SGOTM 23 - Turbo Ants

[Mitchum]

Bottom line: We have to DOW sooner. I'll re-work the MM without the spy in FurCity as soon as I get a chance.

To be clear, we'll still build 1 spy in CEB and take our chances on stealing Math with one chance, right?

What will you build instead of the spy in FurCity? Would the rework involve getting the galleys out sooner for an earlier DoW? Or something else?

 

[LowtherCastle]

To be clear, we'll still build 1 spy in CEB and take our chances on stealing Math with one chance, right?

What will you build instead of the spy in FurCity? Would the rework involve getting the galleys out sooner for an earlier DoW? Or something else?

Yes. The notion is one spy, sooner galleys, sooner DOW, see if we can leverage her revolt to Slavery to our advantage. It might futile with her running Rep, Thebes happy cap is 9. If she runs another artist at pop8, she could pop a GP on T70. Our best chance is to DoW T69 and hope she revolts immediately. I'm not sure we'll have the manpower to DoW on T69.

 

[Pollina]

Do we have any idea how many defenders she has in Thebes?

 

[LowtherCastle]

Do we have any idea how many defenders she has in Thebes?

Last we saw archer+2 warriors. Maybe built an archer or WC since. We'll see inside again on T65.

I'm stumped. Burnt out. Taking a break. I can come back later or hand off, as you folks wish.

 

[ZPV]

This is a tough turnset - lots of replanning the MM for uncertain outcomes. I'd say take all the time you need, unless Pollina wants to play on now.

 

[Pollina]

I don't think I'll have enough time to plan out a whole turnset this week. Take your time. There is no need to rush it.

I can try to look into some micro options tonight. Wish I wasn't so rusty. Blame Soren.

 

[LowtherCastle]

Okay. I can get 3 galleys by T67 but not 6 HAs. I liked my MM above but it's a T73 DoW which pretty much guarantees Thebes pops the GP. I think Iwas wrong about ALex losing Athens-2S2W so that's still okay. PRobably ideal is some MM in between.

So my trouble revolves around the idea that if we DoW T69 and don't land all 6 units that turn, how does that affect the Thebes builds? Hatty will likely revolt to Slavery, in fact that's the point of the DoW, but will she immediately start whipping units if we haven't threatened Thebes yet?

In other words, what do we prioritize here?
1. Easiest capture of Thebes?
2. Revolting Hatty to Slavery before Thebes pops GP?

We're so close to both...

 

[LowtherCastle]

I keep forgetting that we also need to DoW Hatty to re-capture Hagift. That 10 WarSuccess is only good for her talking in 2t. We'd need to capture a unit also forher to talk in 1t. I guess we could gift a worker in Hagift.

How would that affect her Thebes builds, if we DoW, she revolts to slavery in the IT, then we CF?

 

[Pollina]

Would it be a horrible idea to try to get her to pleased and bribe her into Slavery this turn? She might revolt back into Caste just in time for our DoW on t73.

We would have to give her both HBR and Alpha.

 

[ZPV]

Okay. I can get 3 galleys by T67 but not 6 HAs. I liked my MM above but it's a T73 DoW which pretty much guarantees Thebes pops the GP. I think Iwas wrong about ALex losing Athens-2S2W so that's still okay. PRobably ideal is some MM in between.

So my trouble revolves around the idea that if we DoW T69 and don't land all 6 units that turn, how does that affect the Thebes builds? Hatty will likely revolt to Slavery, in fact that's the point of the DoW, but will she immediately start whipping units if we haven't threatened Thebes yet?

In other words, what do we prioritize here?
1. Easiest capture of Thebes?
2. Revolting Hatty to Slavery before Thebes pops GP?

We're so close to both...

I prioritise #1. I think Thebes has a ~45% chance of building us a free wonder, and a 55% chance of settling us an artist for a free border pop. I don't think Hatty will culture bomb Thebes.
If we get it before the GP pops though, we'll just pick up whatever Alexandria gives us.

If we land some units, Thebes will whip units because it's threatened, if Hatty actually decides to revolt. She might prefer to keep pumping out artists.

 

[Mitchum]

Are you thinking about a "fake" DoW to steal Math before we can do the real DoW? I'd be inclined juts to wait until the real DoW so we can catch her during the Slavery revolt when it really matters.

 

[LowtherCastle]

My internet exploded in a storm, so I'm limited till tomorrow afternoon. Still working on ideas.

Question: if our galley is at fc 4s2e, it uses athens as closest teleport city, right?

 

[LowtherCastle]

Would it be a horrible idea to try to get her to pleased and bribe her into Slavery this turn? She might revolt back into Caste just in time for our DoW on t73.

We would have to give her both HBR and Alpha.

Are you sure about your calcs? She might even whip a settler if we're really lucky.

 

[Mitchum]

I wouldn't do it. There is no guarantee that she'll pick Slavery over Caste System. Plus with Alphabet, she could bribe other AIs to DOW us.

 

[WastinTime]

I'd be inclined juts to wait until the real DoW so we can catch her during the Slavery revolt when it really matters.

Are we all aware that she is SPI (No anarchy) ?

 

[Pollina]

Are you sure about your calcs? She might even whip a settler if we're really lucky.

I think one tech is enough to get her to pleased. But we need something else to bribe her, or have we known her long enough to beg her into Slavery?

Earliest date Hatty could revolt back into Caste is ibt t73/t74.

I wouldn't do it. There is no guarantee that she'll pick Slavery over Caste System. Plus with Alphabet, she could bribe other AIs to DOW us.

Everyone other than Sal and Gandhi hates her. And Sal and Gandhi like us too much to be bribed.

 

[Pollina]

Question: if our galley is at fc 4s2e, it uses athens as closest teleport city, right?

Only after we've captured Athens.

 

[LowtherCastle]

Only after we've captured Athens.

In my tests it seems to use athens if we have obs.

 

[WastinTime]

In my tests it seems to use athens if we have obs.

It will allow us to teleport into blue culture if we have OB, but the jump to point is not calculated using Athens. What tile are you DoWing from?

 

[WastinTime]

Took me a minute to figure out what's going on in the water north of Egypt. Seems like impossibly large expansion of borders over water. I realize that's because Alex and Joao's land are on the same landmass. It also means that Hatty is putting zero culture into the tile at Alex-3N1W. She should not own that tile, but she does only because she owns the surrounding tiles.

Not sure that helps us, but that tile would be instantly owned by anyone who settles on SpiceIsland.