WackenOpenAir
Deity
and my favorite would have been to set science at 0. make taxmen if needed, offer them about 900 gpt and declare imeadiately after trade.
SGOTM 9 - Wacken
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
Xevious
1 Solvalou left
From the end of my turnset posting:
I haven't opened the save yet, but we should have no trouble building TOE in Birka to coincide with the learning of Lasers so we can take Miniture and Robotics for free. From the looks of the last turnset we are probably researching rocketry or ecology, and are halfway through. If we finish that and then do nuclear and laser, that's 10 turns to mini, which should be just in time to switch to Internet in Karasjok. TOE should be started in Birka, either 6 or 7 turns before laser will finish depending on whether we have 100 uncorrupted shields there or not.
I haven't opened the save yet, but we should have no trouble building TOE in Birka to coincide with the learning of Lasers so we can take Miniture and Robotics for free. From the looks of the last turnset we are probably researching rocketry or ecology, and are halfway through. If we finish that and then do nuclear and laser, that's 10 turns to mini, which should be just in time to switch to Internet in Karasjok. TOE should be started in Birka, either 6 or 7 turns before laser will finish depending on whether we have 100 uncorrupted shields there or not.
i've read the thread...
haven't opened the save, but i think i will follow Xevious suggestion on building ToE in Birka and getting those two expensive techs for free..
other that building few extra bombers+arti i am not sure what to do other than simply dragging this game along until we get all the techs researched.
haven't opened the save, but i think i will follow Xevious suggestion on building ToE in Birka and getting those two expensive techs for free..
other that building few extra bombers+arti i am not sure what to do other than simply dragging this game along until we get all the techs researched.
WackenOpenAir
Deity
Offa said:
We certainly need 25, maybe more. I don't know about free unit support for the AI.
We need significantly more bombers than units. probably at least twice as much since they hit like half the time. So 50 might even not be enough.
Arties are for knocking down the HP's, so the bombers can do good kills.
If nothing else counts, they've not built a boat in centuries and not learnt Writing, they spent it on troops. Fact!
Why else would AlanH and company give us the option to gift a city? Of course they noticed something that was out of whack.
At least 15, probably more than 20 units are sitting there.
The arties and bombers success are quite similar, (bombers supposedly slightly better) That would give 12 hits and 6 killed per turn -> estimate?
I'm NOT a calculator!
But I want this transition to be quick and swift. 3-5 turns at the most. Really, I want one turn demolition, but we can't figure out the RNG and units in the city.
So please build some artilleries. (echo)-(echo)-(echo)
I said that from the beginning, so it's not a new theory.
If nothing else counts, they've not built a boat in centuries and not learnt Writing, they spent it on troops. Fact!
Why else would AlanH and company give us the option to gift a city? Of course they noticed something that was out of whack.
At least 15, probably more than 20 units are sitting there.
The arties and bombers success are quite similar, (bombers supposedly slightly better) That would give 12 hits and 6 killed per turn -> estimate?
I'm NOT a calculator!
But I want this transition to be quick and swift. 3-5 turns at the most. Really, I want one turn demolition, but we can't figure out the RNG and units in the city.
So please build some artilleries. (echo)-(echo)-(echo)
I said that from the beginning, so it's not a new theory.
WackenOpenAir
Deity
I'd say, base the choise between bombers and arties on shield production in cities.
bombers: (25-26)(34-39)(50-79)(100+)
arties: (20-24)(27-33)(40-49)(80-99)
Infantry and some cavs when enough of them.
bombers: (25-26)(34-39)(50-79)(100+)
arties: (20-24)(27-33)(40-49)(80-99)
Infantry and some cavs when enough of them.
Ok...
i am ready to play... finally
we have 3 turns left to research current technology. Birka can build ToE in 8 turns.
I guess i will wait 3 turns before starting ToE in Birka. This way we will lose no turns.
Also, what's wrong with starting bombing Indians now??? A single bomber has pretty good chances to kill 3hp spear in one raid. Why wait to build so many bombers? we can start cleaning Indian defences while we build them.
i'll start playing in couple of hours if someone wants to add something before that.
i am ready to play... finally
we have 3 turns left to research current technology. Birka can build ToE in 8 turns.
