[BTS] SGOTM 26 - Home Slices

[WastinTime]

we can 3-pop whip a 29/90 Library on T82.

What's the rush? Feels like 7->4 whip is better (or 8->5). So maybe we can take the Moai gold and get 29h in a library by size 7 (or size 8)

 

[Kaitzilla]

What's the rush? Feels like 7->4 whip is better (or 8->5). So maybe we can take the Moai gold and get 29h in a library by size 7 (or size 8)

Silver City grows to Size 7 and has an unhappy citizen on T84, but gems fixes it next turn and an anger also fades T85 so it is probably ok.

Ok, let's keep the workboat fail gold in Maoi then.

 

[Mitchum]

Each garrison Warrior costs +1 per turn in unit cost, so delaying producing them until we need them is a good idea unless we have iron under a city tile.

I followed your play of building a warrior in Science on T79 while Cows put its OF into the Pyramids. If we don't want/need the warrior, should we possibly put hammers into an aqueduct for eventual whipping and OF into the Hanging Gardens instead? Any other ideas.

Don't need to use the dangerous "Avoid Growth" button in Whale City

if we are working silver on Turn 79.
The city should be at 20/22 after whipping Granary.

This was more of a reminder. We won't need avoid growth on T79 (since we won't grow) or T80 (anarchy) but we will want it on T81 when we work the clams and then off on T82, right? If so, I was just putting reminders in the PPP for the future.

T75 - Trade Sheep to Sitting Bull for his Rice

We don't really have to do this since we're whipping Silver on T75 and never grow into unhealthiness, right?

 

[WastinTime]

It can't hurt to have SB's rice. He won't give it after we have rice. What if we want to give our rice to someone else.

Some of our cities can grow from size 2 to size 8 in very little time, and our warrior MP may have a long journey, so consider the travel time.

 

[Mitchum]

It can't hurt to have SB's rice. He won't give it after we have rice. What if we want to give our rice to someone else.

If we haven't traded away our only sheep to SB, we can give someone else our sheep instead of our rice.

Down the road, if things go south with SB (i.e. we're at war) and we've traded away our rice to some other AI and the deal with SB gets cancelled, we end up with sheep and no rice and lose +1 in all cities with a granary...

I'm not sure when we'll our rice connected so I'll go ahead and make the trade if everyone thinks it's a good move.

 

[Kaitzilla]

I followed your play of building a warrior in Science on T79 while Cows put its OF into the Pyramids. If we don't want/need the warrior, should we possibly put hammers into an aqueduct for eventual whipping and OF into the Hanging Gardens instead? Any other ideas.


This was more of a reminder. We won't need avoid growth on T79 (since we won't grow) or T80 (anarchy) but we will want it on T81 when we work the clams and then off on T82, right? If so, I was just putting reminders in the PPP for the future.


We don't really have to do this since we're whipping Silver on T75 and never grow into unhealthiness, right?

Warrior in Science City T79 is a great idea.

No other city except our capital can build cheap garrison units without taking hammers away from a fail gold project.

We just need 1 warrior for the capital when it reaches Size 6.
I would be happy for us to complete it T81 with bureau bonus and put the overflow into Mids T82.

I'm very torn on what our capital should build after T82 when it can't build Mids.


T81 Whale City clams + "avoid growth" does not gain us any food.
We lose 2 on T82.
The dark magic button only hurts us in Whale City this time.


The T75 Sheep for Rice trade can only benefit us.

 

[Mitchum]

T81 Whale City clams + "avoid growth" does not gain us any food.
We lose 2 on T82.
The dark magic button only hurts us in Whale City this time.

Got it. You've said that you don't fully understand the details with avoid growth. Did you somehow figure out/calculate the lost or did you play the test game out to prove whether the avoid growth helps or hurts?

 

[Mitchum]

I'm going to run through the PPP one last time in the test game right now then I'll be ready to play. It should be updated. I have a green light from LC and a greenish light from WT. Did I miss the go ahead from Kait and MG?

 

[WastinTime]

we can give someone else our sheep instead of our rice.

But! what if that someone has Sheep? But they'd like to give us copper for Rice+Deer

 

[WastinTime]

what our capital should build after T82 when it can't build Mids.

Monastery

 

[MirrorGuard]

I'm very torn on what our capital should build after T82 when it can't build Mids.

Monastery and missionary if the Holy city is not too far away from capital?
Green light

 

[Kaitzilla]

Got it. You've said that you don't fully understand the details with avoid growth. Did you somehow figure out/calculate the lost or did you play the test game out to prove whether the avoid growth helps or hurts?

I can usually simulate it quite well in my head, but when the city is growing into a food being improved or the granary is being filled 1 food short, I lose track.

The weird fringe cases stump me, and then I have to consult a test game.

Good luck playing Mitchum!
All eyes are on that Oracle and the explorers now.

