SGOTM 16 - U'nu'sual S'us'pec'ts

[Trystero]

Great minds think alike.

If you can whip AP, just do it.
If we get AP, whip buddhist monasteries everywhere that is feasible.

I am assuming that we get Sankore, as it is done in 8 turns and no-one has Paper.

Yes - I fully intend to whip the AP the turn that option is available.

A PPP should follow in a little while.

 

[Trystero]

PPP, turns 176-180ish


Tech path:

Keep the slider at 100%:

- Chemistry (2t more)
- Philo (~1 turn)
- Lib(2 of 3t)
- SM (2t with Bulb)
- Biology(~6-7t)
- Lib(Finish)
- Free Medicine


Trades/Diplomacy:

-Sell Drama & Music (on sucessive turns) to Qin, Sally, and SB for whatever gold we can get
-Trade for Guilds when it is available.
-Also try to get Banking and Nationalism by trade.
-Switch all EP to Saladin until we can see his research. Maintain research visibility on Hammy and Qin.
-Take trades for Guilds or Philosophy if available. Trade any of Engineering, Optics, Gunpowder, Astro, and once AP is 1 turn away, Theo.
-Trade Sally Sheep (we get 1 more next turn) for 1gpt.
-Every time one of the AI has gpt available, we want it. We have 3 spices, 1 silk, 1 gems, 1 pigs, 1 sheep, 2 corn all coming online in the next 5-10 turns.
-If they try to renegotiate trades, then do it, we want to maintain all of our current imports


City Micro:

Paris Switch from ND into a Buddhist Stupa (or maybe a settler?)

GP Farm finish University > start Courthouse

Production - assign new citizen from coastal tile to engineer. 4 pop whip AP ASAP.

Commerce - Oxford University. Switch 2 cottage tiles to 2 PH mines.

Clams - finish Buddhist temple > start monastery

West Fish - currently Buddhist temple, switch to monastery

Barb City - Whip next turn (177) into trebuchet.

Zhou - slow build University of Sankore (8t).

Fake Humbaba - Buddhist monastery > Market. Switch coastal tile to iron mine

West Coast Silk - finish Buddhist temple (1t) then start a treb and whip when possible

Wheat - whip Buddhist monastery into treb this turn

Red Fish, Blue Fish - continue Market. Needs a garrison unit, start LB next. Buddhist missionary en route. Switch to monastery as soon as Buddhism spreads.

Bribracte - whip Market into Courthouse this turn

Sugar Gems - Buddhist monastery (3t). Switch farm tile to work gems.

Ski Resort - slow build Courthouse.

Camel Dumdum - whip Harbor when possible into Buddhist monastery.

Stone - switch from monastery to treb and whip next turn.

Durnovaria - Whip switch from Forge to Buddhist monastery whip when possible

Gergovia - 3 turns of revolt then Buddhist monastery.

Durocortorum - 2 turns of revolt > start monastery. Rename this city to East Coast Gems

Isca - 6 turns of revolt. Important: Whip a Christian monastery the turn it comes out of revolt.


Worker Micro:

Continue as before. Mostly cottage new cities as well as chop forests into infrastructure and clear jungle.


War Plans:

Take Thebes. Leave remaining Celtic cities, make 10t peace deal for the island city after capturing Thebes, if possible.

Move forces into position for DoW on Ramesses (h/t Neil):

-upgrade galley to galleon
-the current Isca stack to Thebes, ASAP.
-the furthest 8 reinforcements on to the 3 boats (4 trebs, x-bow & 3 maces) (for Memphis)
-all the Stone units & 2nd super medic towards Isca (for Pi-Ramesses)
-the 2 trebs & 2 cats in Gergovia to Isca (also for Pi-Ramesses, get them into position 2 NE of Pi-Ramesses)
-Bibracte LB & x-bow to Stone (follow those Celtic GW's around Stone)
-move new trebs toward Isca or load on galleons.

I will plan on playing until we capture Thebes. I will pause for interesting trades or diplomatic developments, or if war plans go awry.

 

[ChrisShaffer]

You could sell drama now and wait until they have more money, or until one turn before they finish their current research. No need for it to be "successive turns."

 

[neilmeister]

I'm happy for Paris to build either a settler, or stupa, both are worthwhile.

One thing about monastery, it must be built before SM, if they are both finished the same turn = no monastery. You probably know this already, but just in case.

You might need to micro the research slider during Liberalism, as we want to get within sustainable 1 turn of beakers of finishing it, currently ~500b. This will probably help Isca have that extra turn to finish the Christian monastery.

It will take 6 turns to get to Thebes, and you will need 1 turn to heal. So taking Thebes is at best 7 turns away. Attack from the Copper.
edit: move to the forest 2S1E of Thebes, inside Ramesses territory, as you can just make it there with full movement in 5 turns, then heal for 1 turn, then attack.

If we get AP , then please stop, so we can determine if we want to whip buddhist monasteries everywhere.

GREEN from me.

 

[ChrisShaffer]

Green

 

[Trystero]

You could sell drama now and wait until they have more money, or until one turn before they finish their current research. No need for it to be "successive turns."

yes, sorry, that is actually what I meant. "Not on the same turn", is a better description.

One thing about monastery, it must be built before SM, if they are both finished the same turn = no monastery. You probably know this already, but just in case.

Yep - got it. How important is getting SM on the schedule proposed? No one else has Paper yet, let alone Education. If we need the extra turn to get monasteries built, should we drop the slider for 1 turn? (edit: I plan on pausing when we get the AP, so we can discuss this then.)