I guess i will wait 3 turns before starting ToE in Birka. This way we will lose no turns.
Also, what's wrong with starting bombing Indians now??? A single bomber has pretty good chances to kill 3hp spear in one raid. Why wait to build so many bombers? we can start cleaning Indian defences while we build them.
i'll start playing in couple of hours if someone wants to add something before that.
.here is my report:
pre-turn: all i needed to do is move one citizen in birka and ToE will be built in 7 turns.... just right to align with research. Started air attacks on Delhi. Killed 8 units in first wave and also 3 citizen.
Delhi cits on top of iron, so after clearing first spearmen it looks like the have bunch of swords built.
T1. 1255AD. Killed 5 more Delhi defenders. Switched Trodheim to SETI. We want to make sure all the wonders are built we don't want India wasting time on building wonders.
IBT. Spanish built Magellan's
T2, 1260AD. Killed 6 more and finally uncovered wounded units... They probably have 6 or 7 in the capital that is it.
t3. 1265AD. Delhi is left with one wounded sword and i stopped the air attacks. Ecology researched-rocketry in 4 and so it ToE.
IBT. Spanish are building ToE
t4. 1270AD
T5. 1275ad... finally something happened - pollution...
t6. 1280ad..
t7. 1285ad. oh well. ToE completed. I took Miniaturization and Space Flight as free techs. switched to Nuclear power in 4 turns. Switched Karasjok from palace to internet in 5 turns. Started Manhattan project in Birka. Started offshore platforms in few cities. Those are really cheap for us.
Ghandi built his first spearman since air attacks.
I feel like i didn't do everything properly with regard of ToE and the free techs i was supposed to get... so please don't get too mad at me.
t8. 1290ad.
IBT. Lux trade with Spain expired. I decided not to renew at this point. Will leave it for the next player to decide. Otherwise we might just want bomb spain to the ground.
t9 1295ad.
T10. 1300ad... pollution hit us.
Post-turn: i doubt indians have more than 2 units in Delhi at the moment...
I almost quit building Bombers and were somewhat improvising on product builds... so we have now offshore platforms in coastal cities that use sea tiles, some tanks, few arty etc...
pre-turn: all i needed to do is move one citizen in birka and ToE will be built in 7 turns.... just right to align with research. Started air attacks on Delhi. Killed 8 units in first wave and also 3 citizen.
Delhi cits on top of iron, so after clearing first spearmen it looks like the have bunch of swords built.
T1. 1255AD. Killed 5 more Delhi defenders. Switched Trodheim to SETI. We want to make sure all the wonders are built we don't want India wasting time on building wonders.
IBT. Spanish built Magellan's
T2, 1260AD. Killed 6 more and finally uncovered wounded units... They probably have 6 or 7 in the capital that is it.
t3. 1265AD. Delhi is left with one wounded sword and i stopped the air attacks. Ecology researched-rocketry in 4 and so it ToE.
IBT. Spanish are building ToE
t4. 1270AD
T5. 1275ad... finally something happened - pollution...
t6. 1280ad..
t7. 1285ad. oh well. ToE completed. I took Miniaturization and Space Flight as free techs. switched to Nuclear power in 4 turns. Switched Karasjok from palace to internet in 5 turns. Started Manhattan project in Birka. Started offshore platforms in few cities. Those are really cheap for us.
Ghandi built his first spearman since air attacks.
I feel like i didn't do everything properly with regard of ToE and the free techs i was supposed to get... so please don't get too mad at me.
t8. 1290ad.
IBT. Lux trade with Spain expired. I decided not to renew at this point. Will leave it for the next player to decide. Otherwise we might just want bomb spain to the ground.
t9 1295ad.
T10. 1300ad... pollution hit us.
Post-turn: i doubt indians have more than 2 units in Delhi at the moment...
I almost quit building Bombers and were somewhat improvising on product builds... so we have now offshore platforms in coastal cities that use sea tiles, some tanks, few arty etc...
WackenOpenAir
Deity
Ah, nice, the units are killed already. I didn't expect them to be regulars. Just keep their unit count down now.
I think it is now a good time to take a little break and look things over carefully. We now need to plan our end game properly. I just came home from the casino for another good night of poker
and will have a look at the game tomorrow.