 

[WastinTime]

wow. Didn't realize we were cutting CoL so close.
It feels good to know that we didn't sloppily overshoot it--meaning we coulda got more growth in our empire. Now we know we squeezed out just as much growth as we could manage. Green light.

 

[Kaitzilla]

PPP
Turn 75 to Turn 80

Continuing from MirrorGuard's Turnset

Techs
T75 - Code of Laws 100% (456 -51) +75 Code of Laws@ 0+Overflow/546
T76 - Code of Laws 100% (405 -49) +77 Code of Laws@ 185/546
T77 - Code of Laws 100% (377 -49) +75 Code of Laws@ 278/546 Note the +21 from Dun overflow
T78 - Code of Laws 100% (328 -51) +74 Code of Laws@ 369/546
T79 – Code of Laws 100% (277 -50) +72 Code of Laws@ 459/546

Workers

Rex - (Worker 1S of Science City)
T75 Complete road
T76 Move to forest at Clam City-1N2W
T77 - T79 Chop into Clam City granary
T80+ Help Shepherd fare 1E of Rice then road forest 1S1W of Rice

Cowboy - (Worker 2E of Whale City)
T75 - T78 Chop forest into Granary
T79 - T80 - Camp Silver's Deer (Kait's MM and my original plan)

Phillip - (Worker 1S1W of western Gems)
T75 Complete road
T76 Move to forest at Cows-S
T77 - T79 Chop forest into Pyramids
T80+ Fix the Deer Road

Joan Dark - (Worker 2W of Profit City)
T75 - T77 Chop forest into Oracle
T78 - Move 1N onto stone quarry then 1E onto forest and chop forest into Oracle
T79 - Board Galley at Profit-NE
T80+ - Unload at Science-4S1W then road the gems at Science-2S

Shepherd - (Worker 1N1W of Clams City)
T75 - T78 Mine forest plains hill 1N1W of Clams City
T79+ Farm Plains tile 1E of Rice then road forest 1S1W of Rice

Cities

Science
T75 - Pyramids (at 58/500); Sheep, Horse, Winefarm, Rice, Plainsfarm (fired scientists)
T76 - 1-pop Whip Dun; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm (Make sure to trade away Stone+Deer to Sitting Bull after whipping Profit City+Science City both Duns)
T77 - Pyramids (at 78/500); Sheep, Horse, Rice, Winefarm (Must pillage Deer road to get back Stone!)
T78 - Pyramids (at 196/500); Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsfarm
T79 - Warrior; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsfarm
T80 - Stop

Cows
T75 - T76 Workboat; Crab, Cow, Deer, PHFur, Tundrafur (Goes to Clams)
T77 - Granary; Crab, Cow, Deer, PHFur, Tundrafur
T78 - 2-pop Whip Granary; Crab, Cow, Deer (Will the Avoid Growth option benefit Cows when it grows??)
T79 - Pyramids; Crab, Cow, Deer (chop lands)
T80 - LH; Stop

Canal
T75 - LH; Clam, Crab, unimproved Clam, Tundraforest (11)
T76 - 2 pop Whip Lighthouse; Clam, Crab, unimproved Clam
T77 - Dun; Clam, Crab, Tundraforesthill (2)
T78 – T79 - Dun; Clam, Crab, unimproved Clam, Coast (we need the )
T80 - Stop

Silver
T75 - 2-pop Whip Lighthouse; Clam, Crab x2
T76 - Workboat; Clam, Crab x2, Silvermine
T77 - 1 pop Whip Workboat; Clam, Crab x2, Silvermine
T78 - T79 - Moai; Clam, Crab x2, Silvermine, Coast (to grow to 6 pops)
T80 - Stop

Profit
T75; Dun; Crab, Stone, Coast
T76 - 1-pop Whip Dun; Crab, Stone (Make sure to trade away Stone+Deer to Sitting Bull after whipping Profit City+Science City Both Duns)
T77 - T79 Oracle CRUCIAL BUILD; Crab, Stone
T80 - Stop

Whales
T75 - T77 Granary; Crab, Silvermine
T78 - Granary; Crab, Silvermine (Chop lands)
T79 - 1-pop Whip Granary; Silver
T80 - Stop

Clam City
T75 Monument; Clam, unimproved forest plains hill (3)
T76 1-pop Whip Monument; Clam
T77 - Granary; Clam
T78 - Granary; PHmine (Chop lands)
T79 - Granary; Clams (chop lands) (Avoid growth)
T80 - Anarchy?
T81 - Clams
T82 - Clams
T83 - Clams (Turn off avoid growth)

Units
Galley 1 (2N1E of Profit City)
T75 - Sail to Profit-NE
T76 - T78 Wait
T79 - Pick up Joan Dark and sail to mainland