It will take 6 turns to get to Thebes, and you will need 1 turn to heal. So taking Thebes is at best 7 turns away. Attack from the Copper.
edit: move to the forest 2S1E of Thebes, inside Ramesses territory, as you can just make it there with full movement in 5 turns, then heal for 1 turn, then attack.

There are only 2 trebs that can make it to Thebes by this schedule. That might mean sacrificing a unit to take the city. When I attacked Isca, It took 3 treb attacks (2 suicides, 1 withdrawl) to weaken the LB's so that the CR maces could make low risk attacks. I am fine with taking the city quickly, at the cost of units, but I want to make sure we are aware of the potential costs (and I know enough not to use a CR3 mace if the odds are not high enough -- I would sac a pike or XB). Not that I anticipating any great sacrifices.

If we get AP , then please stop, so we can determine if we want to whip buddhist monasteries everywhere.

OK - I will stop either at AP or if we lose AP to assess the situation.

I will plan on playing tomorrow night (~24 hours) to give sufficient time for feedback.

 

[neilmeister]

Treb 10 is fully healed and in Gergovia, it can just make it.

We don't have to take it that turn, just being bloodthirsty, and don't sacrifice the Pike, as Ramesses has at least 1 HA.

And you are absolutely right about SM, as we still need to finish Biology after that, if we can't do it at 100%, then we should delay SM.

 

[Trystero]

OK - good to know. I realize every turn we shave off finishing is important, but I was getting the impression that capturing Thebes and getting to SM on the schedules proposed were critical. It's good to know I have a turn or two of wiggle room. With the AP... not so much.

 

[neilmeister]

If a Guilds or Philo trade pops up, then by all means take it.
Trade any of Engineering, Optics, Gunpowder, Astro, and once AP is 1 turn away, Theo.

Good luck!

 

[Trystero]

If a Guilds or Philo trade pops up, then by all means take it.
Trade any of Engineering, Optics, Gunpowder, Astro, and once AP is 1 turn away, Theo.

Good luck!

OK - PPP updated with these trade options.

 

[neilmeister]

We haven't had a schedule update for a bit.

SteelHorse, Revent & Deckhand are all due some turns. Did Deckhand say when in December he would become available again?

edit: not that I am trying to end your set prematurely or anything.

 

[Trystero]

SteelHorse is the active player with the least amount of turns played. I can't recall his availability ATM. Otherwise, Chris might be the next available player.

Edit: I think Revent should play some turns as well, but I can't remember his availability. I think we are getting near the end of the term, so many of the students among us might have more pressing concerns.

 

[ChrisShaffer]

I'm moving on Saturday, so not available for the next two weeks.

 

[neilmeister]

In other news, the Ducks power graph is interesting. Looks like they start building up a good 30 turns or so ahead of us and by turn 140 are well ahead of where we were. And earlier than just about anyone else. Cats and Axes for Brens??? Perhaps they are going Conquest!!!

They have submitted another turnset, and its a bit confusing.

Their score dropped 50 points, but their power isnt increasing as fast as ours did.

They are obviously whipping hard, but what?

Their power graph is about 7 turns earlier than ours was for the same amount.

Graphs just look better and better

 

[neilmeister]

A few more things (you can tell I'm bored )

- Commerce should work both PH mines, not just 1, wasn't sure if that was the plan or not.
- Trade Sally Sheep (we get 1 more next turn) for 1gpt.
- Every time one of the AI has gpt available, we want it. We have 3 spices, 1 silk, 1 gems, 1 pigs, 1 sheep, 2 corn all coming online in the next 5-10 turns.
- If they try to renegotiate trades, then do it, we want to maintain all of our current imports

 

[Trystero]

A few more things (you can tell I'm bored )

Sorry - I blame my job for my lack of Civ4 time. 6 or so hours and we should know about the AP.

- Commerce should work both PH mines, not just 1, wasn't sure if that was the plan or not.
- Trade Sally Sheep (we get 1 more next turn) for 1gpt.
- Every time one of the AI has gpt available, we want it. We have 3 spices, 1 silk, 1 gems, 1 pigs, 1 sheep, 2 corn all coming online in the next 5-10 turns.
- If they try to renegotiate trades, then do it, we want to maintain all of our current imports

Will do.

 

[Revent]

I'm not actually in education at the moment so I'm pretty free most of the time.

 

[SteelHorse]

You could sell drama now and wait until they have more money, or until one turn before they finish their current research. No need for it to be "successive turns."

Yup - Was thinking the same here. Play it by ear to maximize gold. If there is only 10 gold, and they are not completing a tech, wait a turn or two to see if it gets better.

 

[SteelHorse]

SteelHorse is the active player with the least amount of turns played. I can't recall his availability ATM. Otherwise, Chris might be the next available player.

Edit: I think Revent should play some turns as well, but I can't remember his availability. I think we are getting near the end of the term, so many of the students among us might have more pressing concerns.

Could potentially do a turnset on Saturday or late Sunday night. But that would clearly depend on whether we could get a PPP devised and agreed.

 

[neilmeister]

Qin finishes Banking in 5 turns, and he will most likely revolt to Mercantilism, costing us ~30 commerce a turn.

If we sell/gift Theology to Qin in 3 turns, when we are 1 turn from finishing it, he may revolt to Theocracy (unlikely I know), and thus delay any revolt to Merc.

Could potentially do a turnset on Saturday or late Sunday night. But that would clearly depend on whether we could get a PPP devised and agreed.

I can put a PPP together if you want, then everyone can argue about it before the weekend, so you can then play it.

edit: there will also probably be another mini-turnset from Trys before he hands over