast tiles.

I didn't go through the cities, I was planning to switch Isca to water tiles before end of turn.

I would hold off switching back to slavery until the end of the golden age.

In Orleans I will hire artists to have a chance at getting something other than a prophet. We can use the artist for culture bombing too. In Gergovia I want to keep on running merchants after the sushi GM to use the golden age and pacifism bonuses. Shall I starve Gergovia some more? Eg. down to size 7 or 6?

I would switch back to Org Rel when we switch back to slavery, at the end of the goden age (or 2 turns before that? IIRC we have to wait 5 tunrs between civic changes). Our new cities won't really be ready to whip anything mid-golden age (they need to grow first), and our old cities can either whip levees now or slowbuild them. Next buildings will be factories and coal plants, but we won't get AL much sooner than the end of golden age. Growing a bit during golden age to have good whipping potential after it is a good idea IMO. (Even half-useless tiles are good to work during GAs)

I'm editing my previous post with the changes that have been advised. I'll stop when mining inc. gets founded, so we can work out the spreading. (I propose Orleans first. It will be able to produce executives almost every turn. It will have ~65 raw hammers after levee and mining inc. bonus)

We can also work out the exact civic changes (#2) after this miniset.

I can play in 2 hours if you guys are OK with the plan.