Galley 2 (2S1W of Whales City)
T75 – Explore west

Warrior 2 (In Silver City)
T75+ - Garrison Silver City

Warrior 3 (1S of Science City)
T75 - Move to Gems tile 2S1W of Science City
T77 - Pillage plains hill road 1S1W of gems tile to regain Stone+Deer from Sitting Bull

Scout 1 (On Galley 2 2S1W of Whales City)
T75 - Explore the west

Chariot (In Sitting Bull's lands)
T75+ Explore Sitting Bull's lands heading south

Workboat 10 (Born in Cow City on Turn 78)
T78 - Sail for Clams

Workboat 11 (Born in Silver City on Turn 78)
T79 – Sail for Whale City to net 2nd seafood on T83

Diplomacy
Espionage on Sitting Bull
T76 - Give Stone + Deer to Sitting Bull after whipping Duns in Science and Profit City.

Stopping Points
Any World Wonder is completed by the AI
Meet a new AI
Start of Turn 80 is reached
A stack containing more than 1 Sitting Bull military unit is spotted marching towards Canal City

Notes
Save at the end of each turn
Check that and matches before pressing next turn.
Check SBs production, watch for a Settler.

The tech rate for us is really tight.

I think for Silver City T78 fur and T79 coast got us the most while still getting us Size 6 on T80.

**Edit**
Hmm, then again T78 coast and T79 fur works too, and if we have beakers to spare could work coast again T79.

Ok, PPP looks good.
Maybe we really should get rid of the Test Game after Pyramids.
It is starting to drive me crazy.

 

[MirrorGuard]

It would be best if canal is the holy city. Then we can eat wheat in ~50 turns. Otherwise 6-3 whip a library there after T80? I can't wait to see the lucky draw result.

 

[Mitchum]

The tech rate for us is really tight.

I think for Silver City T78 fur and T79 coast got us the most while still getting us Size 6 on T80.

**Edit**
Hmm, then again T78 coast and T79 fur works too, and if we have beakers to spare could work coast again T79.

Ha, I was just toying with this on my last run through. We do have food to spare and could work the fur on T78 or T79. If we do it, I'd prefer to do it on T79 if at all. It gives us just a bit of wiggle room to ensure CoL should something go wrong.

 

[Mitchum]

I can usually simulate it quite well in my head, but when the city is growing into a food being improved or the granary is being filled 1 food short, I lose track.

It won't affect this turnset but Cows finishes its granary this round. We need to figure out if the avoid growth feature helps or hurts Cows in the next round.

 

[Mitchum]

I'm going to start playing in about 10 minutes. I hope some of your can stay online in case something happens during exploration that needs input.

I'm also kinda waiting for LC to tell me that this is the most important turnset of the game...

 

[Mitchum]

Turnset Report (T75 to T80)

T75
Scout goes SE+S and sees lots of ice and two furs.
Canceled Sheep gift and traded our Sheep for SB's Rice.

Cahokia - 17
Poverty Point - 27
Mound City - 19

T76
Judaism was founded in a distant land.
Forest grows at Science-SE. This is good and bad. The bad is that now Rex can't move to the first he intended to chop into Clam City's granary.
The Scout sees iced Copper in the NW.
Gifted SB Stone+Deer after Dun whips in Science and Canal.

Cahokia - 21 +4
Poverty Point - 29 +2
Mound City - 22 +3

T77
Scout confirms that the Copper resource is stranded with no food or anything else. Just Ice, Ice, Baby.
Chariot finds more ice and more furs.

Cahokia - 25 +4
Poverty Point - 31 +2
Mound City - None - He completed something worth between 23 and 25

T78
Finally something interesting. We meet Peter's scouting WB IBT. His score is 290 (SB has 218). No alphabet. No resource trades allowed. Peter had put 5 on us IBT which implies that we're the first person he's met, yes?
OB with Peter.
Keep on SB.
As long as the Oracle isn't built in a distant land IBT when I hit end turn, it's ours!

Cahokia - None - He completed something worth between 26 and 29
Poverty Point - 33 +2
Mound City - 4

T79
The scout and galley get to the end of what looks like a 10-tile long, 3-tile wide hotdog. Next turn, the scout will likely board the galley to be taken across the strait (if we can).
Chariot spots more ice and more tundra. The land went south and then turned back to the west (i.e. left).

Cahokia - 11 (he was doing +4 turn so it looks like he's building a worker or settler.
Poverty Point - 35 +2
Mound City - 7 +3

Peter: 10 +5

T80
Confucianism is founded in Cows.
The Oracle is ours!!
The island does in fact end so the scout hopped back on the galley and can unload across the channel next turn.
The chariot finds more ice.

Cahokia - 20 +9
Poverty Point - 37 +2
Mound City - 10 +3

Peter: 15 +5

Uploading save now

The NW:

Spoiler :

The SE:

Spoiler :

 

[WastinTime]

oh boy. Copper. no food