I think it is now a good time to take a little break and look things over carefully. We now need to plan our end game properly. I just came home from the casino for another good night of poker
and will have a look at the game tomorrow.OK, just one question. Why ToE at this stage? Wasn't the plan to wait until we had lined up the two most expensive techs? But you switched to it right away, so out of the blue I have no clue as to why it happened... No critizism just a question as to why.
Well done on reducing the Indians though...
Well done on reducing the Indians though...
i reckon the last Xevious post put me on the course on bulding ToE.. and also the fact i was offline for longer that i should have 
However Birka was never building SETI. When i started it was switched to airport with 0 shields invested.
Also, Trodheim is much better place for SETI since it already has science wonders. So i started SETI there.
We will have internet in 5 turns built and i think we should be very careful at that point not to win domination game with all the free culture labs provide.
We are at 65 now. We might have destroy some of our cities after internet is built. The reason i started internet so indians don't waste time on building that wonder once they have all the techs.
Also we might want to give them 1st land city before we have all the techs available. That will allow them to build some units by the time we ready to give them the rest and less time will be wasted.
I am not sure if the trick with involvin ottomans in gifting them city to be captured by india is good. It is quite risky actually.
First, when city goes from one hand to another some of the buildings are lost in addition to cultural ones. Having our cities going trough double hands might make it worse.
Second, Ottomans would simply conscript infantry in cities we gift them and india will never be able to take it from them. Wacken, have you thought about this fact alone? i assume Osman knows nationalism that is.
However Birka was never building SETI. When i started it was switched to airport with 0 shields invested.
Also, Trodheim is much better place for SETI since it already has science wonders. So i started SETI there.
We will have internet in 5 turns built and i think we should be very careful at that point not to win domination game with all the free culture labs provide.
We are at 65 now. We might have destroy some of our cities after internet is built. The reason i started internet so indians don't waste time on building that wonder once they have all the techs.
Also we might want to give them 1st land city before we have all the techs available. That will allow them to build some units by the time we ready to give them the rest and less time will be wasted.
I am not sure if the trick with involvin ottomans in gifting them city to be captured by india is good. It is quite risky actually.
First, when city goes from one hand to another some of the buildings are lost in addition to cultural ones. Having our cities going trough double hands might make it worse.
Second, Ottomans would simply conscript infantry in cities we gift them and india will never be able to take it from them. Wacken, have you thought about this fact alone? i assume Osman knows nationalism that is.
Xevious
1 Solvalou left
In my defense, my post does say to coincide TOE with the discovery of Lasers. But in any case, we SEEM to be ahead of they who shall not be mentioned.
As for gifting cities, NO buildings are lost when gifting a city. I tested that out due to some earlier posts in this thread. You don't even lose buildings that you can't build yet.
Agree that we may have to raze a few cities. Keeping a careful eye on the F5 screen should help there.
As for gifting cities, NO buildings are lost when gifting a city. I tested that out due to some earlier posts in this thread. You don't even lose buildings that you can't build yet.
Agree that we may have to raze a few cities. Keeping a careful eye on the F5 screen should help there.
WackenOpenAir
Deity
Ottomans do not know nationalism. Buildings are not lost in a gifting, so that is no risk there.
Unfortunately, i can't manage to think more thoroughly about civ now. My mind is too much on full time poker
So just some random things now:
Ottomans are willing to give a bunch of gpt for tech.
We indeed seem to be ahead on the other teams quite a bit.
We should gift one city earlier. (reykjavik 5 turns from now)
Other than that, i see few goals:
-Build a bunch of units to survive later when we have no core.
-Build any buildings we can to reduce the build options for India.
-Gather cash to use rushbuilds later in our new capital wherever it is gonna be.
I think we should not care very much about our empire after the gifting, but we might want to make some small plans.
-On what continent do we want our new capital (likely candidates seem New York or Batsjford)
I think we want to "gift" India up to Karasjok and Odense. Alesund and Hippo can be our defence points. We might want to bulid a fortress next to Alesund in preparation of this defence point.
We want them to build elephants.
They need oslo to build elephants.
We do not want Oslo to be the first city they capture, they should first have a little time to build only cheap units to speed up their conquest. We can however make oslo be the 4th or 5th or so city they conquer.
Oil is underneath Birka.
rubber is near Oslo.
Horses near Oslo.
Salpeter they get with Stavanger.
However, while we could influence these resources to deny them certain units, they will always be able to build Guerilla's instead of elephants. As long as they didn't have a golden age, they will retain the abillity to build elephants. We have to hope that they will do so.
It is possible that the AI decides to build units in each category like attackers and defenders seperatly. In that case, it could be usefull to disconnect horses and rubber so that they will not be able to build other fast moving attackers than elephants.
We must retreat our warriors northwards imeadiately. !
Take that money from the ottomans or any other penny you can get.
India will be a monster after they captured our core, we want a bunch of mech infantry and modern armor to keep them at bay. (as well as the bombers we have of course)
We may also want to pillage a line in what is to be their side of the border to stop their fast movers from advancing to us to fast. This will help our bombers to do efficient defence.
Reykjavik is the city we will gift them.
Build Granary, and courthouse there now before gifting it. Temple has no use as it will be lost anyway.
They will have nothing to build there but units and a temple. probably 2 turns per unit and 3 turns for the temple. We want them to build 6 or so units, so that takes them 15 turns total. We should gift reykjavik 5 turns from now.
Gifting reykjavik will cost us 55 science per turn.
There are a few options to micro manage more science by using more sea tiles instead of land tiles.
We can also go on food shortage in some of the ICS cities if needed. Still, we are probably gonna have 1 or 2 five turn researches.
Unfortunately, i can't manage to think more thoroughly about civ now. My mind is too much on full time poker
So just some random things now:
Ottomans are willing to give a bunch of gpt for tech.
We indeed seem to be ahead on the other teams quite a bit.
We should gift one city earlier. (reykjavik 5 turns from now)
Other than that, i see few goals:
-Build a bunch of units to survive later when we have no core.
-Build any buildings we can to reduce the build options for India.
-Gather cash to use rushbuilds later in our new capital wherever it is gonna be.
I think we should not care very much about our empire after the gifting, but we might want to make some small plans.
-On what continent do we want our new capital (likely candidates seem New York or Batsjford)
I think we want to "gift" India up to Karasjok and Odense. Alesund and Hippo can be our defence points. We might want to bulid a fortress next to Alesund in preparation of this defence point.
We want them to build elephants.
They need oslo to build elephants.
We do not want Oslo to be the first city they capture, they should first have a little time to build only cheap units to speed up their conquest. We can however make oslo be the 4th or 5th or so city they conquer.
Oil is underneath Birka.
rubber is near Oslo.
Horses near Oslo.
Salpeter they get with Stavanger.
However, while we could influence these resources to deny them certain units, they will always be able to build Guerilla's instead of elephants. As long as they didn't have a golden age, they will retain the abillity to build elephants. We have to hope that they will do so.
It is possible that the AI decides to build units in each category like attackers and defenders seperatly. In that case, it could be usefull to disconnect horses and rubber so that they will not be able to build other fast moving attackers than elephants.
We must retreat our warriors northwards imeadiately. !
Take that money from the ottomans or any other penny you can get.
India will be a monster after they captured our core, we want a bunch of mech infantry and modern armor to keep them at bay. (as well as the bombers we have of course)
We may also want to pillage a line in what is to be their side of the border to stop their fast movers from advancing to us to fast. This will help our bombers to do efficient defence.
Reykjavik is the city we will gift them.
Build Granary, and courthouse there now before gifting it. Temple has no use as it will be lost anyway.
They will have nothing to build there but units and a temple. probably 2 turns per unit and 3 turns for the temple. We want them to build 6 or so units, so that takes them 15 turns total. We should gift reykjavik 5 turns from now.
Gifting reykjavik will cost us 55 science per turn.
There are a few options to micro manage more science by using more sea tiles instead of land tiles.
We can also go on food shortage in some of the ICS cities if needed. Still, we are probably gonna have 1 or 2 five turn researches.
How is the poker going Wacken? Booked a one way ticket to Vegas yet?
Should we build Apollo now: eg if we do and the town is "captured" can we continue building parts.
I see a Manhattan Project build going: this isn't good, is it?
Should we build Apollo now: eg if we do and the town is "captured" can we continue building parts.
I see a Manhattan Project build going: this isn't good, is it?
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